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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Am I being unreasonable to be angry with my son’s uni tutors?

347 replies

Ladymacbethshandwash · 18/05/2018 17:04

My 18 year old son is coming to the end of his first year of a performing arts degree. Since he was a little boy he wanted to become an actor so this was the natural route for him to take.

He has struggled with certain aspects of the course, namely the movement side as he is 6 foot 3 and as graceful as bambi on ice. He has failed his two movement assessments and passed his acting assessments. Today at his end of year tutorial his tutors told him he will never make it as an actor. They bluntly destroyed his dreams and sent him on his way. My 18 year old son is away from home, distraught because in his opinion his dream is over, his life is finished. He won’t come home and he doesn’t want to speak to me. Why oh why could they have not been a little more careful about the language they used? I know I’m his Mum, so I am obviously biased but he does have something, he’s funny, confident, handsome and he does have acting ability. Unfortunately he doesn’t believe this now, he’s so low I don’t know what to do.

OP posts:
Ruffian · 18/05/2018 23:50

I think keeping his mouth shut would be the wrong lesson to learn from this.

Niskasrevenge · 18/05/2018 23:52

I’m really sorry your son is having a tough time OP.

Obviously we on here can’t know whether he has the talent, and will push through, against the odds and prove them wrong, or whether another career plan might be better for him.

However, to the PP who wrote the the tutor’s words are: “only some idiot's opinion..” No, dear, that’s a professional’s considered opinion, harsh or not. You’re the sort of person who has “had enough of experts”, aren’t you?

5LeafClover · 19/05/2018 00:35

I agree with snotgobbler99, if they said he was 'probably dyspraxic' without further follow up that is appalling. I am not sure what the consider your place on the course email means either, surely you either pass and progress or don't pass in which case no consideration on his part is needed? Poor lad and unmumsnetty hug to you too op. I hope he gets back in touch with you for support soon and it's not too late for him to get feedback and pass the year.

Puffycat · 19/05/2018 00:44

When you say “sent him on his way” do you mean they slung him out?
If so there’re more to it than that, if you meant that after the 1st year of a degree they are saying that he really needs to work harder on his movement skills, that’s very different.
I have a performing arts degree, and yes, it’s bloody hard. And not everyone is good at all parts of the course.
Basically, has he been chucked out? Or is he feeling like shite cos someone told him he’s not shit hot?
Thick skin needed in ‘the biz’

crunchymint · 19/05/2018 00:49

This is an article that explains the importance of movement classes to acting.

www.theguardian.com/stage/2009/may/09/jackie-snow-movement-exercises-actors

I suspect his lack of understanding of why he has to do movement classes is not helping him. If he threw himself into it, it may have had a very different outcome. No one can be okay at something if they do it reluctantly after questioning what is the point.

crunchymint · 19/05/2018 00:53

In this article successful actors are talking about their training, some of whom questioned the value of movement classes when training, but all say they now realise how they have helped them.

www.backstage.com/news/successful-actors-talk-about-their-training/

I know it is part of being young, but sometimes the natural arrogance of youth means that we don't recognise the truth of what tutors are telling us i.e. that movement classes can really help.

justilou1 · 19/05/2018 01:10

I am an opera singer. I have sung all around the world. We have a saying that goes like this...
“If you can... you do.
If you can’t... you teach.”
Maybe that will make him feel better.
A lot of academics in “creative” fields are very, very bitter.

Tatiannatomasina · 19/05/2018 01:34

Hopefully in time he will either become even more determind to prove them wrong and succeed or life will take him down another route. I was told i would not achieve my dream career as i did not have the right attributes. It made me cry then i got mad, really mad. I got the job at my first attempt. Keep reaching out, if possible can you go and visit him and let him know, this is just a setback, its not the end.

mathanxiety · 19/05/2018 02:15

Does he tend to shoot from the lip, Ladymacbeth?

Does he convey resistance to getting out of his comfort zone either by speech or (oh the irony) body language?

You mention how effective he is at a stand up routine - the sort of person who can do stand up is likely to be someone who uses humour as a weapon, or as a means of approaching emotion while at the same time not 'doing' emotion - in general as a foil.

Is the dry, analytical cloak/mask there for similar reasons - to keep him from engaging emotionally?

Italiangreyhound · 19/05/2018 02:16

Sorry to hear this @Ladymacbethshandwash

I hope he will be OK.

I think that really great actors are sometimes quirky and unusual and different. I am not sure what they teach in university that makes people great at acting. I love Harrison Ford and I think he was a carpenter who was picked off a set where he was working (as a carpenter) and became an actor.

I guess what i am saying is your son may well go far. YANBU either.

www.cbr.com/movie-legends-revealed-how-did-harrison-ford-accidentally-audition-for-star-wars/

(And Ford is just over 6 foot tall!)

Italiangreyhound · 19/05/2018 02:17

(Ford did want to be an actor but he was also a carpenter.)

Graphista · 19/05/2018 04:19

YAB ridiculous! It's a HUGELY competitive industry where he will be told MUCH more harsh comments at auditions. If he can't cope with that he's not cut out for it. There are thousands if not millions of talented actors who never get more than bit parts/extras work.

