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Original poster

Men wanting to be Women

823 replies

bert3400 · 16/05/2018 22:26

To think transgender women really have no idea what being a women is ? . Maybe it's time we had a 3rd Gender . Be interested in hearing what real women & transwomen feel ?

OP posts:
LightofaSilveryMoon · 17/05/2018 00:31

Concise, there is no such thing as a "female brain", or a "male brain".

But a woman's body is a physical reality.

Men who feel themselves to be some sort of women were brought up and socialised as men, whatever they decided later; but they have really not experienced the historic socialisation of girls and women under the supervision of men, and having periods, and the fear of accidental pregnancy,, for example.

Pratchet · 17/05/2018 00:31

Hi Concise, one of the things I think is noticeable is that if there were male and female brain then you could scan for it in kids before you give them drugs that will sterilise them. But tbh trans people prove there's no male or female brains precisely because male people have female traits and vice versa.

MyRelationshipIsWeird · 17/05/2018 00:33

Concise I was with you there until the lady-brain bollocks. You do realise that the notion of pink and blue brains has been used to keep women in a subservient position throughout history. We were turning the tide and now this shit has reared its head again. Angry

MyRelationshipIsWeird · 17/05/2018 00:34

Just saw your update Concise - glad it has made you reconsider. Hope the link above is useful in your research!

HelenaDove · 17/05/2018 00:36

Curry those experiences you had at school were horrific Thanks

Your mum sounds bloody awesome though.

Ereshkigal · 17/05/2018 00:37

I'm thinking of making a programme called "What makes a zoo keeper" because I own two cats and drive a jeep so its pretty much the same. Some might say I'm MORE of a zoo keeper because I painted tiger stripes on my jeep. Obviously I don't have to deal with any dangerous animals or patrol my local village throwing hunks of dead zebra out the window, but if you try and say I'm not a zoo keeper it's literal violence because I have some Go-Cat in my boot.

Loved this Grin

Waddlelikeapenguin · 17/05/2018 00:37

OrderMeAnotherCurry I'm sorry those things happened to you Flowers

itsbetterthanabox · 17/05/2018 00:39

@CaliforniaDream
I find your comparison to racist regimes highly offensive.
Women are an oppressed group. Surely you see that? And to compare our power over transwoman to that of white oppressors over black slaves is frankly absurd.
The people actually hurting both women and Gender non conforming men are men!
We aren't the ones committing violence. We just want to be safe.

Waddlelikeapenguin · 17/05/2018 00:40

For anyone on this thread who isnt sure gender self id is a good idea you might like to sign this petition asking for the government to consult more widely on the issue Smile

petition.parliament.uk/petitions/214118

nooka · 17/05/2018 00:44

Concise if you are really interested in what scientists think about male and female brain differences then I recommend Daphne Joel. She's written a few (fairly impenetrable) academic papers on the subject and also given a good TED talk. This pretty much sums up her findings:

There are only a few brain characteristics for which the term sexually dimorphic, which literally means having two forms, is appropriate, that is, for which there is minimal or no overlap between the form of this characteristic in males and females (e.g., the size of the sexually dimorphic nucleus of the preoptic area, which is three to eight times larger in male rats compared to female rats, Swaab, 1995). For most documented sex differences in the brain, however, and in particular in regions involved in behavior, emotion, and cognition, there is a considerable overlap between the distributions of the two sexes.

Even if it was found that the brains of transsexuals did resemble the brains of the men/women they would like to be it would still not be correct to say they had the 'wrong sex' brain as all of our brains contain our chromosomes so it's not possible to have bodies where all cells are (eg) XX except for the brain which somehow has XY cells instead.

Yambabe · 17/05/2018 00:47

So many people seem to think woman = notman. (Or man = notwoman)

This is not true.

Woman = adult human female.

Transwoman = man who does not conform to social masculine stereotypes and so takes steps to make themself a notman.

There's nothing wrong with being trans. The fight should not be to have transwomen accepted as women (and transmen as men) but to have them accepted as trans without any prejudice, threat or harm. Although many of us would stand with our trans friends in this particular fight it's not ours to have - we have our own issues to fight for.

#sexmatters

Aeroflotgirl · 17/05/2018 00:55

Transwomen are biogically men, so real women to me are those who are biological women, Transwomen are Transwomen.

