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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

To think unversal credit is a disaster *trigger warning*

902 replies

jnfrrss · 05/05/2018 08:31

This just popped up in my feed. Talking about someone that had an abortion as they wouldn't be able to afford the child without credits. It's not just an isolated issue, a charity says they've had a huge increase in women contacting about abortions as now they won't be able to afford to have any more children. I'm not sure what the answer is but this is very worrying

www.mirror.co.uk/money/it-wasnt-planned-very-wanted-12480380

OP posts:
michellejj · 05/05/2018 09:49

@Smeaton "I dont know how much I'll get when it finally comes through. "

You can find that out online using a benefits calculator: www.betteroffcalculator.co.uk/#/free

Moreover, don't forget that you might be eligible for council tax support, which has not been replaced by UC and is still run by councils.

mimibunz · 05/05/2018 09:50

Personal responsibility, contraception and being a contributing member of society is the answer. And btw, contraception used correctly DOES work! Most of the people who say they got pregnant whilst on contraception are bullshitting.

Smeaton · 05/05/2018 09:50

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

BoxsetsAndPopcorn · 05/05/2018 09:52

Crunchy, should we not be judgemental then of people having children they can't support? It's not good for the child and their outcomes will be limited and the cycle repeats. Why on earth would anybody encourage that?

They are free to go on to have more than two children but would do so in the knowledge no more money would be forthcoming. Those that truly want to be the best parent they can will ensure they are financially secure before becoming a parent rather than putting their own selfish wants first regardless of the impact on the child.

SinisterBumFacedCat · 05/05/2018 09:52

Why aren’t people angry about the insecurity of zero hour contracts, crap wages, rising cost of living, exorbitant rents, lack of affordable housing and the rise in the need for food banks?

Because we live in a blame culture and the buck stops at the nearest most visible and vulnerable human. Wouldn't it be great if the Daily Fail went after MOH landlords who get £5,000 in rent from poorly adapted semis, but no it's easier to go after the vulnerable tenants in rooms barely big enough to lie down in, rather than the landlords, maybe because they're their readship.

Smeddum · 05/05/2018 09:52

Personal responsibility, contraception and being a contributing member of society is the answer. And btw, contraception used correctly DOES work! Most of the people who say they got pregnant whilst on contraception are bullshitting

I find your use of the word bullshit very ironic.

“Contributing member of society” who the actual fuck do you think you are? You’re effectively saying that anyone on benefits is not a contributing member of society? Fuck off.

Smeddum · 05/05/2018 09:53

@SinisterBumFacedCat you’re absolutely spot on. It’s easier to blame the people who don’t have a choice than it is to blame the people who have a boot on their neck. Because they’re the taxpayers probably! Ugh.

BoxsetsAndPopcorn · 05/05/2018 10:00

People do have a choice though. Being born unequal to others doesn't mean that they can absolve themselves of personal responsibility.

We all choose where to live, where to work, if we have children etc. The main difference being that some will make those decisions based on their income and others won't even look at the finances as believe others should pay and have a myriad of excuses as to why they should.

mirime · 05/05/2018 10:01

@NewYearNewMe18

Anyone can have a contraceptive slip up, so get the MAP as a precaution.

What every time you have sex you should take the MAP? Because otherwise you can only take it if you know your contraception was likely to be less effective. I've got the Mirena so the chances of an unwanted pregnancy are very small but nothing is 100% effective and if it doesn't work it's quite likely I wouldn't know until it was too late for emergency contraception.

I also know of two children born after the MAP failed.

Ollivander84 · 05/05/2018 10:03

It's not really just UC though
I have a full time and part time job and if I got pregnant I would terminate as I can't afford a child

Lifeisabeach09 · 05/05/2018 10:03

Boxset, you can't plan for every eventuality.
You could be a married couple with two children, and a third on the way and living completely within the means of the family. Then DH walks out and the household is down one income and no longer able to afford the bills. This is just a scenario example but it does happen.

I do feel there should be caps but I don't feel the lowest paid should be continually penalised by measures imposed by UC and government cutbacks whilst big business gets away with paying low wages and landlords rake in high rents (as other PPs have said.)