It sounds like you have built him up to believe he WILL be successful/famous/'make it' when it would have been far more sensible to encourage BUT in a realistic way. So that he was prepared.

A friend of mines' daughter is STARTING to find success in acting. By which I mean leading roles in smaller productions, supporting roles in larger productions in New York, roles on commercials, small but speaking roles in well known tv shows in USA. She's mid twenties and has been performing since her early teens, been to drama school and sensibly trained in a behind the scenes craft which allowed her to stay in the industry (and make connections) even if she weren't getting acting jobs.

She's had auditions where she hasn't even had a chance to utter a word and...

"Nope next!"
"Stands wrong next!"
"Too short next!"

Then there's all the criticism of how she's portrayed the parts - but not every actor is suitable for every part.

But only her and 2 others from her cohort in drama school have had ANY real noticeable success. The rest are working behind the scenes, doing extras work or (and this is seen as doing quite well) are 'jobbing' actors getting regular but not big parts on well known tv shows and in theatre.

Go look on IMDb, even very famous actors have a long list of much smaller parts before AND AFTER becoming famous, because they know that's the reality. And they sensibly know 'bills need paid' that's real life.

Can I ask why he hasn't seemingly done much toward "his dream" before now? Most wanting to act have been involved in extra curricular drama classes, dance and voice coaching, lots of auditions for other parts (and would know if they were any good) way before 18. - I wrote that before reading about his auditions etc. Did the fact that he rarely was chosen not show him or you he was unlikely to succeed in this area? Did he work on any feedback he was given indicating the areas he wasn't up to scratch in?

There's a difference between not standing in the way of his dream and giving him false hope.

If they're asking him to reconsider rather than kicking him off, that makes me think more lack of effort than lack of ability. Which comes back to what EXACTLY was he told? Was he recommended to do something that would help this aspect and he hasn't done it?

"He also finds certain things really cringey" that's WHY they do these exercises to remove their being overly self conscious. Let's face it many acting jobs are faintly ridiculous (action movies, medical dramas, fantasy genres, hell Shakespeare where you might end up playing a tree or a fawn!) they need to be able to set that self consciousness aside to do the job. It's also so they connect mind and body properly, a real awareness of how their body moves. Plus so they can manage movement directions AND remembering lines.

"quite dry and analytical so he has questioned some aspects of the course." Questioned or criticised in a way as if he knows better? The latter REALLY doesn't go down well from 1st years on any course.

Lee Evans actually works very hard on the physical aspect of his performances so while it may LOOK clumsy, ungainly it is STUDIOUSLY so.

I think your idea of taking a year out is good BUT I think only going on a load of auditions will NOT address the issue.

Being able to use your body to express the character of the part you're playing is essential. He needs to be able to make his body do what he needs it to. He also needs to be able to move about a small stage in such a way as he's not disturbing props or putting other actors out of sync. If he can't even hit a mark consistently or move between marks he can't do the job.

As for "loads of actors didn't go to drama school" just not true. Most successful actors have at the very least performed in highly regarded amateur performances/clubs (eg footlights) but a huge number, even those from acting families have been to Rada, lamda, Italia conti, Yale school of drama Juilliard etc.

"Similarly, being under 5'6" didn't stop Wayne Sleep succeeding as a dancer..." Sorry that's nonsense dancers ARE small he'd have had less success if taller.

All the famous tall actors people are mentioning actually DO know very well how to control their bodies. Where they have done 'funny' or unusual movements that HAS been part of the character they were portraying and actually likely took a lot of experiment and rehearsal! Missing the point op's sons Tutors are making completely.

Plus in some cases they've been LUCKY to find a niche that coincided with a zeitgeist moment. Eg can you imagine John Cleese ever playing a serious romantic lead? Or Stephen merchant for that matter? Or playing a genuine detective role like morse? There's an awful lot of luck involved. Such that there are even actors who are very successful in one particular role and then never again after, kind of like acting one hit wonders. Like Jason Biggs, Mark Hamill, Ralph Macchio

"Big fish, small pond sort of situation." Exactly.

"The OP telling her son that it’s actually the tutors’ fault anyway because they didn’t teach him right is not going to help him to take responsibility for his own learning and development." Definitely agree with this.

"that is down to his physicality not the teaching" not necessarily if he's not been working sufficiently on this aspect. There are lots of tall, long limbed actors several have been mentioned here BUT they learned to control their movement and even use that to their advantage. There's a danger if you're saying things like this to your son that he'll think nothing can change so there's no point him making an effort with that skill.

"You are placing too much emphasis on how the tutors are awful and how even him failing assessments isn't his fault it's just because he's tall." Absolutely agree with this. Don't encourage him to deny or deflect it won't help him.

In addition to pps saying he's probably misreporting what exactly was said (either deliberately or clouded by emotion) I'm also sceptical that this is the first time he's been told he's struggling in a particular area. Uni's don't want failures at any stage so I think it's likely he was told, probably on several occasions, to work on X and hasn't done it and then failed the connected modules. That's on him.

