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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

To think DD wasn’t unreasonable not to give up reserved seat?

408 replies

jasminajasminda · 06/05/2018 11:26

Dd17 was getting the train from London to Edinburgh yesterday to visit her sister at uni (she’s just finished her internal school year 12 exams, and lessons don’t start again until Wednesday).

We obviously reserved her a seat. She arrived, got on the train, and sat down in her seat. The train was very busy, and a few minutes after the train started moving, a middle aged woman with a walking stick, having apparently wandered through several carriages (dd was in the front carriage) without finding a seat, looked around dd’s Carriage, then came up to her and asked her to move as she needed a seat (pointedly making a big deal of her walking stick). When dd pointed out that she had reserved that seat, and there was no way she was giving up her seat on a four hour train journey, the woman told her that she was young, and therefore didn’t need a seat as much as she did.

At this dd put on her headphones, and listened to music and ignored her. The woman eventually huffed and left the carriage. Dd said that she noticed a few other passengers giving her (dd) dirty looks throughout the journey.

Was dd being unreasonable?

OP posts:
Aeroflotgirl · 06/05/2018 16:25

There is noway I would be giving my seat to somebody who is rude like that lady. She like an entitled moo.

Aeroflotgirl · 06/05/2018 16:27

If the lady asked nicely I would, and hope that she might get off before me so I could reclaim my seat, if she was rude about it like this lady, I would not.

BecauseWeCanCanCan · 06/05/2018 16:32

I think it's unbelievably depressing that someone with a walking stick had to stand while everyone remained seated because it was their right. Happened to my Mum once, badly disabled and walks with a stick. She had seats reserved, her trains were changed so shock horror, she no longer had a reserved seat. Everyone sat on their arse and watched a 75 year old woman who could barely walk with a stick stand for a couple of hours because hey, she should have reserved a seat. Makes me furious thinking about them all even now.

So yes, she was 'right' but had the compassion/empathy of a plastic bottle.

BecauseWeCanCanCan · 06/05/2018 16:38

Also, if it was the London to Edinburgh train, it tends to empty out after York so it would have been a couple of hours standing and then it gets e emptier again as you go further north - so not the whole journey standing.

HermesAndPinot · 06/05/2018 16:39

My post was deleted.

God forbid we speak against those who are too lazy get a grip.

The UK is fucked up... Brexit notwithstanding. I am so happy my daughters have second passports. You are a strange society. Hellbent on political correctness, whilst totally ignoring just how unfair a society you have become.

Saltcrust · 06/05/2018 16:41

Totally agree Becausewecancancan - I think this thread is one of the most depressing I have read in a while - and if that qualifies as pearl clutching then so be it.

Creambun2 · 06/05/2018 16:43

The front coach on london to Edinburgh services is a quiet coach. Why was your dd using headphones in there? Suspect this caused the dirty looks.

Otterseatpuffinsdontthey · 06/05/2018 16:43

@BecauseWeCanCanCan
Totally agreed, and was empathetic with your post - however, the last sentence puts you into the same category as the individual, with the walking stick.

Booie09 · 06/05/2018 16:47

It a all in how you ask isn't it! I suspect because your daughter was a teenager she decided to pick on her....some people are so rude.

Soubriquet · 06/05/2018 16:51

The front coach on london to Edinburgh services is a quiet coach. Why was your dd using headphones in there? Suspect this caused the dirty looks.

HmmHmm

Not using headphones would receive dirty looks. Using headphones with the music at a decent level is fine

JiminyBillyBob · 06/05/2018 16:51

No way I’d give up a reserved seat! She should have booked one herself!

Creambun2 · 06/05/2018 16:57

@soubriquet

Oh so you another one of these selfish idiots who doesn't understand what a quiet coach is.

Soubriquet · 06/05/2018 16:58

No...it's a quiet coach. Not a silent coach. Some noise is acceptable and how is someone listening to their music on headphones bothering others?

Bluesmartiesarebest · 06/05/2018 17:05

I’m disabled. It’s because of similar attitudes shown on this thread that I stopped using any public transport around 10 years ago. Sometimes trains get cancelled so an earlier seat reservation isn’t valid on a later train. If I can’t drive or get a taxi, I don’t go.

BecauseWeCanCanCan · 06/05/2018 17:11

Bluesmarties I know, that's exactly what happened to my Mum - train changed, therefore no reservations. Everyone sat still and watched an old woman with a stick and a bad stoop stood for two hours. I don't honestly understand who would do that and not feel ashamed of themselves.

TheFairyCaravan · 06/05/2018 17:14

@BecauseWeCanCanCan I completely agree with you.

I’d be so bloody ashamed of my kids if they had behaved like the OP’s daughter.

Jonbb · 06/05/2018 17:19

I wouldn't wait to be asked, I would have offered, and yes I think your daughter should have offered too.

corythatwas · 06/05/2018 17:20

Having said this, my dd has been the disabled teenager who has felt obliged to give up her seat (and paid dearly for it) because consensus is that it is the young people who should stand and nobody else has offered.

Which is why I'd like a general code of chivalry where anybody who felt strong enough would offer, rather than someone who isn't strong enough to stand up for herself (suspected BPD) feeling pushed into it.

