Active discussions

Meet the Other Phone. Child-safe in minutes.

Meet the Other Phone.
Child-safe in minutes.

Buy now

Please or to access all these features

Talk
AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

To think DD wasn’t unreasonable not to give up reserved seat?

408 replies

jasminajasminda · 06/05/2018 11:26

Dd17 was getting the train from London to Edinburgh yesterday to visit her sister at uni (she’s just finished her internal school year 12 exams, and lessons don’t start again until Wednesday).

We obviously reserved her a seat. She arrived, got on the train, and sat down in her seat. The train was very busy, and a few minutes after the train started moving, a middle aged woman with a walking stick, having apparently wandered through several carriages (dd was in the front carriage) without finding a seat, looked around dd’s Carriage, then came up to her and asked her to move as she needed a seat (pointedly making a big deal of her walking stick). When dd pointed out that she had reserved that seat, and there was no way she was giving up her seat on a four hour train journey, the woman told her that she was young, and therefore didn’t need a seat as much as she did.

At this dd put on her headphones, and listened to music and ignored her. The woman eventually huffed and left the carriage. Dd said that she noticed a few other passengers giving her (dd) dirty looks throughout the journey.

Was dd being unreasonable?

OP posts:
MrMeSeeks · 06/05/2018 15:22

A disabled teen can say so (and generally disabled people don’t agree to do things that are impossible for them due to mild social pressure).
Really? Ive been disabled since a young adult and i dont announce i am and have given upmy seat after been made to feel bad as i dont look disabled ( and been in agony after).

Fhs, sitting on your suitcase or on the floor for a few stops or even an hour or so is hardly going to kill an able bodied 17 year old is it?
Four hours, what about that?

Pengggwn · 06/05/2018 15:23

I love how this woman has turned into a cross between Dick Turpin and Judas Iscariot 😂

She just wanted to sit down. She is very unlikely to have been faking this, and unlikely to have stolen the seat, and unlikely to have been bullying the girl.

MN is a weird place. People seem to enjoy believing the worst about people, and can't help justifying their own tight-arsed selfishness with reference to the entirely imaginary faults of others.

Aeroflotgirl · 06/05/2018 15:23

I agree, if the daughter left to help the woman, she might have taken her seat, and not let her sit down, ending up in an altercation, or somebody else could have taken her reserved seat, more hassle than its worth. Next time the woman should reserve her seat knowing she has a disability and requires a seat, not just rock up and expect one.

anothergreentomato · 06/05/2018 15:24

I know your DD was technically right. However, personally I would have given up the seat. Yes, it would mean a more uncomfortable journey, but I'd feel a lot better knowing I'd done the right thing.

I don't think it's unreasonable for someone with mobility issues to rely on the kindness of strangers a little bit rather than always having to go the extra mile and reserve seats, which might not always be feasible. I like to think that someone would do the same for me in that situation if I needed it. The world's a much nicer place with a little kindness and I like to think a good deed is repaid in time.

Quilthead · 06/05/2018 15:26

This reply has been deleted

Message deleted by MNHQ. Here's a link to our Talk Guidelines.

Otterseatpuffinsdontthey · 06/05/2018 15:27

Many years ago my daughter and myself were travelling, by coach, from Wales to Glasgow. We had the front seats, on the opposite side to the driver. Elderly woman boarded at Liverpool - demanded our seats - for no other reason than that was where she wanted to sit!
With the current post - the individual concerned walked through several carriages - no other passenger has offered to give her a seat - so she has chosen to "home" in on what she perceived to be a soft target.
This wasn't lack of manners on the young lady's part - but a huge sense of entitlement from the middle-aged individual.
And, no - we didn't give up our seats either!

Pengggwn · 06/05/2018 15:28

Quilthead

What a nasty little post.

ProfFlitwick · 06/05/2018 15:29

Sorry but I think your DD should have given it up. Come on, it's clearly easier for her to stand than an older person. She reserved it? Tough.

I've worked jobs which involved standing for long periods, yeah it was unpleasant, but nothing a night's sleep didn't cure. I think maybe you should encourage more altruistic behaviour from her in future.

Aeroflotgirl · 06/05/2018 15:31

Yes the world is a better place with kindness, that is why I give up my seats to people who need them on public transport, hey its a short journey and they need it more than me, but I am certainly not going to give up my reserved seat on a 4 hour journey, it is a long journey to stand, how does the woman know that dd has not got a hidden disability. What a CF.

Kazzyhoward · 06/05/2018 15:34

Was dd being unreasonable?

Not in the slightest. She was sat in the seat she had booked, i.e. her seat. The old woman had alternatives. She could have booked a seat herself or she could have asked people sat in the disabled specified seats to move (they have them in every carriage and it's highly unlikely all on a relatively long train are occupied by genuinely disabled). Assuming your DD wasn't in a disabled seat (booked by accident) then it was her seat. Completely out of order to pick on someone just because they're young. It's just entitlement culture and a form of bullying. She screwed up by not booking a seat and blaming others for her mistake.

