AIBU for this to make me sad that he's had his head turned?

[Buttmonkey86]

I think or rather hope I'm being a bit silly. I don't want to bring it up with real life people.

My partner works in a creative environment for a large company. About six months ago he was part responsible for the hiring of a new woman.

I don't think for a second he would ever do anything about this, but he's never mentioned her since. Ever. He talks about some work people but not her. We have a mutual friend who has befriended this woman and says she's lovely, has fabulous style (important there) and is hilarious. She has also mentioned she's seen my partner looking at her a lot and trying to make her laugh. She said she's seen them have a couple of eye contact moments but the woman usually walks away quickly.

I've seen her once in person and she's very pretty. I didn't like the way I saw my partner watching her though, like he couldn't help himself. He didn't know I'd arrived to collect him early and I saw this through the windows.

AIBU to feel sad about this? Like I said, I don't think he'd do anything about her...I just feel down that he's had his head turned. In the five years we've been together this hasn't happened before

[OW] said she was 'open to whatever' and his reply was 'Really good to know'.

[mutual friend] was there covertly reading when the woman read it herself and she kind of made a surprised but laughed expression.

So, forgive me, because these little nuances matter; your mutual friend happened to be reading his reply at the same time as OW read it for the first time also and OW had a laughing surprised sort of response at ''really good to know''. Yes?

Hmm. Under the circs. this is flirting IMO.

Yes that's right, Laiste

The woman's email was about work and signed off open to whatever and he sent that back.

I asked two friends in rl without context obviously and they both thought good to know sounded a strange response

Hi Butt
I commented some pages back, not with anything particularly helpful mind you. Still here, still reading and still hoping for the best for you . You sound lovely. With regards to this situation it's all really just speculation at this point isn't it? There have been various exchanges between your DP (I know you're not married!) and his colleague and now some emails have cropped up. I really don't know what to make of it all but obviously, understandably, it is giving you an uneasy feeling.

I really don't know what to suggest. I understand you don't want to keep bringing it up but obviously it is playing on your mind a lot. Maybe tell him this and then see if your work friend notices a change in the dynamic between them. I think having your friend there and able to report things back to you is adding quite a complexity to this.

Yes the ability to ask your friend is adding a layer of torture to this. Those turns of phrases are very American, it’d be less suspicious if more people were copied/group email. Significant new client emails don’t go between just 2 people in my firm.

Not sure what all this is worth, you’d be better off not knowing bad you’re not going to kick him out before a clear line is crossed.

Work on your life op. That’s what you should do. Your career, your dc, your friends and family.

Surely the more important question is how did YOU feel when you heard that he'd said that?

If you felt sad, that's the red flag we're picking up on.

It's flirtatious language, I wouldn't even consider it without the background. But in his shoes I would be avoiding this woman as much as possible and keeping communication brief, unquestionably professional and to the point. He is not.

Hope you're doing ok Butt, this must all be so frustrating to hear about.

My feeling about that email is that he may as well have put a after 'really good to know', it's definitely VERY flirtatious talk.

I'm still calling emotional affair. The question is whether you believe that. And if you do, what you want to do/can do about it? Financially are you dependent on him? Is it worth getting your 'ducks in a row' so that you could act quickly if necessary?

I think he needs some kind of shock, especially as he's already proved that telling him how unhappy you are about his behaviour hasn't worked. I think it's time for an ultimatum, but of course you can only issue ultimatums if you are prepared to carry out the threat.

Op I asked a while back, but obvs you had so many posts to read- what makes you think they aren’t having an affair ?

Hi Butt, sorry if this has already been said; I suspect your dp is not deliberately deceiving you. But he is deliberately deceiving himself.

IME when people say of affairs "it just happened", they don't think they're lying. Because at the time they tell themselves that their actions don't mean anything, that they're just being friendly, that it's innocent, that they know where the line is. The tell themselves this so that they can continue feeling good over a shared look, a jokey photo or a friendly email. You'd do this sort of thing with any of your friends so it's no different, right? Just because you have a crush, it's no different.

Except it is.

Your dp would not be alone in lacking the self-awareness to see that he has hoodwinked himself so he doesn't have to stop. That means he's not in control. That means it could snowball.

Affairs are often an exercise in self-deception and indulgence; I wish I had some good advice! Personally I would be saying "you act now to protect our relationship by pulling way back out of this friendship, or I won't wait around for the consequences". But I can see that wouldn't be for everyone.

There's a book - Not Just friends - that both aids healing after infidelity, but crucially teaches you how to protect yourself from it. A book's probably the most impractical suggestion ever, but I've seen it mentioned before as something couples should read together:

"Good people in good marriages are having affairs. The workplace and the Internet have become fertile breeding grounds for "friendships" that can slowly and insidiously turn into love affairs. Yet you can protect your relationship from emotional or sexual betrayal by recognizing the red flags that mark the stages of slipping into an improper, dangerous intimacy that can threaten your marriage."

Sorry for the essay - wish I could be more help.

The content of their emails don't exactly sound as if they are work related. "Open to whatever" "really good to know" surprised laugh.
Think about the facts..and think about what you already know..When you are putting it into context, these two people have a mutual attraction to each other, he has been distracted by her to the point he is walking into things at work..and (and this alone would give me the rage) she has said she is refusing to keep a respectful distance from him.
I would have had strong words and given him an ultimatum or temporarily asked him to leave by now.
I feel sick to the stomach on your behalf OP.