Huffinpuff · 06/05/2018 17:21

I’d be so bloody ashamed of my kids if they had behaved like the OP’s daughter.
I think this thread is one of the most depressing I have read in a while
Echo these sentiments x 100.
Surely the teenager could have sat on the floor for a few stops if she didn't have the common sense was too shy to go and find a guard.
Disgraceful behaviour.

BecauseWeCanCanCan · 06/05/2018 17:23

corythatwas absolutely right!! People who feel they can stand should stand - it's not an age thing at all. Having said that, as a teenager I was fitter and stronger than I would be again, so it's not unrealistic to expect they would be the ones most willing to stand without a second thought. But I would be equally horrified if my husband said that he carried on sitting down self-righteously because he had a reserved seat and preferred to watch an old lady with a stick stand in front of him.

NotAgainYoda · 06/05/2018 17:24

This is very much a wind-them-up-and-let-them-run thread

Such fun

AlmostAJillSandwich · 06/05/2018 17:25

Come on, nobody actually WANTS to stand for 4 hours in an uncomfortable, hot, moving vehicle. Anybody would be tired and sore at the end of that, regardless of your age, or the clothing/shoes you're wearing, what hand luggage you have to hold, if you're already sleepy/were hoping to sleep on the journey etc. When you're not there and actually being asked to, it's easy to take the high road and claim you would have given up your seat (i don't travel on trains so no idea if you pay for the privilege of reserving, but surely if you do you don't happily give money away free anywhere else in life so willingly) so to say you're disappointed/ashamed OP's daughter kept her seat is a bit rich, especially without knowing every last detail of the circumstances.

I'm only 28, look physically healthy enough, but i have back, neck and knee issues due to a car crash a year ago, plus i have an unstable bladder, which gives symptoms matching those of urge incontinence if i am standing for even a relatively short length of time, completely without warning. I'd be in significant distress standing for even 5 minutes and risking wetting myself, let alone 4 hours, it would be physically impossible for me. This woman, and those suspected of giving dirty looks, could not have known whether or not your daughter was physically healthy and without disability (nor expect her to declare it to strangers when putting her on the spot if she did) and should never have targeted her directly but asked a more general question to the carriage.

Your daughter clearly told her no, that she had reserved her seat and wasn't willing to give it up, at which point the lady should have had the grace to ask someone else/the carriage as a whole. Her making a judgement without knowing your daughter that she needed the seat less and again pressing her to give up her seat, was rude, and could even have come across as aggressive. I can understand your daughter feeling embarrassed and awkward by this point, and trying to diffuse the tension by putting in her earphones, even if she doesn't suffer from any form of social anxiety, so that wasn't necessarily a rude response either.

I don't agree with previous posters that she should have gone to find the guard, or offered to help look for him etc. By moving out of her seat, what is to say the lady wouldn't immediately have sat down and refused to move, or that someone else wouldn't come along and sit in it while she was gone, and refuse to move? I'm assuming even the guard cannot physically remove somebody from the seat, even if it is a reserved one they have sat in, nor is there a guarantee of a seat elsewhere or the invitation to sit in first class without cost as an alternative. She probably just wanted to be left alone and protect herself and her reserved seat, get where she was going and not be hassled.

Ideally the lady should have reserved her own seat, or gotten there earlier to secure an unreserved or priority one. Even if she was traveling last minute, the latter option should still have been open to her. She took the chance and it didn't pay off, by all means politely ask a general group if anyone can offer a seat, but don't expect one, single anyone out, or refuse to take an initial polite refusal for an answer. As for the other passengers, well, none of them jumped up to offer did they, so they are hypocrites if they are judging her for not giving her seat up.

fontofnoknowledge · 06/05/2018 17:28

No sorry, mobility issues don't mean you are mentally incapable. She should of booked a seat instead of assuming the walking stick was her passport to someone else's reserved seat. There is no excuse. How dare she make a teenager feel bad. Bet she didn't ask the middle aged bloke in a business suit !

Last year I travelled on a train from London to Glasgow. The exact same thing happened. Woman in her late 40s with a walking stick hobbles through the carriage. Gets to the teenage/early 20s girl in front of me and asks for her seat. This poor girl did give up her seat. I felt so sorry for her that I told her we would share my seat and swap places every half an hour..
tThe train stopped at Carlisle . Disabled woman stood up and got of the train. Leaving her walking stick down the side of the seat. We both watched her. Thought maybe she had forgotten it. She literally jumped of the step on to the platform and stride of down the platform. !

So angry. Spoke to the guard a bit later. Apparently it's a common scam if you need to go on a long journey and haven't booked.

Impaired mobility does not mean impaired ability to book !

NotAgainYoda · 06/05/2018 17:30

This reply has been deleted

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ALongHardWinter · 06/05/2018 17:33

Firstly,the woman with the walking stick should have reserved her OWN seat instead of expecting someone to give up theirs. Secondly,if the people giving her dirty looks afterwards were that bothered,why didn't one of them offer her their seat? I'm disabled and cannot stand on moving trains or buses,but I would never expect someone who had paid to reserve a seat to give it up for me!