AIBU to not want to work that hard

[Greentomato82]

Not about SAHM / WOHM but about work generally, men and women alike, DC or no DC. Reading a lot of threads on here people often say they work mainly because they 'want' to work and that it's an important part of their identity etc. I know that some jobs are a real vocation, and obviously we all need money, but surely lots of jobs are a bit meh really and with a lottery win most of us would give it up or at least treat it as more of a hobby? I just seem to hear this more and more, lots about career building and ambition. Frankly I am not going to change the word any time soon and that suits me just fine. I want to rebel a bit and enjoy life. We generally work at least 9-5, 5 days a week for decades to pay the mortgage and bills because that's what we're supposed to do. Those at the top get richer and I can't help but feel like we're gradually being coaxed into a trap of believing our work is more important than it is to justify spending so much time there. I don't like that schools are focused on creating a 'productive' workforce of tomorrow, or that I'm viewed as a unit of productivity and the obsession with GDP. We're not ants surely? Am I the only grumpy one that wants to go off grid and hibernate from all the busy productive people. I'm not lazy but I just don't get it. AIBU?

Teacher I agree and as life goes on I'm less and less bothered about stuff like that.
We can wait to downsize to a minimum sized house, we take our holidays in our second hand fairly old camper van, have older cars etc.
Its worth it to work part time and dh will go part time as soon as we downsize.
A big posh house and expensive holidays just aren't a priority for us.

i love what i do and i would work whether i was paid or not. however i say this as someone who is senior in my profession (over 20 years experience) who runs their own business.

I earn excellent money, have brilliant clients who inspire me every day and are also great friends. i have a lifestyle i love - i don't care about material things but i love the experiences that money provides. i love to travel and am constantly exploring. i grew up extremely poor and it is incredible to me to not have to worry about money any more.

my job/career/profession sets me free in many ways.

I certainly didn't feel the same in my early 20's when i was slogging my guts out when at the start of my career.

i have definitely reaped the benefits of this attitude and tenacity though.

windygallows you're making a real assumption about everyone who has contributed to this thread. From the start I was talking about the role of work for men and women, not just women or SAHM's, and the pressures faced by men too

I'm a single parent and work FT about 55-60 hours/week so I am fully aware of the issues raised in this thread.

However, Green the problem is this threads always go one way which is women going on about how they've stopped working or only work 2 days/week and that gives them better 'work/life' balance and they posit that working less is the solution. But it's not. The solution is to find a DH or somebody else to pay your way -- that's the real answer underpinning MOST of these life/balance decisions. I wish they would just be honest about that rather than suggest that working less is the solution.

Windygallows you do have a point.
I'm one of those women. I've suggested him being pt but he knows pt jobs can be dull n low pay. His current f t managerial well paid job cannot be done pt.
So for now, I'm pt. I know that could change- i never take it for granted.

Once again for the smug and hard of thinking: just because you held down a job and got a mortgage 20 years ago does not mean that option is currently open to other people. The property boom has coincided with the holding down of wages. Nurses, teachers, mid-level civil servants, shop department managers etc cannot buy property because the cost of housing has outstripped what people can earn. This is why people object to being told to 'work harder if you want nice things'.

just because you held down a job and got a mortgage 20 years ago does not mean that option is currently open to other people

Reanimated, this is so true. It’s all very well working 50-60 hours a week if you are actually getting somewhere, things are improving. This is how life worked for my generation. All my kids have a work ethic, they work hard but seem to remain stationary.
In those circumstances I think it’s right to re-evaluate work and what it’s for.

Do you not think there is a distinction between this having to work resentment and the rapid rise in instant credit available these days.
I think it's all intertwined...
Mundane but essential jobs have always been there. The difference is. in my view, that we are all given a chance to escape and have a taste of better stuff, could be a newer car, a holiday, socialising, social media etc etc. Most of those cost money and money that most of us don't readily have, so the answer is often credit cards, overdraft, loans etc. Call it what you will, but the bottom line is....its debt!! and for something that needn't be, but that debt keeps us in the daily grind and when payday comes many treat themselves to something to cheer themselves up and so the cycle continues.
Clever stuff advertising and money lending, both promise you what you seek, but neither is really worth it in the long run.

windygallows fair enough, I do take your point, and actually you are right really, I wouldn't be going PT if my DH wasn't also contributing through PT work. It definitely wouldn't be an option otherwise.

windygallows spot on. It's all very well and good if you have a partner but if you're single (especially if you're a single parent) it's realistically not always a choice.