Aeroflotgirl · 17/05/2018 00:59

Women wanting to be men are Transmen, they are not real men, as they were not born Male, same really as Transwomen.

LightofaSilveryMoon · 17/05/2018 01:04

Yes! If trans people were campaigning for their own place in society and law and custom for a third, gender-neutral space, alongside exclusive spaces for women, and for men - then I would applaud and support.

But men muscling in on women's rights and women's single-sex spaces, though -
No. No.
No.

How many times do women have to say No?

OlennasWimple · 17/05/2018 01:16

Concise - I completely agree with your point that it's so fucking insulting when TRAs claim that a man without a penis = woman. We are not penis-less men!

Curry - nice to see you back around. Not sure if you've been lurking or away completely - it's been a bit weird here recently

bert - what would we use a "third gender / sex / neutral" space for? I'm not opposed to it on principle, other than to worry that it would default to being a male space, so men would get more than their "fair share" of resources, spaces etc etc. But I can't see why we need one - perhaps I'm missing something obvious

Magpiesarehuge · 17/05/2018 01:34

How does it affect women/girls? Well spirts for a start- the restrictions on males in sport who id as women/girls is being eroded all the time. The end goal is to allow anyone to compete in any category sport they with no conditions. More schools/colleges etc are moving towards this. Read this today- in recent school track events - 2 males are taking 1st and 2nd place in the girls events. There were also the recent cases of TW Laurel Hubbard and Hannah Mouncey. www.gametimect.com/jeff-jacobs-no-easy-answers-in-debate-about-trans-hs-athletes/amp/?__twitter_impression=true

MsGameandWatching · 17/05/2018 01:37

All I can say is that I'm glad you're losing this battle. I'm glad the real world, outside of this site, is moving towards full endorsement of trans rights. I'm glad that in 20 years time the transphobia of today will be viewed the same way we now look at Jim Crow laws, apartheid, section 28, etc. I'm glad I'm part of the movement towards equality.

I honestly don't believe this will happen. The tide is already turning, not as quickly as I would have liked, but it is.

AngryAttackKittens · 17/05/2018 03:27

(Points up)

The person quoted above sounds like a Scientologist. It's remarkable how consistent that cultlike tone is and how similar the statements people make are, to the point where it's almost as if they're all cutting and pasting from the same master document.

RadioGaGoo · 17/05/2018 04:56

I don't get it California. You say trans women are 'real' women, but then use the term ciswomen. Surely if you believe in equality, you should be just be using the term women.

differentnameforthis · 17/05/2018 05:12

Definition of woman
plural women play \ˈwi-mən

1 a : an adult female person

Definition of female
1 a (1) : of, relating to, or being the sex that typically has the capacity to bear young or produce eggs

So no, trans women are NOT women.

Faceicle · 17/05/2018 05:38

Hysterectomy klaxon!

rosylea · 17/05/2018 05:47

If they've ever had a willy, they are transwomen. Simple!!! Unfortunately, tim's also try to speak like women but just can't quite pull it off. eg; last week a tim said they were sitting on the loo, underwear and tights pulled down, legs akimbo holding the door (because it had no lock). Women don't usually say "underwear/tights", we just say "pants" (or knickers). Women don't describe themselves as "legs akimbo", we say "one leg holding the door". Stop trying to pretend to be us please. Be satisfied and proud of what you are, "transwomen". If you want to fight for safe spaces for transwomen, we'll fight with you. If you fight to gain access to womens safe spaces, we'll fight against you. Get it?

20pencepiece · 17/05/2018 07:12

If men could become women we could eradicate all the horrible X-linked genetic disease males suffer from.............I wonder why that's not happened!!

UrsulaPandress · 17/05/2018 07:55

Can't they just be transexual?

Leave 'women' out of it altogether.

50shadesofgreyismylaundry · 17/05/2018 08:04

Transwomen are men. They may be men with a strongly and sincerely held belief that they ought to have been women, and I recognise that this must be deeply distressing. If that distress is alleviated by " presenting as a woman" (ie adopting the culturally specific stereotypes of femininity in our society), then I have no beef with that, provided that they don't impinge on women's rights in the process.

^this