Smeddum · 05/05/2018 10:05

We all choose where to live, where to work, if we have children etc

This absolutely highlights your absolute lack of understanding of the situation. Choice? Choice is something that comes with money and opportunities. Your naivety is staggering.

TeasndToast · 05/05/2018 10:06

The idea that ‘people can support themselves’ always comes from people on decent salaries. I understand why people think this. It seems like common sense right? Don’t have children you can’t afford?

But that view really comes from a place of privilege. Policies that were made prior to the benefit cap have shafted the working classes. Before that Thatcher years, coal mining communities were headed by one man, one wage and almost all owned a house.

Unless you have the skills and qualifications to earn great money now, house prices, land ownership etc are out of your reach. We need people to do all jobs. People are living much longer yet are living in poor health. Who will look after you in old age? Nobody on 60K I promise you.

If you work full time then there should absolutely be a way for you to buy a house and pay your bills without help. The benefit cap for a third child should NOT apply to working people. We need more young people and if you are working in a low paid job you are paying more than just taxes into the system.

By all means cap it once policies are in place so that everyone has an equal chance, through hard work, to chance their circumstances. Not just those with a good education, high intellect or academic ability because you will all need someone to feed you porridge and wipe your bums if you ever get to live long enough.

mirime · 05/05/2018 10:07

@BoxsetsAndPopcorn

We all choose where to live, where to work

Most people have limited choices. I wouldn't have chosen to buy a house in the area we did if we'd had more money - lack of money does seriously limit your choices. I wanted to go to Uni and then do a PGCE, poor health scuppered that dream, not poor choices.

noeffingidea · 05/05/2018 10:07

Of course there are many problems with UC , this story doesn't support that IMO. Many families have to make a hard choice when it comes to the birth of a child, especially with second and subsequent children. I think a lot of people in this situation would have taken the attitude of 'we'll manage somehow', no matter how tough that was likely to be.

TeasndToast · 05/05/2018 10:08

change their circumstances

TeasndToast · 05/05/2018 10:09

Nope. I’m afraid to tell you that the choices for those on the fringes of society are extremely limited.

ChickenOrEgg6 · 05/05/2018 10:14

Won't all benefits eventually be universal credit? Apologies if I am wrong.
I wonder if it'll change public opinion when people realise that "those scroungers" includes their family too (with their universal credit in place of working tax credits or to cover childcare). As I understand it, that's a rather large % of claimants

Smeaton · 05/05/2018 10:16

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

crunchymint · 05/05/2018 10:17

I am amazed that anyone thinks we all choose where to work. Many of us take a job we can get, any job. We don't all have choices.

I honestly think those who judge the poor in this way have not a single bit of understanding of what life is really like if you are poor.

worridmum · 05/05/2018 10:17

if your not middle class and above your choices are very limited. Wages stagnate yet rent raises year on year back in the 60/70s rent did not even reach 50% of the average take home pay now days it can easily reach 90% for shit holes.

crunchymint · 05/05/2018 10:19

Yes all benefits will be universal credit and already are in some areas for new claimants. Which means anyone who gets any kind of benefit will have to deal with this nightmare system.

Puzzledandpissedoff · 05/05/2018 10:20

Being born unequal to others doesn't mean that they can absolve themselves of personal responsibility

This ^^

ohreallyohreallyoh · 05/05/2018 10:21

Personal responsibility, contraception and being a contributing member of society is the answer

Hahahahaha! I am a single parent and a full time teacher. I receive a considerable amount each month in tax credits and if I didn’t own my own home, I would be eligible to receive housing benefit. I am a contributing member of society - more so than some since my children have been well brought up which is more than I can say for some of the little darlings I work with on a daily basis - but there are still people out there who think they can judge me, my lifestyle, my choices. So to you, and everyone else who thinks life is so, so simple, just sod right off.

TeasndToast · 05/05/2018 10:24

mimibunz, perhaps you could educate my doctor on the fact my depo failure is just ‘bullshit’. Perhaps she can change my medical records and stop saying to people like me ‘you weren’t the first and you won’t be the last’.