BitchQueen90 sometimes if you have a partner it is not always a choice.

speakout completely agree. But the majority who work PT are able to because they have another household income, that's all I meant.

Obviously I can only do this as dh works too but I do make his life easier by doing lots of the childcare and running around, cooking cleaning etc.
I was a lone parent for 6 years and only worked part time too as I couldn't cover the holidays with 4 dc. I was lucky enough to receive tax credits tho. I'm not sure it would be as easy now with universal credit.

windygallows I agree, I am the main wage earner and so going part-time is not an option for me. I would love a 4 day week, that would be my ideal. I won't be retiring early either, as I started working in a pensionable job later than some (due to children/studying) and so need now to stick it out to avoid poverty in old age.

A lot of these choices are very romanticized. Most people I know can't work part-time unless they have inherited a house (I know a couple who have done this and choose not to work too much), one partner works very long hours/f/t in a career type job to allow the other to be p/t, or they are working p/t to maximise benefits (esp with the old tax credits).

Really interesting discussion.

My background - I am well-educated with a first-class Science degree from a Russell Group university. When I graduated I was never that career-minded, it was a case of 'what do I do now?' I ended up in the insurance field which I hated so when dd1 came along I left. I spent the next 14 years being a SAHM bringing up 3 dc. I absolutely loved it, dh earns a good salary and I felt very grateful that we could afford for me to stay at home.

My plan was that when the dc were older I would do something new. I retrained in a new field and now work one/day per week. But I'm not enjoying it tbh. I much prefer my days at home doing my own thing than my working day. The thought of doing this job (with perhaps more days) for the rest of my working life doesn't make me happy. But I put time and effort (and cost) into doing the training course so I worry it would be a waste.

I don't think I'd want to not work at all as the dc get older and leave home but in some ways, I'd like a job that I can go in and do and go home and forget about. In my current job, even though it's only one day a week, it's a professional role and I have think about and plan during the week. And I hate the admin side of it - writing reports and so on.

I know some people love their jobs/careers and it really defines them. I'm not one of them.

inthedeepdarkwinter I think that was the point of me starting this thread though. I fully accept it's romanticised to work a 3-4 day week for the vast majority of us, and I guess I'm wondering why it's come to be that that's the case? If that's what a lot of us want/or even need at heart why, in a democracy, does the status quo make it impossible for so many when we should really control the system.

It just feels like we all accept it as the status quo a bit too readily and try to legitimise doing something we're not 100% ok with and in doing begin to sum up our value to society by our productivity at work. I just wish we could change things a bit.

why, in a democracy

One major complication is that the economy is almost entirely globalised, so national governments have less and less control over labour economics and trying to control hours through legislation without showing equal productivity doesnt work e.g. France has tried and now France is fucked. Their youth unemployment rate is insane.

For all our woes, half the world would love to be in our shoes. A lot of countries in Asia still work a 6 day week as standard.

Greentomato I agree with your original premise- it would be great if society were set up more in this way, or rather, that business and public sector were more open to the 4 day week idea like in some Nordic countries.

However, lots of people then came on and said that in fact they were already living in this utopia, which was mainly achieved through not being a wage slave/obsessed with work type of a person, and/or not placing such importance on material goods.

I think it's important to point out that I am not obsessed with my work or indeed fussed about material goods- I work f/t to RENT a house for my children, and we go on one cheap holiday to their other parent's homeland most years, usually borrowing to do so. It's not about rejecting multiple holidays and a bigger house- we don't have those things, and neither do many many people who work long hours and have to pull in two wages to survive (we only have one through circumstance).

Also, a lot of women already do work part-time in the UK, far more than men, because they are supported by men or supported by the state to do so. You could argue that it is in their economic interests to do so (to support the main wage earner or earn enough to maximise other finances such as benefits). So, in some ways, women are able to work fewer hours than men through gendered societal roles. I don't necessarily see that as a positive thing, though, if they can't use their qualifications/are under-employed/would prefer a different type of work than what is available around school hours.

