My partner is self employed, works at home, earns very little and rarely gets up in the morning. I'm so frustrated!

[Flexijane]

This is my first time talking on this site so thanks for reading, I'd really welcome some opinions and advice here, thank you!
My partner and I have been together 13 years and have 2 kids under 8.
He started working self employed from home when the first child was born and we agreed that we'd review the arrangement if it wasn't making enough money. I've had a series of steady part time jobs for the same company and although I'm not earning even £20k, it's still much more than him.

He's been supportive of me in my career and flexed his work when I need to work late, etc, but we have always done 50/50 of the childcare as we both feel strongly that we want to bring our own kids up and would rather be poor than any other arrangement.
He's a proud man so has also always insisted on paying 50/50 of all the bills too, however he has only recently admitted that we've only survived because the house bills aside, I've been paying for everything else (most of the holidays, kids clothes etc) plus we write down what we pay for things such as petrol and food in a book, then reconcile it after a few months, but he never ever does this. He waits for me to do it, so then owes me like £600 (for several months of these expenses) which he can't pay straight away so I have to just wait until he pays it.

We've been to couple counselling about this and many other issues we're having, it was kind of useful just thrashing it out, but he is stubborn and refuses to change his job (he would find it very difficult to get work as has nothing on his CV for 10 years or more, although is highly skilled in many ways)
I have tried to be patient all these years - he's a great dad and wants to be there for the kids all the time he can, so doesn't want to take on a low paid job that takes him away from them more - but I'm SO tired of our different views on cashflow.

The counsellor wanted to discuss why we both wanted everything to be 50/50 - I understand why she wanted to look at this, and I said to him I would be happy for us to move to a more proportional income set up (but not a pooled account! We do have a joint bills account) But he won't do this, saying he thinks I would resent him even more, and he could be right, because he can work whenever he likes, often gets up at 11am or later, watches TV late into the night - most people (me included) don't have this freedom! He says he works hard - but I don't see that..

I want us to save up for work on the house, better holidays etc but he never has any money and says he's happy staying at home, not eating out, "the best things in life are free" etc.
I want to chill out, but feel the love I had for him has all but gone, and has turned into resentment, I just don't feel any respect for him anymore.
Would making him get a better paid job regain that respect?
Is this all his problem or mine?
Help!

Slievenamon Hold on, if it was a woman who stayed at home to look after the children and keep on top of the house she would be told she is contributing in ways other than money. And by doing so is in fact saving the couple money on childcare, she would also be told to demand her husband helps with the childcare and the chores. So in this case the man is earning money albeit not a huge amount but is contributing to childcare and household chores but he is apparently lazy and just living off of the op? So when school holidays come who looks after the children? I’m assuming it’s the ops partner, the father of the children, therefore if he was to also get a part time job, what money is being brought in when childcare will have to then be paid for? They came to this agreement so they can both look after their children without needing childcare. They are getting by fine financially and the only reason the op wants the partner to work is to earn more money for extras. Maybe she should up her hours then or leave him and up her hours to pay for childcare. You cannot suggest they rely solely on family members because not always is that possible and often things happen that can mean they are left without childcare and missing work. If he got an evening job it could work out but then he is forced to give up what he does now, how is that fair?

But he’s not staying home to look after the children and do the housework, he’s staying home to have a lie in.

Why are people who are defending the DH the ones who are misunderstanding everything the OP has written?

Apart from Figgy - I am amazed you are managing to have holidays with 2 small children on such low wages maybe they need to go until things are more stable - who is making bits up!! Where does the OP say anyone has had a holiday?! She might wish for one, but as her DH only earns about £50 a week if that, she's not going to be packing her bucket and spade any time soon is she?!

@StaplesCorner, the OP says "I want us to save up for work on the house, better holidays etc" so they obviously do have holidays.

Maybe she means school holidays, like being able to do things in them. That’s what I thought when I read it.

What are people talking about?

Husband - gets up at 11. Does 2 school runs a week. Earns sporadically and without guaranteed income. Is out in the evenings. Stays up late watching tv.

Wife - works and covers finances until such time as husband brings in any money. Does 3 schools a week. Is home in the evenings looking after kids.

How is he doing 50/50? If this was reversed and a woman came on saying she earned very little, slept in til 11am, stayed up nights, did 2/5 school runs and was out in the evenings we'd all be saying her dh was a saint!

