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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

To want to shake my “unschooling” “friend”

226 replies

MrsPreston11 · 10/05/2018 13:32

She seems to think that because my kids are in awful, awful (ofsted outstanding and they’re both very happy) mainstream school they miss out on SO much.

And takes any chance she can to make sure I know how very very happy she is having all these “precious adventures” every day.

Most days they just watch TV/iPad and then once a month go to a museum or theme park.

Her oldest (5) can’t read or write yet, can’t play nice with other kids, can’t sit still for 2 seconds.

Guess what. Mine go to museums and theme parks and beaches too. I’m not bloody neglecting them.

Urgh. Sorry. Rant over.

OP posts:
LemonysSnicket · 11/05/2018 01:37

My sister and I could read by 3.... is finished my schools library at 6. I don’t think because many children around the world can’t read by 5 means it’s ok.

Oliversmumsarmy · 11/05/2018 01:52

Ds went to school every day and he couldn't read. He was 8 years old

Definitely identify with the attitude of the school if your dc has an SEN. They won't diagnose or help. In the end you have to HE.

PintOfMineralWater · 11/05/2018 02:23

I knew someone who "unschooled". I'm a live and let live kind of person so just decided to keep an open mind. But OMG. All she did was talk about how damaging school was, how it bred clones etc.

She was very well off and would get private yoga teachers, music teachers, local artists etc to come to the house and give her children lessons.

To top it all off... her child was two years old at the time. I just kept my mouth shut, wasn't worth saying anything!

Oliversmumsarmy · 11/05/2018 02:35

How can you unschool a child who is too young for school and has never been.

Coyoacan · 11/05/2018 03:01

My sister and I could read by 3.... is finished my schools library at 6. I don’t think because many children around the world can’t read by 5 means it’s ok.

Too much emphasis is put on reading, writing and maths because they are such easy things to measure and compare. But small children have so much to learn in this world. My dgd is nearly five and here in Mexico they don't teach reading and writing until they are six. But she is learning so many other essential things.

lljkk · 11/05/2018 05:00

It's funny... I know a lot of HE families. They all believe regular school is mildly awful at best. However all can bite tongue about that opinion, and are even more Hmm and Shock about unschooling: highly disapproved of! Abrogation of duty, I guess is their view.

HellenaHandbasket · 11/05/2018 08:22

Unschooling isn't related to how long a child has been at school or not, it is simply a hands off approach. Unschooling as in, the opposite of school.

Lemony I too was an early reader, but that doesn't mean that not reading by 5 is anything to worry about. A few studies have shown that actually later readers catch up very quickly because they are cognitively ready to do so. Most kids only start school at 5 anyway and early reading is pushed because schools need children to be able to read in order to access the rest of the curriculum.

Beaverhurdle · 11/05/2018 08:34

I 'unschool'. When you do it, you get so much judgement and scorn heaped on you and i usually find that as soon as someone with conventionally schooled kids finds out, your very existence becomes an insult to them. You get defensive. I dont like go talk about it unless pressed tbh.

Shedmicehugh1 · 11/05/2018 08:53

taratill thank you, very useful. My ds is in SS, we have unofficially deschooled (now I know the term!) several times ie mental/physical breakdown, time signed off from school to recover. My ds’s EHCP is being amended to include this in his EHCP ie time off to recover and alternative arrangements to be made until he has recovered etc.

Although I think if we get to that point again, I will ‘deschool’ officially, maybe work towards a mixture of unschooling and Home ed. All extremely helpful terms I now know!

Shedmicehugh1 · 11/05/2018 08:58

NameyMcNamechangeface oh no this thread hasn’t put me off at all. It’s been very insightful and informative. Knowing the terms which help me research and put together a plan B Smile

OutofSyncGirl · 11/05/2018 09:02

You should both stop judging each other. If you’re both secure in your decisions then neither of you should feel the need to put the other down. Talk about other things.

user1495362060 · 11/05/2018 09:06

There is count as in “recite the numbers” and count as in “count 5 objects”. Your 2yo can do the former, not the latter. The 7yo she is taking about can probably learn how to do both in about a day - unless developmentally delayed.