I would prefer a more even gender split with men, but whether the men, who hold the economic power, want to downsize their lives and work 3/4 days and even things up with their partners is really quite questionable, in the UK at least. I do know a few couples who work on this model, it's not the norm.

You're fine, just as God made you.

Relax, and just enjoy being you. Don't try to be anyone else!

I work in retail and don't particularly enjoy it, however the majority of the people I work with are great and I would miss if I left, I think people can do what they want but I have advised my twin girls (18 years old) to find work in life they enjoy and don't follow my example, I respect anyone who works, people on benefits who don't work but could work really piss me off as they are lazy and not contributing to life and not setting a good example to their kids.

gilly do you mind me asking who you work for? I would love to work for John Lewis one day. I did a few summer stints there as a student and it seems like a great company to work for. And the perks are good!

Why are you seeking validation for this view? You know perfectly well that you're right that working hard to make money to spend on load of shit we don't need is a mugs game (although most of us a trapped in the cycle) and don't make us happier.

The belief that we need to work so many hours is just required by the cult of materialism. Once our basic needs are met there is really no need to work harder or buy more. That time should be spent in leisure and spending time with loved ones.

Go off grid and take your life back!

“I'd like a job that I can go in and do and go home and forget about”

My second career choice was to retrain as a Nurse. I will never be rich or even well off on that salary but I have a skill that will always be in demand. My thoughts ( fwiw) going forward into a more automated age is to do that. Leisure industry, caring, electronics would be my thoughts.
If we, the ordinary folks, do get a UBI in the future, having a skill in demand would mean you could work occasionally to top that up, or full time and retire early or pt.

Hiphopfrog "Why are you seeking validation for this view?"

for me it's been a real struggle to find anyone who agrees. I'm single and some of my friends are quite pissed off with me because I won't fork out to go and a lot of the things they do. They work long hours or enjoy their work and can't comprehend retiring early. Also love their gadgets and fashion etc.

I wish I knew more people who were okay with living simply but maybe it's a London thing - I have friends who accept it but it does get hard with things like birthdays when they think it's perfectly reasonable to go to a £60 restaurant and think I'm being a bit mean if I say no.

I admit I have got the £60 but it's for my retirement, it's not for spending on food when I'd be happy with a cheese toastie. It is getting better over the years....they know my door is always open and I will supply endless tea or wine or cheese toasties...but I am not one for the cult of materialism and given the popularity of it, I am clearly in a minority.

the run down area I live in is being "regenerated" and posh shops is a huge part of the plan. I will be even more out of place if they want a posh shop demographic here.

And before anyone says "move", if I did that within family and commuting distance it would take a huge chunk out of my retirement fund - I do plan to leave London when I don't have parents to look after - so I'd like to make the move once and not pay for an extra moving in between.

But does this "non consumer, just relax and be at mine for a cuppa" exist anywhere? Judging by the boom in coffee shops and pizza places, I think not.

someone upthread said we can still revolt. I think no one actually wants to. I realise a bunch of the people who want to don't get the chance because they are work so hard to survive - but still, how many of the working population actually want change?

SpringNowPlease2018 I agree with you - all this "stuff" people buy leaves me cold.

I drive a 13 year old car that cost me £700 four years ago.
95% of my clothes come from charity shops- ditto with furniture, crockery, curtains etc.
My make up is cheap, my tastes are simple. My last handbag cost me £1 .
I just rail against all this consumerism. I resent spending money on stuff that society tells me I need.
I am not sort of cash, but resent poor value.

SpringNowPlease2018 my material soul mate!

I live in Shipston on Stour and work in a boutique hotel but don't give a damn about expensive anything! In fact, the only time DH and I go out for dinner is when we have enough Tesco Clubcard vouchers to trade in 😁

My clothes are all from a charity shop, our curtains are home made (I'm handy with a sewing machine) and I make-do-and-mend rather than buy. Our food shop is on a tight budget and any extras we might need are bought with a spare-change pot!

We had one holiday to Paris before I fell pregnant and that was it. Our honeymoon was a caravan for 3 days in Tenby. It was lush