Quack

But from what the Op has said - they split the childcare very 50:50. She does more school drop offs (and is either doing the morning rush on her own as he lies in or is going early to work), he presumably does more pick ups and looks after them in the late afternoons, she then does the evenings (including bedtime) whilst he goes out to the gigs.

If he earnt a decent amount from his band managing and was the type of person who understood about saving for lean times when your income is sporadic then it would probably be a pretty perfect arrangement.

The problem is that his job seems to be more a “hobby where you earn a bit of pin money” rather than a real job. And that isn’t what they agreed as a family. And it sounds like they can’t afford to live like that as a family.

There you go then OP, your solution is cut out all the holidays?! I think we'll have to agree to differ until she comes back and tells us where she's been lately. E.g., been to Skegness for 2 nights but ideally would have liked a fortnight in the Seychelles

He can't leave as that is what his Dad did but he leads the life of a single man, odd hours, not getting out of bed. Not providing for the DCs properly (has he already saved their university fees??). And goodness knows what being a lazy, self indulgent man is setting as an example to DCs.
He doesn't want to leave as his DF did. DCs will probably be high achieving workaholics with him as a father.
I would say he needs to attend some counselling to work out what he actually does want in life and to deal with his DF leaving. Let's face it you aren't leaving the DCs with him so he needs to stop kidding himself how much he wants and cares for them, seems to me he comes first the kids second and his marriage last.

I think he's been very canny. He's used a very sad scenario (his dad leaving) and used it to create a situation where he's can pretend to himself and you that the reason he doesn't get a "real job" is so he can be there for his kids. He doesn't have a career, but your salary and generosity is allowing him to keep up this facade of being a "professional musician". No, he's a stay at home dad in a band, just one that doesn't really like the idea of some of the aspects of being a SAHP. Like getting up in the morning. It would be interesting to ask him when he sees the current arrangement changing- when both the kids are at secondary school? Uni? Or is he going to keep his diary clear for potential grandchildren?

As others have said, you're subsidising his hobby, albeit one for which he occasionally receives payment. I too know people in bands (one in particular is in a very well-known local one) and they all have other jobs, except for the ones where they have regular sets in pubs/bars every week which gives them a steady income. But even they aren't rolling in it, and they're working unsocial hours away from their kids and partners.

I would tell him that something needs to give because I was becoming more resentful with the current set-up. Either he leaves music all together to get a "proper job", gets PT hours to top-up his band money or takes on tutoring or similar or we go our separate ways on amicable terms before the relationship is trashed completely.

No, he's a stay at home dad in a band, just one that doesn't really like the idea of some of the aspects of being a SAHP. Like getting up in the morning. It would be interesting to ask him when he sees the current arrangement changing- when both the kids are at secondary school? Uni? Or is he going to keep his diary clear for potential grandchildren?

This!!!

There's no problem with a man giving up the traditional role of financial provider, if he takes on the role of SAHD but this man hadn't - he does neither. He has a hobby which occasionally pays - not a job and if he lies in bed until 11am, takes no part in getting the children up and out to school. He's a cocklodger.

I would be interested to know what he does between 11am and school pick up time. Does he do housework, deal with admin etc? I also wonder what exactly he does for the children to warrant it being called 50/50.

Personally I couldn't and wouldn't live with someone like him.

My DH plays in a band and does paid gigs. We put that money in a 'pot' for unexpected expenses/doing up the house. Before we had dc he spent a few years trying to make it in a band, won a few competitions/got played on a few radio stations but unfortunately he we never made it to the rockstar lifestyle....

DH has a ft job and does it as a hobby. I think your DH could at least get a pt job to improve your family's circumstances while still being around for the dc.

OP, I had something similar with my partner. Worked part time, was happy for me to pay the mortgage, car, holidays, treats etc. Difficult to motivate to get out of bed in the morning, slow and lazy. Our relationship was really damaged as I felt like his mum and was nagging him to sort his life out.
Which he eventually did, a few months ago, going straight into a job paying 4x what he was earning before. It's done wonders for our relationship - he seems more confident in himself and actually makes decisions these days instead of letting me do it all. I think he didn't believe he could get a proper job and was too set in his ways, probably mildly depressed from lack of routine.

It was a friend of his who made the change, convinced him to apply, and gave him the confidence boost. He never listened to me. Maybe you know someone who could influence him?

Ask him what sort of example he thinks he is setting for your children by lazing in bed until 11. Ask him if he would be proud of them growing up and behaving the same way as him.

