To believe kids are equal to adults

[DragonMummy1418]

They deserve the same treatment.
Their feelings are just as important as adults.

My parents told me that our home was a dictatorship not a democracy growing up and made me feel that my thoughts and opinions were not important or valid.
If it's something they can have a say in safely then I let my dc help make choices.

I went food shopping with my mother (who I am LC with) and 3.5 yr old DS today and she was appalled that I was letting my DS have a say in what we bought.
Don't get me wrong, I'm not letting him fill the trolly with ice cream and sweets but when it comes to a choice of which meat or which vegetables etc then I'm happy to let him pick what he likes and I know he will eat.

My mother was horrified when I said that I value DS's feelings and thoughts on the same level as my DH or hers (probably more than hers, lol).

I genuinely prefer the company of my child to a lot of adults I know.

I cook different meals as did and I have totally different taste in food. I love spicy veggie food and dd likes meat,veg potatoes...hates spice.
It wouldn't be fair to get in a battle over it. Plus I'm on a diet and dd isn't.

Also I don't want to eat bland food for the next few years nor does dd want to eat spice. No biggie.

Sounds fine to me. We were always allowed some choice in food shopping when kids and it helped us to know what to buy when we left home. however my dad and sister were not allowed to shop together alone after they went and spent twice as much because neither could say be don't need this to the others off list suggestions

Malificent. Some nights I agree, no biggie. Other nights, having several meals just isn't an option. If I left the house at 8, having spent the previous hour and more getting myself ready for work and the kids ready for school, then worked all day (often without a lunch break, because of the nature of the work), then driven halfway round the county collecting the kids from the various people they've gone home with, and finally walked in at 6.30/7.00, shattered, the last thing I want to do is cook 2 meals while also organising bath/bed/stories/packed lunch ready for the next day etc etc. One meal often feels like too much!

I sound like a horrible parent. I'm not, honest. I do ask my kids if there's a meal they really want and try and incorporate it into the weeks plan.
But I plan every meal according to budget, who is doing what after school club, what my hours are at work, (all of which affect how long I have to actually cook the meal), and whether I can get to a shop to pick up fresh ingredients. So meals with lots of veg that need to be fresh are closer to shop day than, say, spag bol, which would happen later in the week. All meat gets bought in one go and frozen so I don't decide to cook something and then get home and realise Howe don't have it in (we live very rurally, popping out is a major expedition taking a round trip of around 45 minutes, my shopping is always planned).
My kids don't have any of those things in their heads when they ask for things.
I do know what they like and don't like and take those things into account but they cannot make those decisions on an equal basis with me.

My feeling is there are decisions they can make and I will give them free rein on them. There are decisions they can make after I've given them some choices first. There are decisions they can have input into, either all the time or sometimes. There are decisions that they cannot have any input into at all. Even if it affects them.
But I will always put them at the heart of any decision I make.

You sound like a great Mum OP. Your son is much more likely to have a good respectful relationship with you as he gets older because he knows that you value his thoughts and opinions. :) Carry on being awesome.

I think it is lovely that you include your child on these things. Hopefully will open the door to better communication later in life as they feel valued. I wish i had the patience to do this when shopping with mine. Its normally get in and out as quick as i can and 'no, i am not buying chocolate cakes today'.

No you’re (in my view at least) completely right.
I think it comes from some of us having childhoods where our views were not listened to or taken on board.

It sounds like you have a wonderful relationship but please don’t lose sight of the fact that children need to know their parents are in control, his say will be accounted for, but it’s not necessarily going to be the be all and end all.

Hope that doesn’t sound like I’m being nasty. I can genuinely see what you’re doing

I feel the same way OP. There is another thread here that is upsetting to read because it smacks of not listening to a kid, not treating them equalling. Most people dont' seem to get it though. Kids having a voice equal to their parents is SO important in my view.

The number of examples of abusive parenting on this thread is unreal. Sad. calf*

I know. it makes me so so sad. there is another thread running about some poor kid being punished for not picking up their toys.

It just makes me sad and raging actually that parents can't treat their kids with respect. its actually far more fun to parent that way.

So depressing.

I love this site - www.theevolvedmind.com.au

and this www.joyfullyrejoycing.com. I just think maybe parents are being socialised that being controlling IS good parenting. And

sorry posted too soon. there are a wealth of sites and books supporting treating kids as equals, not punishing etc. just don't understand why these ideas are mainstream yet.

