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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

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Original poster

AIBU to not want to work that hard

454 replies

Greentomato82 · 16/04/2018 23:17

Not about SAHM / WOHM but about work generally, men and women alike, DC or no DC. Reading a lot of threads on here people often say they work mainly because they 'want' to work and that it's an important part of their identity etc. I know that some jobs are a real vocation, and obviously we all need money, but surely lots of jobs are a bit meh really and with a lottery win most of us would give it up or at least treat it as more of a hobby? I just seem to hear this more and more, lots about career building and ambition. Frankly I am not going to change the word any time soon and that suits me just fine. I want to rebel a bit and enjoy life. We generally work at least 9-5, 5 days a week for decades to pay the mortgage and bills because that's what we're supposed to do. Those at the top get richer and I can't help but feel like we're gradually being coaxed into a trap of believing our work is more important than it is to justify spending so much time there. I don't like that schools are focused on creating a 'productive' workforce of tomorrow, or that I'm viewed as a unit of productivity and the obsession with GDP. We're not ants surely? Am I the only grumpy one that wants to go off grid and hibernate from all the busy productive people. I'm not lazy but I just don't get it. AIBU?

OP posts:

YellowMeeple · 17/04/2018 07:27

Doesn’t it just go to show that all people aren’t the same and all jobs aren’t the same. I have worked myself up to a senior position in a professional job, I work long hours and I genuinely love it. I am fortunate that it pays very well, but I would genuinely carry on if my wage was slashed in half as I get so much enjoyment from the challenge. But we’re not all the same, I have always had a very competitive streak, not something I’m particularly proud of, and work allows me to feed that side of my personality whilst still remaining bearable company for my family and friends! I don’t know where I could get the same competitive challenge and satisfaction from knowing I have performed well outside work. I did try going part time after having the DCs but I hated it- it was so damn unmeasurable! Plus my working has enabled DH to go part time and enjoy his hobbies while the DCs are at school.

Surely the point is that we all need to work out what our individual version of fulfilment looks like and then try to get there within the constraints of available time and minimum financial requirement. However it is very much possible to genuinely enjoy work.

Anniegetyourgun · 17/04/2018 07:31

Meanwhile there are thousands of working-aged people who can't even find a job, Youngsters who have no work history to prove their employability are particularly stuffed. If those of us who have employment could dial down the hours a bit it would throw up a load of spare working hours for others. Splitting the available salary between more employees should surely be a whole lot more socially acceptable than one person flogging their guts out while another lives off a portion of the working person's taxes. But the non-working person is told they're naughty for not finding the job that is being covered by the working person doing 60+ hours a week. They could both be doing 30 hours, or one doing 40 and one doing 20 if that suited both better. OK, not all jobs neatly divide like that, but many could and it isn't even being tried.

gamerwidow · 17/04/2018 07:34

As long as you earn enough to support yourself it doesn't matter how much or how little you work.
I always feel a bit sorry for these feel driven people who make their work their life. I don't think the sacrifices needed to be super rich and successful are worth it.

adaline · 17/04/2018 07:35

Oh I completely agree OP.

I don't get it. I work full-time as a shop supervisor and my manager is often telling me I could be an area manager one day. Err, no thank you. I don't want the long hours or the long drives to different areas - I want to go home at 5pm and forget about it all!

bananafish81 · 17/04/2018 07:37

I wasn't able to world for 9 months during a period of medical treatment. We can't have children, so no DC at home. Not working drove me potty, because my career is such a huge part of my identity. I'm really, really good at my job. I find work interesting and challenging and intellectually stimulating. I meet lots of interesting people. I get to learn so much. The time I was at home during my treatment I felt like a total non person, and not contrinuring to society. Can't have children, so can't do what I'm biologically supposed to be able to do, and want so desperately. All our fertile treatment failed. Never have I tried so hard to get precisely nowhere. If I had DC then I'm sure I would feel very differently, because there would be a very strong incentive to not have work as a major focus in my life. But I don't. And being back at work now has had a significant positive effect on my mental health. I can feel good at something!

If I wasn't working then I'd have to take up some kind of role in the voluntary sector to use my skills and occupy my time. DH and I don't want to be in each other's company ALL DAY every day. I'd prefer to have a family to occupy my time, but things didn't work out that way. So can't imagine the benefits of giving up work unless I were to exchange that for something similar in the voluntary sector, if money weren't an issue

TinaTop · 17/04/2018 07:38

YANBU. Work is great if you're one of the lucky few who are well paid for an interesting job. Unfortunately there aren't enough of that sort of job to go round. Most people are either bored sick, or poorly paid for their effort, or both. It's not surprising that people with poor quality job options drop out, either by claiming benefits or by working minimal hours and just scraping by financially. I'd rather live in poverty than spend 40 hours a week asking if you'd like fries with that. I always thought it was unfair that I'd have to work for 30-40 years before I had enough money to step back and enjoy my life. Aged 18 I remember thinking I want to enjoy my life now!

angularmerkel · 17/04/2018 07:38

I couldn't agree more OP. Particularly regarding education having a 'churn out a workforce' focus.

Sevendown · 17/04/2018 07:39

Historically it goes back to the concept of the ‘Protestant work ethic’. In Northern Europe it was too cold to sit around so a culture of ‘business’ emerged which was connected with religious belief.

That idea has stuck in uk and USA culture where Work is valued for its own sake rather than as a means of survival.

YellowMeeple · 17/04/2018 07:41

Anniegetyourgun surely the issue with that is that people work 60 hour weeks for one of two reasons 1) they want to or 2) they need to to meet their financial minimum requirements. I am going to generalise massively but I would expect most people in the first category are doing skilled jobs where the workforce simply isn’t there to soak UK the hours without massively rethinking education and training (and many people have no desire to spend 3-5 years studying on their evenings and weekends to gain a professional qualification).