Ask him how he feels about himself by letting his wife do all of the hard work and seemingly not contributing enough to your family (I don't just mean financially). 50:50 should be the norm, not something that's seen as a great thing for father to do.

Finally, ask yourself if you really want to support someone like this for potentially the rest of your married life.

If he were a SAHD and did the lions share of childcare and the housework (which he surely can’t do if he isn’t rolling out of bed until 11 am!) then fair enough. However he isn’t even that, he’s just a lazy bastard by the sounds of it.

He needs to get a job. Even a part time job in a supermarket would suffice. I’m sure he would earn more than he currently is, you may be entitled to tax credits that way also. He needs to support you far more than he is but in the time being, throw a pot of bloody water over his head if he tries to sleep that late! Tell him to get up and take the kids to school.

We dont know if hes literally sleeping in till 11am or lying there gaining inspiration and so what if he was sleeping in as it sounds like he has late nights working. I hate how only those who get up early and go to work are seen as productive.

If my partner saw me as lazy just because i like to get up late then i would not want him as a partner. When im up i work hard but on my schedule. People work all different times of day and night. All the women saying i get up at 6/7am, Really? Are you doing that because you want to martyr yourself or because deep down you know your partner is resentful of your sahm or wahm role.

I honestly do not see a proplem with the ops partner if when he works he does contribute and reconcile the family finances. Id have a problem if he never did this, but the op said he does. They agreed to this and have managed to run a home and live okay till now, if she no longer likes the arrangement, she needs to work more or leave. She will have less money as a single parent paying lots out in childcare.

Im a carer but i will never willingly work full time (unless my kids were hungry and we were on our bare bones) not when i can cut more cloth accordingly and be happy with my lot, as it sounds like the ops partner is. Its different strokes for different folks.

Its different is he was really lazy and they could not feed the kids or pay the bills but that is not the picture the op presented. He is not a cocklodger.

Most people don't have the luxury of working part time or doing a job that they enjoy' . Most people work and do their hobbies in their spare time. I would keep a daily diary of incoming and outgoing money for a couple of months. I guess he will say that a small part time job is beneath him`. How are you going to fund your retirement if you both work part time ? I am not having a moan, I am a practical person and like to plan short, medium and long term

"All the women saying i get up at 6/7am, Really? Are you doing that because you want to martyr yourself or because deep down you know your partner is resentful of your sahm or wahm role."

We get up at 6am with our children, if not earlier. Unpaid, 7 days a week. Many of us work outside the home on top. That's what you have to do.

OP is either at work or on one of her holidays. Reminds me of that joke about mums having a mini-break in Tesco's car park ... either way, we need Op to come back and catch up!

flirtygirl Their situation sounds barely sustainable now never mind in a few years when the kids are teenagers and life becomes even more expensive. It's not about 'different strokes for different folks', he has a responsibility to provide for their children.

I can understand why the arrangement made more sense when the children were babies and pre schoolers but clearly they'd agreed things would need to change as the years go on yet he's not stepping up.

What's he going to do for a job when his band breaks up as life moves on for the other members when he hasn't taken any other employment for so long?

My old saxophone teacher is in a band and he plays several gigs per week, every week. They are booked months in advance. But it's his hobby.
His day job is teaching music tuition 9-4 mon-fri and Saturday mornings. Plus he does a couple of hours private tuition per week.
Gigging isn't a business

I hate how only those who get up early and go to work are seen as productive.

Um, well unless you are independent wealthy lying in bed dreaming of song lyrics isn't going to feed your children!

All the women saying i get up at 6/7am, Really? Are you doing that because you want to martyr yourself or because deep down you know your partner is resentful of your sahm or wahm role.

Well if you work a 9-5 type job getting up at 7 isn't unusual! And if you are a SAHP you bloody should be getting up with the children so the working parent doesn't have to deal whit child related hassle before going to work.

I have had to get up at 6am for about 30 years! Those of us who work full time always have to particularl,y if you have to ensure small children are settled in childcare and then you have a commute.

Sometimes it seems like we are two nations- the half who work full time and bust a gut to pay tax to keep the other half who can hardly believe people have to get up day in day out at 6am or even earlier for work.

Would he not consider a 3/4 day a week part time job that would bring in a steady income? He can still have his self employed business on the side so that's an additional income source. Or is there more to it than that?

It sounds like he doesn't have a focus, a drive or motivation to get up in the mornings. Is he depressed because that can make you want to sleep all day and not have any enthusiasm for life.