(That story about Harrison ford is a myth btw he'd started acting at uni and had been acting and auditioning for a good decade before Star Wars.)

Ladywillpower · 19/05/2018 05:35

As a university tutor I suspect there is more to this than your son has told you. I teach on a vocational course preparing students to go into a highly competitive profession & we are required to give regular feedback.
I would be very surprised if this very negative feedback has come completely out of the blue & would imagine that more subtle feedback has been given previously which your son has not taken on board, hence the rather brutal comment!
If these modules are an integral part of the course (& in future the job) & he feels that they are "cringey" & cannot put in the effort to pass them then they may well be right & it is not the career for him.
I do sympathise OP. I hope your son contacts you soon & manages to put this behind him. The year out sounds like a good idea.

seventh · 19/05/2018 05:49

You aren't being unreasonable -- youre being way too protective

If he's not good enough for this hugely competitive industry and can't cope with being told, then he is definitely NOT right for the industry

He's a special snowflake who really needs to grow a pair - sorry if that's too harsh for you, but imo it's true

NotInGuatemalaNowDrRopata · 19/05/2018 05:54

And you're being way too nasty, seventh

LadyWithLapdog · 19/05/2018 05:57

Seventh - completely uncalled for.

ThenCameTheFools · 19/05/2018 06:04

Justilou, that's not an.opera singer quote. It's a smug twat quote.

I think a lot of what the OP's son has been through, and a lot of the replies, are veering off into a pretty useless anecdotal reverie about actors who made it against the odds, when sadly, the crux is: he's at university, on a course, and appears not to be performing (excuse the pun) well enough to fulfil the criteria of the requirements of that course. It could be maths, it could be law, it could be performing arts.

What's happening is he's probably failing his year. He needs to talk, with those incompetent professionals, and find out his options and whether or not he still has any, in that particular context. Will he be good enough at any point or is it time to.change path now. NOT good enough to be sn actor, good enough to pass his course.

Quantumblue · 19/05/2018 06:08

Can you encourage him to access the counseling service at uni? I can understand you must be very anxious if he is so distressed and far away.

Fflamingo · 19/05/2018 06:10

He needs to speak to them again when he is feeling more resilient to find out the detail, some tall people do make it. I would have thought he could improve movement skills like everything you practise. But perhaps there is some sideways move he could make into some other aspect of film making or writing.

DunedinGirl · 19/05/2018 06:10

Speaking as a professional performing artist, I have to say lots of people who end up actors are awkward movers and actors at 18. It is a learning process. Acting and movement are skills. Some people are innately talented, but most, including people who get very far in their profession, have to work very hard to overcome awkwardness. There are also a lot of massive dicks in the business who think it is their job to break people down. Perhaps he needs to find a nicer place to learn.

DunedinGirl · 19/05/2018 06:10

Speaking as a professional performing artist, I have to say lots of people who end up actors are awkward movers and actors at 18. It is a learning process. Acting and movement are skills. Some people are innately talented, but most, including people who get very far in their profession, have to work very hard to overcome awkwardness. There are also a lot of massive dicks in the business who think it is their job to break people down. Perhaps he needs to find a nicer place to learn.

youarenotkiddingme · 19/05/2018 06:20

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

Urbanbeetler · 19/05/2018 06:32

If he hasn’t made progress in a year at a highly competitive drama school where initial potential was spotted at admissions audition, then he is wasting his time and money staying there. They’re right.

Whether he has a future as an performer is irrelevant - based on his performance there, he isn’t progressing. Their job is to teach him and he isn’t being ‘teachable’ - it would be easy for them to keep him (and his money - you can’t fill a once coveted place a year into a degree) and have him fail after 3 years instead of one but what’s the point? He hasn’t made the grade there, his attitude hasn’t been right for that training by your own admission and he hasn’t progressed. If he doesn’t scrape through to the next level and use this to change the way he views his training to begin progressing, then he’s better off doing a different course. How he takes that forward is up to him.

It is a very tough industry and no one will sugarcoat his rejections. Help him pick himself up and plan the next move - but don’t encourage him to blame the tutors. He can call them dicks and move on with resilience - but in the end they are only doing their jobs.

artggghhh · 19/05/2018 07:23

Yy maisy and graphista.

Also, as someone who works in a uni, I'm seeing where some of the entitled attitudes and lack of resilience come from. This is partly why there is a mammoth spike in mental health issues like depression and anxiety across all universities.

"Believe in your dreams, do whatever you want, demand retakes, parents will pay for extra classes, only exam results and careers matter and you're paying to get those, so those tutors are so mean for not sugarcoating something when you fail. Why didn't they hold your hand and put you into counselling after an exam fail, how dare they upset you! Also, universities are effectively stealing large amounts of students' money but if they do warn them they're in the wrong path, they're vindictive bullies." Confused

We are raising some very messed-up, over sheltered next generations who can't handle life.

boilerhouse2007 · 19/05/2018 07:30

'' It really isn't a 'career' for all but the fewest of lucky ones.''

Alot of acting and making it is not down to luck but down to contacts-who you know.

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