The people in the second category could have their jobs split but they need the hours. As far as I can see the only way your idea works is if we change our entire economic model so that all jobs/training pay the same and all jobs have the same hours. Essentially communism.

TinaTop · 17/04/2018 07:42

the non-working person is told they're naughty for not finding the job that is being covered by the working person doing 60+ hours a week.

This is me and DH. I've struggled to find work while he's at work 12 hours a day. It seems ridiculous considering I'm bored while he's overworked and wants more time off!

silverpenguin · 17/04/2018 07:43

OP I could have written your post. I think it's fascinating though, that so many people really do care about their careers. I'm never sure if I have the "wrong" attitude or if I just chose the "wrong" career, but if I win the lottery I'd be off like a shot!

TinaTop · 17/04/2018 07:46

Particularly regarding education having a 'churn out a workforce' focus.
I disagree. The focus of education is keeping teachers and other staff in jobs. As a teacher I taught my classes because I got paid to, even though I knew that very few of my students ever managed to get decent jobs and most would end up in call centres regardless of what I taught them.

Gwenhwyfar · 17/04/2018 07:46

"Who is to say 40 hours is the right amount of time anyway?"

40 hours? I've never been contracted for more than 37. 35 for most of my life and even that is much more than I'd want to work!

Work to live not live to work.

I also think young people shouldn't rush to get their first jobs. They'll be working till at least 70 so why not get as many years as you can not having to work. It's more difficult to get back to studies later on so young people should concentrate on education and training while they can.

Ryder63 · 17/04/2018 07:47

UBI! it will have to come sometime. I hope in my lifetime. I'm in my 60s though, so don't hold out much hope

TinaTop · 17/04/2018 07:51

During the Depression in the 1930s there was high unemployment, so the standard work week was reduced from 6 days to 5 to spread the work around. Imo it's time we reduced it to 4 days for the same reason! More people would have jobs and a better work life balance.

DrDreReturns · 17/04/2018 07:52

Work to live not live to work.

This is what I was going to say! I'd give up work tomorrow if I could. After twenty years the novelty has definitely worn off. I do find bits of it interesting and I work with nice people, but I'd still rather be doing my own thing.

It annoys me when people ask you what you do when you meet them for the first time. As if your job is an intrinsic part of your identity. Not for me it isn't!

Gwenhwyfar · 17/04/2018 07:54

"Not working drove me potty, because my career is such a huge part of my identity. I'm really, really good at my job. I find work interesting and challenging and intellectually stimulating. I meet lots of interesting people. I get to learn so much. "

Most people don't have all that in their jobs or maybe aren't good at it so the way you felt at home with nothing to do is how they feel at work every day.

Gwenhwyfar · 17/04/2018 07:55

"it's time we reduced it to 4 days for the same reason! More people would have jobs and a better work life balance."

And for people currently on a low income? I couldn't afford to lose a day's work (unless the price of everything went down to compensate).

Unihorn · 17/04/2018 07:55

I'm with you. I don't mind working because I like my colleagues but I would be out of there like a shot as soon as I could. I reduced to part time after my first child and am on maternity leave with my second at the moment. I plan to take my second full year off. It means scrimping quite a bit towards the end but so be it!

bananafish81 · 17/04/2018 07:56

It annoys me when people ask you what you do when you meet them for the first time. As if your job is an intrinsic part of your identity. Not for me it isn't!

For some of us it is. People also ask if you have a family pretty early on in conversations too. I don't get offended if people ask if I have kids. I can't, but work is a very core part of my identity. When I couldn't work I felt bereft.

TERFousBreakdown · 17/04/2018 07:57

the non-working person is told they're naughty for not finding the job that is being covered by the working person doing 60+ hours a week.

It's not quite that simple, though, surely? Because several of the kinds of jobs I can personally think of where these kinds of hours are the norm (e.g. doctors, lawyers, management consultants) are highly skilled professionals with very specific subject matter expertise even within their general field.

Even as a highly skilled professional myself, I couldn't possibly turn up at the local hospital today and take over halfway through a surgeon's shift. I could even be a trained physician (I'm not) and may still not have the exact skill set.

I agree that this may work for some positions - but not all, and people are not globally exchangeable.

As part of my job, I manage project managers. Nothing annoys me more than PMs believing they can simplythrow people at problems or randomly redistribute work among teams. Because it doesn't work. Just because it says 1 FTE absolutely doesn't mean that it won't matter who does the work or whether it's 5 different people working .2FTE on a task each or one doing it all.

DrDreReturns · 17/04/2018 07:58

Also TERFousBreakdown there's the rule 'adding more people to a late project makes it later!'

Gwenhwyfar · 17/04/2018 08:00

"I do find bits of it interesting and I work with nice people, but I'd still rather be doing my own thing."

Same here. In an ideal world, I'd work part time. A day or two a week.

TERFousBreakdown · 17/04/2018 08:02

@DrDreReturns, exactly. Or, as I like to put it: 9 women still don't make a baby in a month.

BarbaraofSevillle · 17/04/2018 08:03

We also need to end the presenteeism culture that causes people be expected to work 50/60/70 hours a week.

If the work genuinely takes that long, then the employer should employ more people, but sometimes people will work those hours because they want to be seen as indispensible, are perfectionists, are inefficient and spend time being unproductive, or are avoiding domestic responsibilities by hiding at work.

The Scandinavian culture where people work much shorter hours but are still as productive, if not more so, is much better for a good work life balance.

A lot of people would be happier with full time work, as opposed to part time if full time really meant 35-40 hours, not 50+. But agree that employers should also be more receptive to a 4 day week, maybe with slightly longer days, eg full time being 30-35 hours.

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