Men wanting to be Women

[bert3400]

To think transgender women really have no idea what being a women is ? . Maybe it's time we had a 3rd Gender . Be interested in hearing what real women & transwomen feel ?

How would that happen 20pence, being a woman or man, is more than outward appearance, it is about genetics, for fragile X to be eradicated, there needs to be more research into it, and mabey altering genetic codes in some way.

I've read many of these treads and my view is that trans women/ trans men are just that. A trans woman isn't a biological woman, but neither are they a man, they are a trans woman. They are not living a typical male/female experience, theirs is unique.

@rosy I certainly won’t fight against them. I will fight against bigotry .....and in my view, that’s you

Strong, you have nothing to back up your view. Literally nothing.

There is no amount of intervention that will make a man into a woman. There are two genders, that is the most biology requires of any species on earth.

Attempts to change gender have become a feature of these times and about as realistic as a desire to change species. Both seem futile to me, and perhaps we should be looking at the causes of why some people are trying to change gender when IMO the answer may lie in looking at how parts of our society remain intolerant of variations in the manifest sexuality of humans of both genders.

@Pratchet I have my moral compass that tells me when I see bigotry, I have the stories of trans women who are treated so appallingly by some radical feminists. I’m unsure what “evidence” you want me to provide. As a woman I am not threatened by trans women. As a man, I’d ask you to respect my view and not dictate what I can/can’t feel as at the moment you’re perfectly demonstrating the patriarchy

Some evidence of bigotry. I mean, I have evidence of transactivist bigotry. Does your moral compass stretch to condemning that? I assume you would have evidence of 'feminist bigotry' on which you base your condemnation of 'feminist bigotry'.

Strongmummy. Do you also have the stories of women who are treated so appallingly by some TRA's?

I have the stories of trans women who are treated so appallingly by some radical feminists..

Is that the evidence where feminists are going round threatening TIMs with violence - saying “Kill all TIMs, I punch TIMs, Die TIM scum” etc? Oh no wait, that’s what they’re saying about TERFs isn’t it?!

So do you mean the way that Terfs hang around at meetings which TIMs have organised to talk about the issues they face, and then the TIMs find that they are physically blocked from entering the meeting by a load of aggressive Terfs standing in their way and not letting them through. Oh no wait, that was the other way round too, it was TIMs with their faces covered like a bunch of gangstas blocking women from getting into their meeting.

Perhaps you’re talking about the 60 year old TIM who was punched in the face by a Terf at speakers corner. Erm... oops, I seem to have got that one backwards as well! Silly me.

Well I’m stumped then, can you perhaps give examples of all the threatening and violent episodes TIMs have endured at the hands of Terfs (and no, I don’t mean “literal violence” like saying penises are not a female organ).

TIMs experience violence and hate, which is of course completely unacceptable, but as Curry has said, this is mainly at the hands of straight men, not feminists, whether Terfy, Perfy or otherwise.

If you’re talking about the way in which some women are refusing to be silenced, refusing to be called cis and refusing to accept that penises belong in women’s changing rooms, shelters, prisons, smear tests or sports, then that isn’t bigotry, it’s common sense.

@pratchet, I condemn all bigotry. Some trans activists behave appallingly. I do understand their desperation. I was a very vocal intersectional feminist on twitter for a number of years and witnessed some very bigoted views first hand from radical feminists against both trans women and sex workers. In fact I ended up closing my account as it was not doing my mental health many favours. As a woman I am not threatened by trans women, I accept them as women. That is my truth, and I’m entitled to feel that. I appreciate there are women here who feel differently (I don’t really count your view as you’re a man) and aIthough I accept those women’s views, I don’t agree with them at all and they don’t sit well with me

I wasn’t aware that Prachett was a man, but if so, can he now just state that actually he’s a woman - or indeed a that he’s a trans woman as it’s apparently the same - and you can take his points more seriously?

Two important points tend to be forgotten by the transwomen:

1. An important difference between transwomen and women is that transwomen have as high a proportion of criminal offenders and rapist as men do. So when transwoman say that they want to be away from the dangerous men and go into women's spaces they are wanting to plant someone equally dangerous into the women's spaces.

2. There are men who have no penis due to cancer or accidents. They are very hurt by the assumption that a man without a penis is a woman. There are a lot of suicides among these men and we do not need to make their lives any harder.

In general we hear a lot from transwomen demanding more empathy but we see them showing very little empathy themselves.

FWIW I’m also a man. But only on Fridays. You can call me Bernard.

About 50% of trans prisoners in the UK are there for sex-related crimes or are in most dangerous category A prisoners.

About 3% of women in prison in the UK are there for sex related crimes. This figure includes transwomen who are in women's prisons, not just biological women.

Transwomen do not take on female pattern violence just because they ID as women.

We recognised a long time ago that men as a group are a threat to women and children (do I even need to say, not all men obviously!!).

Why are people now being wilfully blind about the threat a subset of those men continue to pose to women and children.

Is it simply not good enough to say transwomen are women with no proof, and demand women and children compromise their saftey while proof is gathered in the form of sexual assaults on them.

The burden of proof should be on transwomen to proove they are safe before we remove women's hard wom rights, not after.

Trans women are men. They will never know what it feels like to have a period, give birth, breastfeed...

They are men who identify as women. Thar does not make them a woman.

Lol @ strong 'I condemn it but I understand it'

You know what, obviously there's much worse bigotry, violence, homophobia etc from TRA, its obvious, there's material evidence. But who are you telling off and instructing yo be nicer? It's women. It's almost like you can tell the difference between X and Y.

@pratchet, you’re now just being obnoxious and silly. Have a good one

@wellfuckme, I can’t have children. So by your definition , im not a woman?

@Strongmummy no, that isn’t what I’m trying to say. Being a woman is defined biologically. I’ve worded it clumsily but being a woman to me means more than just identifying as one. There are biological things that make you one.

My dh and I cannot have children together. That doesn’t make me not a woman and him not a man. I think you know what I’m trying to say, however badly I’ve worded it.

Strongmummy - "I can’t have children. So by your definition , im not a woman?"

You must have somehow managed to birth, adopt, or steal at least one child at some point, since you are calling yourself "mummy".

Anyway, the definition of Woman is Adult human female, where Female is OF the sex that CAN make eggs or bear young. You may be infertile or post menopause and therefore unable to have children. You are still and will always be OF the sex that CAN make eggs or bear young, which is Female. You are not and will never be of the sex that can make sperm, which is Male.

^ Those are dictionary definitions, the very basic level of information required if you want to be taken seriously in this debate.

Feeling the heat, Strong?

Sex is defined by reproductive role, not reproductive ability.

No @strongmummy - as a (presumably from your name) woman, you were born into the class of humans who produces eggs and bears young. Whether you as an individual actually have any children, by choice, illness or opportunity, makes no difference, in the same way as the example above, a man who loses his penis due to cancer or accident is no less a man.

Fuckme wasn’t giving a definition of woman - she was pointing out some common female experiences that a man will never have. Unless he’s a trans man which kind of makes the point, that trans men are girls, then women, then trans men. They are not men.

Similarly if you have a double mastectomy that doesn’t make you man. Because you were born a female and have female chromosomes.

^The above have worded what I’m trying to say much better than I ever could!

""How would that happen 20pence, being a woman or man, is more than outward appearance, it is about genetics, for fragile X to be eradicated, there needs to be more research into it, and mabey altering genetic codes in some way.""

I was being facetious Aeroflotgirl. Sorry it wasn't more obvious. (I work in a genetics field).