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AIBU?

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Men wanting to be Women

823 replies

bert3400 · 16/05/2018 22:26

To think transgender women really have no idea what being a women is ? . Maybe it's time we had a 3rd Gender . Be interested in hearing what real women & transwomen feel ?

OP posts:
Strongmummy · 21/05/2018 12:32

@miggeldy so you are a woman coz you’ve got a vagina?

TERFragetteCity · 21/05/2018 12:33

@TERF no idea. Why are you a woman?

I am fully confident that my body and the whole of my life's experience make me a woman but you seem to think it is something profound, so if you don't know you are one then why do you think you are? How do you even know you are?

RatRolyPoly · 21/05/2018 12:34

No - no reality was broken during the millennia we got to grips with homosexuality. People thought it was wrong but they didn’t deny reality. They thought the reality of two people of the same sex being attracted was wrong.

Nope, they thought it was a mental illness.

www.psychologytoday.com/us/blog/hide-and-seek/201509/when-homosexuality-stopped-being-mental-disorder

www.psychologytoday.com/us/blog/therapy-matters/201104/scientific-homophobia

Aaaaand they thought racism had a scientific justification: en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Scientific_racism

Aaaaand sexism: theestablishment.co/the-science-that-claims-women-are-inferior-to-men-is-bogus-c2a9956acc54?gi=278602072e68

MiggeldyHiggins · 21/05/2018 12:34

Mainly its the XX chromosomes, but yes also a vagina and all that shit.

Can't believe this needs spelling out to adults!

MiggeldyHiggins · 21/05/2018 12:35

Nope, they thought it was a mental illness

For a while, but they also thought women who liked sex were mentally ill. Before that though, both were perfectly normal in other times and places.
None of that is relevant in anyway.

Strongmummy · 21/05/2018 12:37

@TERF on the basis I never questioned the fact that my vagina dictated I was a woman when I was little has also meant that my life’s experience has been as a woman.

However, therein lies the point. Why do some children from a VERY young age feel they SHOULD be (ie are) in the wrong body.

Their life experience is very very limited.

Pratchet · 21/05/2018 12:38

Please don't compare our understanding of biology to racism. It's gaslighting.

In the olden days people used to think that males and females were born with different brains. Luckily we now know better.

Bowlofbabelfish · 21/05/2018 12:38

Nope, they thought it was a mental illness.

You misunderstand my point. They thought it was wrong, sick, sinful etc. They didn’t deny the reality of it. They didn’t think that one of those men must be a woman. They saw the reality and the disagreed with it. There weren’t any mental gymnastics.

Ditto racism. People can advance all sorts of theories but reality - the fact that groups of people look different - wasn’t strained.

Peoples opinions on that reality changed.

TERFragetteCity · 21/05/2018 12:38

Profound.

Men wanting to be Women
RatRolyPoly · 21/05/2018 12:39

Gay marriage didn’t invalidate straight marriage.

Except a good many thought it did. You know, marriage is between a man and a woman, yada yada; language is important - marriage means man and woman!!! That was pretty much what was said.

MiggeldyHiggins · 21/05/2018 12:40

yes they THOUGHT.

Thinking something is not the same thing as that thing happening. You really do struggle with basic concepts!

RatRolyPoly · 21/05/2018 12:40

In the olden days people used to think that males and females were born with different brains. Luckily we now know better.

Yes, now we do.

Thankfully.

Who knows what we will learn in the future.

Strongmummy · 21/05/2018 12:40

Therefore in my view it’s

Chromosomes + ? + life experience = woman

No one knows the ?.

MiggeldyHiggins · 21/05/2018 12:42

WE don't need any ?

adult human female= woman.

RatRolyPoly · 21/05/2018 12:43

They didn’t deny the reality of it. They didn’t think that one of those men must be a woman. They saw the reality and the disagreed with it.

I'm not sure I agree with your point Bowl; they saw the reality of men sleeping exclusively with men, disagreed with it and they tried to "cure" it.

In what way is that not "denying the reality"? It's not denying the reality of a mental illness, but it is denying the reality of a perfectly natural sexual orientation.