Cagliostro · 11/05/2018 09:23

She doesn’t sound like a good friend at all, so for that YANBU! It’s horrible to be sending you articles about school being awful, is she really sending them directly to you? Sharing on FB generally is one thing but if she’s messaging them or tagging you it is remarkably socially unaware 🤔

I’m not against unschooling but we are a bit structured ourselves. That said it’s only recently that we’ve increased the amount of sit down and write type stuff, as the trauma my eldest particularly was carrying from school (and then later due to a bullying situation) was so deeply affecting her that she was scared to try anything. Stepping back was the only way to protect her mental health, but we did what we could still because I think particularly with maths and literacy, if you know you are behind it can affect self esteem. It’s a difficult balancing act.

They are really thriving on this new structured approach but we will all treasure the extra freedom they had before this, and I do think that time gave them more space to discover what subjects they really love with no pressure. They’ve really surprised me. And a lot of that did come from TV (history and human biology particularly) - picking up knowledge from shows has increased their confidence and made them feel more ready to pick up formal learning. Unschooling properly doesn’t mean doing nothing, it means ensuring there are opportunities and resources around. For example I am really glad I just left an Usborne lift the flap periodic table book on the side rather than jumping straight into working on it - my 8yo picked it up months later and barely put it down since, and is now going to be working on KS3 chemistry because it’s ignited a passion that I never dreamed was there, especially as he was a bit “meh” about the primary science curriculum. It’s a challenge for me too as I had such a mental block about science at school. But it’s really exciting!

We are lucky here that there’s a huge and thriving HE community and we were never short of things to do, so they always had plenty of socialising time and museum trips, science workshops etc - I tend to tell new HEers “friends first” as building a good support network makes a huge difference and happy children who aren’t isolated are more likely to learn anyway. Being away from school (both are autistic and it was just too much for them) meant they were more relaxed and they now do loads of after school activities as well, so they aren’t isolated away from school children either.

I have a different view I guess as we experienced school first (we did nearly home ed from the start but decided to try school). But I don’t like the evangelising that comes from some about unschooling. Only some. Most of the home ed community here at least is really chilled and varied and everyone just supports each other, but I have also faced criticism IRL and online for daring to do actual sit down learning 🙄 most of my friends are anti school (due to the experiences they’ve had) but that’s not the same as being anti education. Most people recognise that you can do “formal” learning while still enjoying the freedom that HE provides.

It sounds like your friend is desperate to justify themselves TBH. Most people don’t put down others and their choices.

I am not really sure about the endless TV time and iPad etc. There’s a lot of opportunity for learning, for example we spent ages on the iPad yesterday (their “free choice” game time has always been limited though) learning Japanese - and they are learning much faster than when we tried using books alone. There’s a lot of great TV available now. So it’s not impossible that they could be learning loads. You can’t really know unless you are there I think.

taratill · 11/05/2018 09:34

Cagliostro I think you've hit the nail on the head when you say that being anti school does not mean being anti education.

Many people whose children are educated in school assume that education can't happen elsewhere or in other formats (and hands up I was one of them until DS could no longer be at school). It can.

All children are different. Some will thrive in schools, I did which is why coming to terms with taking DS out of schools was a stressful 2 year process for me. Even though it was blindingly obvious he couldn't stay in school even with an EHCP.

I am now enthusiastic for his future as he has started to enjoy learning again. I'm getting my boy back.

MrsPreston11 · 11/05/2018 09:56

Yes. She sent “this is why you shouldn’t send your kids to school” articles on the day I submitted my youngest school application and then another on results day. Same again this year as one of our group has a daughter who was due August but was a couple of weeks late so only starting this September.

I think she’d really thought she’d worked some unschool magic on this mum and since she’s realised that she hasn’t and they’ve accepted the school place it’s kicked her up a notch.

I have this niggle that she actually doesn’t relish the life she’s living (husband is never around but you’d think the way she talks that’s 100% fine as he’s gods gift to the earth he’s that wonderful) and is just trying to convince herself we’re all doing it wrong and she has it right.

It’s wearing as it means I try not to mention much about DDs schools as then she retaliates with a new blog post/millions of “adventure” photos in whatsapp and lots of unschool links.