Conference, the just between two people thing isnt unusual where they are. Its a gallery type space rather than corporate

throwcushions, sorry if ive misread - you wouldnt consider what without the background?

To answer your question with how it made me feel - taken aback.

tootstastic, so it seems the general consensus under any circumstances is that it doesnt sound innocent /the same as ok great etc

Im not financially dependant on him, no. We'd be ok

SirVix, gut feeling I guess. Hes not changed at all with me. We've got a family holiday booked in June with his parents too. He's always here etc

RatRolyPoly that was really helpful, thank you. And really interesting as I have a horrible feeling youre right. Maybe that's why he's not changed with me...

You know this is wrong on every level, I think you are just grasping at straws that all this could be perfectly innocent and I can understand that, but how long can you put up with this mental torture?

Lovely post RatRolyPoly

Hello op! Just read this whole thing, really sorry your feeling like this! You sound like a lovely person. Every relationship I’ve been in they have cheated relentlessly so my advice probably will seem a bit extreme.. I must admit it’s good your partner was honest about the looking, although that doesn’t make you feel any better. In my opinion if it’s talked about and he knows that you find it a big problem, if there was a possibility of anything happening, he would be aware he was in the spotlight as you’ve already brought it to attention, and as for the other woman, I’d say she’s certainly in the wrong if she’s aware he has you, and she’s telling your friend she’s finding it hard to keep away. She knows he’s off limits simple as that and if she was any sort of respectful person she would put him out of her mind and keep away. Like I say this might sound a bit much but I’d speak to her myself and tell her to keep away. Even if you just send a message or tell your friend to let her know your not happy, people are capable of horrible things and she needs to back off, and with your partner I’d have one more conversation and maybe tell him you can’t shake this out of your head, your really hurt and worried by it and it’s befoming a big problem for you, try and put this to bed or do something about it otherwise you might continue to feel like this if they both keep working together, like I said I’m really sorry your going through this but don’t ever feel silly for being bothered or anything like that because it’s totally natural it’s your man at the end of the day

Thanks for your support x

Id never speak to her as in her shoe,

I'd find that crazy. I wouldnt embarrass myself like that, she owes me nothing and he's the one that needs to 'choose' us.

Definitely not innocent and that was only the message your friend saw. I would be very surprised if they aren't communicating by another online media in private.

You say he needs to choose you, are you willing to watch him have an affair as long as he doesn't leave in the end?

Hi I've also been following your thread nearly from the beginning and sorry you're going through this.

I have to say I do think there's a potentially innocent explanation to that email I can imagine that being said in a professional context you could analyse it to death and you'll never find out for certain. But I think this email is a bit of a red herring.

I think when you get to the point of trying to decipher fragments of an email related second hand, you've got to step back and admit to yourself that the trust had gone.

This is going to sound harsh, and I understand why you're doing your due diligence before you throw a family away so I don't want to sound like I'm judging or pushing you.

But the bottom line is that he now knows that this situation is making you extremely unhappy and putting his family at risk. And he's still refusing to do what he needs to do to put your mind at rest and put his family first.

I understand he has professional commitments and needs to maintain a friendly façade and all that. But if he was really prioritising this there at steps he could have taken. He could have confided in her and told her that they need to cease contact. He could have spoken to a superior. These are stark and melodramatic choices but they would have done the job. And he hasn't done the job.

This doesn't mean he's heading for a full on affair or checked out. But it does mean that he's not dealing with the urgency of this. Until you force him to deal with it you are going to be here weeks on, trying to read the tea leaves on another snatched snippet of conversation relayed third hand and worrying about what it means for your relationship.

I really don't want to sound hurtful here - I've been through similar and I know how hard it is. But you need to take the power back and force him to deal with it.

Cuppa, I know you've read through it all (thanks! ) - without any context at all, would you still think the email exchange was more than friendly?

I know some think its silly questioning etc but it helps me process

To answer about what will it take... something concrete but I dont think I'll know till if/when it happens

Thing is OP, you're painting yourself into a corner here because you're waiting for some concrete thing to happen to show that a line has definitely been crossed, and you don't want to do anything you see as intervening, but you do want your DP to pull back. That just doesn't look likely on current form, and it's almost as if then he has tacit approval to carry on as he is (not wishing to blame you for that in any way). I know you want him to make that choice himself, but would you rather it came to you declaring things over because he'd now crossed this line, than do anything at all more to hold him back?

Absolutely, in short. That may seem crazy to some, but I couldn't continue in a relationship without that being the exact situation. If I 'do' anything more than I already have, then I'll always wonder what if...Or would he stay out of obligation/guilt

If that email exchange was between two male co-workers - 'i'm open to whatever' 'that's good to know' - i'd think nothing of it.

A random female co-worker ''open to whatever'' with a male ''good to know'' - i'd think ... ooh, i wonder what the actual subject matter is? I guess neither of them realised the double entendre here.

A man and woman who have admitted feelings for each other? Well, she's saying she's 'wide open' and he's saying ''great, thanks!''.

Cuppa, I know you've read through it all (thanks! ) - without any context at all, would you still think the email exchange was more than friendly?

I'd think it sexual flirtation and it sounds like the Woman took it as that too.