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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

pt.2 To find floral tributes being left for Harry Vincent offensive

999 replies

lostjanni · 11/04/2018 20:35

We reached the post limit so if anyone wants to carry on the discussion...

OP posts:
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5
stitchglitched · 12/04/2018 19:13

It's arrogance. If I held an opinion that appeared at odds with about 99% of the population I wouldn't sneer at the uneducated masses, the thick Sun readers, vile frothers etc. I would consider that maybe I was the one out of step, or in the wrong.

onefootinthegrave · 12/04/2018 19:18

There is so much wrong with this.

VH's family are putting floral tributes up on a wall which isn't where VH died, but opposite the poor victim's house. To me that is intimidation and harassment. If they wanted to put flowers where he died, they would have done so right next to the spot where he actually died, in the next road.

And if they were truly grieving VH, surely they wouldn't have the time to keep going back and putting flowers up again and again every time they are taken down. Wouldn't they be so upset at the loss of their loved one they'd be helping his kids through their grief and coming to terms with what happened? It seems like a game to them. Everytime their vile flowers are taken down, they just keep going back with more, and not even to the place where he died. To the place directly opposite where dear VH was threatening an elderly couple with a screwdriver because he was a bully. Now they're carrying on that bullying by their actions now.

I think most people realise they are putting those flowers up not because they want a shrine to good old VH, but to intimidate the real victim in all this, RO and his wife. But how do the police prove that? I don't know. I think I read yesterday that the police were urging members of the public to stop tearing the flowers down each time they went up. I think what they should have done was told the Vincent family to stop putting their flowers up on that fence.

I think if VH's family had any ounce of decency in them, they wouldn't have put those bloody flowers up in the first place, right outside RO's home. Even if they are grieving a husband, father, son, surely they would also realise what a piece of shit he was to go and rob an elderly couple armed with a screwdriver and it wouldn't be right to do what they're doing.

But they clearly haven't got any decency, and this isn't about putting flowers up to help them to mourn/grieve. There's ways they could do that whilst also acknowledging that RO and his wife are victims.

Sorry, I feel like I@m rambling and repeating myself, and there is probably a much more articulate way of putting down my thoughts.

RO and his wife are the victims here, they've been forced out of their home and may well live in fear for the rest of their lives. THey should have been allowed to live their last years in some kind of peace, especially given that she has dementia and they are both already suffering, living with that. Instead, they will probably have to move away from their friends, family and home and area they know. Because of that, VH doesn't deserve a public floral tribute anywhere, especially not right outside their home.

I hate people like VH so much. I hate that we live in a society where their families are made up of generations that are going to go down the same road as the ones before them. Because you start of feeling sorry for them as kids - but then how much sorrow can you have when they become adults and start committing violent crimes, and crimes against the elderly and vulnerable?

Sorry if this hasn't made much sense. My 18 year old DS has aspergers and is vulnerable and I spend most of my life worrying that he's going to be victim to some wanker like VIncent, and I hate the fact that so many people already are. Sad

BertrandRussell · 12/04/2018 19:20

"Still I suppose the vast majority of posters feel this as well and it’s onky been a few apologists for the criminal."
Please will you STOP saying that those of us who think it would have been better for all concerned if the burglar had notdied but been brought to justice are "apologists for the criminal"

Mydoghatesthebath · 12/04/2018 19:24

onefoot

Spot on post and not rambling at all but heartfelt and totally and utterly would be understood by 99% of the population and probably 97% of mumsnetters. Flowers

My mum has altzimers and dad is her frail carer. They were burgled last year thankfully not while in the house. I know my frail dad would do anything to protect mum snd my blood runs cold knowing counts like this roam our streets.

Aside mum was very upset as she couldn’t understand the mess. She thought she had caused it bless her.

One bastard scum bag less in my opinion.

Mydoghatesthebath · 12/04/2018 19:27

Bertrand

He wasn’t so he isn’t so stop banging on about hypothetical situations. Why do you persist in this?

I wish there hadn’t been a chemical attack in Syria or the holocaust but bleating I wish it haddent happened changes the far end of fuck all

GnotherGnu · 12/04/2018 19:28

I completely get that the victims and people in the neighbourhood find the flowers intimidating, but surely it's not difficult to see the problems involved in saying that putting them up is a breach of the peace and arresting people on that basis. You would have to apply the same rule to any other flowers put up by bereaved relatives and friends, and I am sure that many people would rightly find that pretty offensive. Equally it's not difficult to see that any half-competent lawyer would have no difficulty getting the charge thrown out. Even if they didn't, the penalties for breach of the peace are hardly going to be a deterrent to people prepared to commit aggravated burglary. Is that really a sensible use of police resources?