I disagree with you that they tried to cure it because they thought it was "wrong". They tried to cure it because they thought homosexuals were unwell.

RatRolyPoly · 21/05/2018 12:43

Miggeldy what is your definition of "adult"?

grandplans · 21/05/2018 12:44

to be so adamant that trans people ... have some predatory agenda is just so offensive

Some men have a predatory agenda. We know this from crime stats, convictions in courts and from lived experience. You accept this, surely? @Strongmummy

We have NO proof that transwomen take on patterns of violence typical for women once they Self ID as women. Indeed there is a lot of evidence to the contrary.

To suggest that a group of people who used to live as men, might be just as much of a threat (as a group) to women as any men are isn't offensive. It has a logical, reasonable basis.

However, to suggest that women and children participate in a social experiment to see if transwomen offend like women or like men, where the measure of that experiment is the sexual abuse of real women and children, is grossly offensive IMO.

Considering that law makers, transactivists and supporters like you, Strongmummy have so much invested in the idea that transwomen are women, and also given the low conviction rate for sexual offences - how many women and children do you think will need to suffer before people stop saying "crimes are committed by individuals, there's no pattern here" and are forced to recognise that "actually, it looks like transwomen are just as much of a risk to women and children as any man".

What would it take to convince you, Strongmummy ? How many women and children raped, groped, intimidated and filmed - in hospital wards, prisons, changing rooms, toilets and on school trips - would it take for someone like you, who thinks it won't happen, to admit you've got it wrong?

TERFragetteCity · 21/05/2018 12:44

they saw the reality of men sleeping exclusively with men, disagreed with it and they tried to "cure" it.

They being the medical profession? Same ones making £ out of the gender industry. Hmm...

MiggeldyHiggins · 21/05/2018 12:45

Miggeldy what is your definition of "adult"?

go get a dictionary Hmm

Bowlofbabelfish · 21/05/2018 12:46

Bowl - what aggressive take over?! Seriously what aggressive takeover?

The sort of TRA who tweets that women should enjoy their erasure
The policing of language to disallow women to talk about endometriosis because they saycthays transphobic.
The policing of language on pronouns, on biological terms like breastfeeding (now chest feeding etc.)
The targeting of women’s insitutions with vexatious lawsuits (waxing salon case in Canada, women’s refuge cases in Canada)
The housing of male bodied prisoners in female estate.
Being unable to guarantee you won’t be getting changed next to a man with a penis at the gym
The targeting of the girl guiding movement, with associated serious reductions in child safeguarding
The takeover of lesbian spaces and support groups
The imposed ‘gender neutralisation’ of toilets at the NUS conference which directly impacted and inconvenienced women of faith attending the border agency conference held in the same building.
Muslim women being unable to participate properly in the public sphere due to lack of female specific spaces
Sports - people like Hannah mouncey placing female players at risk of serious injury in a contact sport
Sports - poster on here the other day playing rugby against a trans woman on the opposite team - five serious injuries on her team including shattered collarbones, blown knees etc. These can be life changing injuries.
Sports - women’s scholarships for higher education going to men who compete as women
Sports - men competing as women just makes women’s sport pointless.
Safeguarding - self ID and changes to the GRA will dilute safeguarding to the point of uselessness. Children of both sexes and any gender identity you name will be affected.

I could go on. But just a few examples of how man are aggressively taking over the definition of ‘woman’ and negatively impacting on real women.

RatRolyPoly · 21/05/2018 12:47

They being the medical profession? Same ones making £ out of the gender industry. Hmm...

I'm sure they'd be making just as much money if they were "curing" the desire to transition as they are facilitating it, don't you?

Pratchet · 21/05/2018 12:47

Throwing fish here

Pratchet · 21/05/2018 12:47

Bowl: spot on

RatRolyPoly · 21/05/2018 12:47

go get a dictionary

You might want to have a think about it; your definition of a woman depends on it.

TERFragetteCity · 21/05/2018 12:50

I'm sure they'd be making just as much money if they were "curing" the desire to transition as they are facilitating it, don't you?

No, they have costed it out and a lifetime of hormones, therapy and surgery after surgery - and it is quids in.