VictoriaB07 · 06/05/2018 15:35

This reply has been deleted

Message deleted by MNHQ. Here's a link to our Talk Guidelines.

codswallopandbalderdash · 06/05/2018 15:36

I don't understand how the lady with the stick didn't have a reservation and there must have been other seats on the train. And there were plenty of other passengers on the train to ask to give up their seat too ...

Sockwomble · 06/05/2018 15:38

I regularly did 3 hours sitting on the floor on trains as a student. Once I had got myself settled I didn't bother going looking to see if a free seat had appeared.

VictoriaB07 · 06/05/2018 15:38

Walking stick

corythatwas · 06/05/2018 15:46

I think a fairly ingrained system of general gender neutral chivalry is quite helpful to get you through life. I will help you because in this situation I am better placed to do this, I will ask you for help because in this situation you are better placed to give it. I used to ask people for help all the time when I was travelling with a disabled child. And then, when that stopped, I became the one who offered help instead. Sides of the same coin.

You can't live your life always putting other people first. But you can live it sometimes putting them first. And it's actually far more pleasant.

VivaKondo · 06/05/2018 15:51

I agree cory but the. I suspect you were very polite asking if people could move.
You didn’t go and ‘pointly’ and ‘waving your dd stick’ (to make a point).

I’m always helpful when I can.
I’m not when people are forcing their way to get what they want.

PotterGrangerWeasley · 06/05/2018 15:56

Pengggwn
I was not saying people can't be kind or that your opinion was wrong. It is lovely that people have said they would have given this person their seat. I only meant that my own opinion is that the word selfish is used too freely whenever someone doesn't do something just because they are asked.

TooManyPaws · 06/05/2018 16:03

If I walk long distances (ie more than pottering round the supermarket) I need a stick. I'm middle-aged. If I travel long distances by train, I book a seat. The tongue in my head works well so I ask a member of station or train staff where I need to stand to access the seat; Edinburgh Waverley has signs to tell you where each carriage will stop so I presume London will do the same.

If she didn't have a seat booked, all she had to do was speak to staff and they would tell her where to go on the platform. They've always been helpful every time I've had to go to London and back, at both stations. I've even asked the ticket collector as I went on to the platform. There's usually a member of train staff standing at the barrier end of the train when you get the Edinburgh train from London.

What I DON'T do is try to bully someone into giving up their seat. I didn't do that even when I commuted from Glasgow and couldn't book a seat, and was waiting for a joint fusion operation, hence in horrible pain when walking. I was always very appreciative whenever anyone helped, and asked if necessary rather than demand.

Sounds like this woman thought she could just get her own way by playing the age and disability cards, and chose, as her mark someone young and likely to be pliable. Good on the lassie for telling her it wasn't working. Age and disability don't stop you being a bullying arsehole.

MyOtherUsernameisaPun · 06/05/2018 16:05

I'd be ashamed of any child of mine who didn't leap up to offer a seat to someone with a stick.

User12879923378 · 06/05/2018 16:07

When I was pregnant, I just used to bellow "Would someone be kind enough to give me a seat?" at the air and someone usually did. Means that people with hidden disabilities don't have to discuss them.

I would probably have given my seat up. I don't think your daughter can be criticised for not doing so, but I think it's a shame if no able bodied person on that train was prepared to stand so that a lady with a stick could sit down. I doubt that everyone in the carriage was sitting because they were physically or mentally incapable of coping with standing.

randomsabreuse · 06/05/2018 16:09

London (Euston) has signs which say which carriages have unreserved seats - and level of reservation per carriage on the departure board. Big virgin trains it's usually coach U that is unreserved (funny that...)

If it was Saturday, weekend 1st is about £15 - and a good option for a last minute journey to more or less guarantee a seat...

User12879923378 · 06/05/2018 16:09

If I travel long distances by train, I book a seat.

Most operators don't let you reserve a seat if you're travelling the same day that you book. I often have to book the same day I travel. I agree that the lady should have tried to find a guard but she may well not have been able to if it was a packed train and a packed platform.

Awwlookatmybabyspider · 06/05/2018 16:12

Why didn't the ones giving her dirty looks get up off their butts and give up their seats. Seems like ganging up to me on a young girl on her own.
You pay in advance for a seat You sit there end of.
It's not being rude or inconsiderate
It's called being assertive.
This lady must have known if she didn't reserve a seat shed likely have to stand.

FixItUpChappie · 06/05/2018 16:16

I would be pleased my daughter had the pluck to say no. The earphones bit suggests the woman didn't take no for an answer and stayed to argue her point which is out of order. Being a middle aged person with a cane doesn't automatically mean your a nice person incapable of sorting yourself out. She should have had the sense to go directly to the guard for assistance if she hadn't had the time to reserve a seat - not sidled up to a reserved seat occupied by the youngest female she could find.

what pearl clutching to consider a young woman saying no to an older person "scary", "disheartening" and "embarrassing" Hmm

Theweasleytwins · 06/05/2018 16:23

Last time I reserved a seat there was a little message on the seat saying if you didn't sit in your reserved seat it was wrong (several years ago-can't quite remember)