Awwlookatmybabyspider · 12/04/2018 19:29

Excellent post onefoot.
My dog,. Your poor mum and dad.

YY to one less scumbag.

GnotherGnu · 12/04/2018 19:29

Indeed stitch and the full force of the law is presumably what that cunt wharboys got??

Well, yes, given that he's still in prison with his parole withdrawn.

Mydoghatesthebath · 12/04/2018 19:29

Stitched

Don’t you know the liberal elite are never wrong! Wink

Mydoghatesthebath · 12/04/2018 19:32

Gnothrer

Only because of an outcry from his victims. If it had been up to the parole board he would be out now.

Don’t you listen to the news?

GnotherGnu · 12/04/2018 19:33

I suspect these sane people have never met a traveller in their guilted lives

Delighted you feel we're sane, mydog, even if my life is neither guilted nor gilded. However, your suspicion that I have never ever met a traveller is incorrect.

I note that you persist with the myth that people you disagree with are standing up for the burglar and his family. I wish you would point out any post that has in any way condoned what Vincent did; you and your sympathisers have been asked about this frequently repeated assertion often enough and haven't yet succeeded in producing any evidence for it.

GnotherGnu · 12/04/2018 19:34

Section 88 states that that offence is enforceable by "an authorised officer of a litter authority" (not the police) issuing a fixed penalty notice. There isn't a power of arrest

Yes - that was to extend the option for a fixed penalty notice being issued by others, but it doesn't preclude Police action.

So what do you suggest they do if they have no power of arrest for this offence?

Mydoghatesthebath · 12/04/2018 19:34

is that a sensible use of police resources

Yes it is. Just like it would have been to arrest the Rotherham paedophiles. For sensible replace with right and good abs decent

ItsuAddict · 12/04/2018 19:38

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

GnotherGnu · 12/04/2018 19:39

Still I suppose the vast majority of posters feel this as well and it’s onky been a few apologists for the criminal

Once again, could you please refer us to all the posts that you claim condoned the burglar's crime? Or maybe stop peddling this myth?

GnotherGnu · 12/04/2018 19:40

Mydog, I've read the judgment, which I suspect is considerably more than you have done.

Mydoghatesthebath · 12/04/2018 19:40

I think Gnother if you are sad at the death of this scum bag then yes sorry I find you beyond the pale.

BertrandRussell · 12/04/2018 19:41

"He wasn’t so he isn’t so stop banging on about hypothetical situations. Why do you persist in this?"
Because you persist in calling anyone who isn't pleased that Vincent died a "apologist for criminals".

GnotherGnu · 12/04/2018 19:42

Could you explain why it would be a sensible use of police resources, Mydog, given that trying to charge the perpetrators with breach of the peace would not stop the flowers being put up and would be doomed to failure?

lostjanni · 12/04/2018 19:43

basically we all agree the flowers shouldn't be there. and VH is a low life scum.
We're now just disagreeing what to do with the rest of his scummy family threatening a community.

OP posts:
Mydoghatesthebath · 12/04/2018 19:43

Why do you think I havnt read the judgment? Because I disagree with you I am thick?? Typical

Mydoghatesthebath · 12/04/2018 19:45

Not quite op bertrand delicately objects to the use of the word scum

onefootinthegrave · 12/04/2018 19:45

Mydog that is so upsetting that your poor mum thought she had made the mess Sad I'd bet that whoever it was that burgled them doesn't feel any remorse, or give a shit about the impact on them.

VH's family should be ashamed of what he did, and telling his kids that it's OK for them to grieve him, but RO wasn't to blame for his death because he shouldn't have been in his fucking house intimidating him and his wife. But instead they're giving interviews to the media saying he shouldn't have died and RO should be charged, and taking delight in carrying on intimidating him.

Thanks for understanding my ramblings Flowers

Curiousmoi · 12/04/2018 19:45

Does anyone have the link to the original post? TIA Thanks

SaucyJane · 12/04/2018 19:46

Anyone can read a judgment. Doesn't mean they've understood it or applied it correctly to new circumstances.

If everyone read judgments in the same way/correctly, there'd be a lot less litigation!!