Meh. My two are having the time of their life at school today with sixth formers from the high school coming to play with them. I’m sat having a coffee in peace. Got a lovely weekend in the woods planned.

I know which option I’d choose.

From now on it’s all just water off a ducks back and I’ll smile and nod

OP posts:
MarthasGinYard · 11/05/2018 09:59

'but she's constantly saying (even on her blog) about how her kids are soooo glad they don't have to go to school, and never want to be imprisoned like that and "why do other kids not get all day at home with their mummies like we do, Mummy? That's sad"'

Bloody hell Op are you really hard up for friends or summat Grin

She sounds like a right nausebox

Beaverhurdle · 11/05/2018 10:09

oh yeah I'd say (as an unschooler myself) that sending you stuff like that is totally out of order. Friendbin for her.

gluteustothemaximus · 11/05/2018 10:13

I agree. She sounds awful.

That is brilliant your two are happy at school. You’ve made your decision about their education, and she should butt out.

She has made her decision, and that should be that.

Honestly, it doesn’t sound like a friendship though.

I home school one, and I have one in school. School has to be the main way to educate. It has to be. Or else parents couldn’t work, and we have to be sure everyone is getting the same education and chances.

In reality, the one size fits all, doesn’t fit, and there are bad schools, bad teachers, as well as good. Not all children can cope, not all needs can be met.

So if a parent decides education is best outside of school, then that’s their route to choose (free from judgement about being weird/vegan/anti vaxxers).

Neither side should lord it up over the other. There is no right or wrong.

As long as the child is receiving a suitable education age appropriate, that should be it.

There will always be extreme examples of anything. Don’t lump us all together.

drspouse · 11/05/2018 10:29

Definitely identify with the attitude of the school if your dc has an SEN. They won't diagnose or help. In the end you have to HE.
Complete opposite for us. School have given DS so much and we'd be lost without them.

HellenaHandbasket · 11/05/2018 11:34

People can be very thoughtless. When we made the decision not to send ours to school a friend said "it sounds like a lovely idea but wouldn't be for us, education is just so important to us". Yeah, same here 😂

DrEustaciaBenson · 11/05/2018 13:46

Many people whose children are educated in school assume that education can't happen elsewhere or in other formats

Don't those parents have books and newspapers at home, take their children to the library, have days out to interesting places, have conversations with their children?

I'm in favour of school in general*, but parents who send their children to school don't get to abdicate all responsibility for bringing them up to be well informed, well rounded, contributing members of society.

I learned a lot of stuff at school, but I learned a lot from my parents, too.

*there'll always be exceptions to any general rule.

crunchymint · 11/05/2018 14:03

I get irritated actually by some Home Schoolers who seem to assume that those who send their kids to school never take their kids to museums, libraries, do home projects, learn an instrument outside of school, etc etc. A decent parent makes sure their kids learn outside of school as well.

I do support Home Education. But I strongly dislike the messages that anyone can home educate. Seeing some attempts, that is simply not true.

taratill · 11/05/2018 14:06

DrEustacia

I think you've taken what I said a bit literally. I don't think they mean they don't have to supplement the school education just that the 'school' part is essential in order to educate properly.

Jux · 11/05/2018 16:23

My two are having the time of their life at school today with sixth formers from the high school coming to play with them. I’m sat having a coffee in peace. Got a lovely weekend in the woods planned.

Put that up on FB. She'll bombard you with anti-school shit, and when she stops just comment "Finished?" And then add another status delighting in your lovely school, your children's impeccable manners, how well they're doing, what they're reading etc spread over many many posts.

It may seem like hard work initially, but allow yourself to enjoy it. At some point, she will say something and you can respond "This is how you come across. Can we stop with the blizzards now please?" With a smiley face or something.

If that doesn't work, block her.

babyno5 · 11/05/2018 17:57

I have an old school friend who chose to home ed her daughter and said daughter is now 15 and has zero social skills - constantly interrupts and offers unsolicited opinions on “adult” subjects etc.
I agree it would be lovely not to have the endless school dictatorship not to mention “dress up as a fucking moron” days but it does help with a lot more than just education.