It just makes me sad and raging actually that parents can't treat their kids with respect. its actually far more fun to parent that way

Christ, smug parenting at its finest. You know everywhere you go people are doing this face all around you, yes?

abusive for giving a child rules, boundaries and care. WTF organic hemp are you smoking?

This sounds like the lunatics taking over the asylum.

Children need boundaries. Because they are... children.

Giving constant choices to a 3-year-old would make them confused and irritable, and potentially a little tyrant when encountering a life situation where they were unable to enter into a debate about whether they could sit down or stand up or not touch.

No one here is advocating draconian parenting, but letting small children rule the roost results in bolshy big children, and that's infinitely harder to deal with.

And, regarding unschooling, that's all very well for a few children, but don't forget there are quite a few good memories and shared jokes about schooldays. Yesterday dd and her friend were squealing with laughter about Mr So and So's green trousers.

Woah! I was with some of offred’s comments but that site is awful. “Unschooling” (which I gather is somewhat different to home schooling) sounds seriously detrimental to a child’s wellbeing. A quote:

“So if I pull together a unit study when he shows an interest and lead the learning is this still unschooling?

The short answer would be if the child can say "No thanks, I'd rather go watch TV" and you be perfectly okay with that despite all the work you did then it's unschooling.”

Sorry, but any parent who home schools their children and is happy for them just to run off and watch TV instead of learning needs to take a good long look at themselves.

I believe children need to be treated with respect and given choices but how is it respectful to not even teach them to read or do maths? They need to go out into the real world one day. They need to be able to fill in forms, open a bank account, rent a house, pay bills. They won’t learn that if they just wander off and watch TV whenever they like. Memorising times tables was incredibly boring but it’s one of the things I use almost every day of my life. What kind of parent would deny their child such basic and necessary information?

ITs not respectful. It's neglectful. If you let your kids watch tv and not learn to read because they don't choose to, if you let them eat ice cream for dinner because that is their choice, you are a neglectful parent.

There’s a balance to be had. Totally agree with IrmaFaye insofar as giving a 3 year old constant choices would make them irritable and grumpy. They need boundaries.

In the example of the chocolate cake at the supermarket there are some parents that might let them have it out of ‘respect for their choice’ and others who will just say ‘no’ because they want to get out.

To my mind, a balance of acknowledging the kids feelings and staying in control is the key. So listen, acknowledge their input and explain why you came to the decision you did. As long as kids know you are listening and making decisions in their best interests, even when it doesn’t go their way, you are treating them as ‘equals’ but not as the ‘same’, which is an important distinction.

I believe children need to be treated with respect and given choices but how is it respectful to not even teach them to read or do maths? They need to go out into the real world one day. They need to be able to fill in forms, open a bank account, rent a house, pay bills. They won’t learn that if they just wander off and watch TV whenever they like. Memorising times tables was incredibly boring but it’s one of the things I use almost every day of my life. What kind of parent would deny their child such basic and necessary information? Iwasjustabouttosaythat

I unschooled all four of my kids and they can do all those things and more. Weird huh. I guess I'm just smug and neglectful. Righto.

Agree wholeheartedly with TeasndToast - in our house it goes like this....listening, acknowledgement of what DC are saying, debating and explaining why you (as the parent) decide upon a course of action. It works well because it encourages the exploration of feelings and opinions - and also the importance of boundaries. It strengthens their reasoning abilities too, and promotes empathy imo....
I often hear my older DC explaining to their younger siblings why certain ‘rules’ are in place - ie: not touching the AGA, not bothering the dog while she’s sleeping etc

Just to add...once, we’ve debated why certain boundaries are in place, it’s generally accepted and we move on - we don’t spend hours arguing endlessly over the same issues. We have certain boundaries that are non negotiable - for safety or kindness issues. That’s it.
Children, imo, respond well to rules/boundaries being explained to them - I think just saying “no” over and over, and “because i’m The parent and I say so” is really lazy parenting.

A visiting young “free spirit” tried to yank a very heavy mirror off the wall. I didn’t have time to debate the physics of object of heavy mass descending from wall nor properties of shards of glass. I just roared, “NOOOOOO!!!!”

A visiting young “free spirit” tried to yank a very heavy mirror off the wall.

Well obviously there are exceptions!

Irma Some children over the baby stage would simply never do that or similar. Neither of my DC ever once pulled at anything....when they were crawling they might have of course.

But once they'd reached the age of 3 they were sensible. I suspect that's luck though. Some kids do things which make you think "WHY would you do that!!?" and others don't. That's nothing to do with letting them discuss things or not.

I've never punished mine...mine have always been brought up similarly to Teas