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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

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Original poster

about this argument with my wife?

156 replies

GregVegas · 23/03/2018 16:40

hi there

i need some advice

my wife and i are moving abroad on sunday and are in the process of packing and getting the house sorted ready to be rented out

my wife told me i was in charge of taking rubbish / unwanted items to the dump and she would pack everything else. she was making piles of 'wanted' and 'unwanted' and she accidentally put a personal possession of hers in the unwanted pile. i then took it to the dump.

this morning she asked me where the item was and i said i was pretty sure it had been put in an 'unwanted' bag and that i'd chucked it. she got really angry and started ranting about how im so unthoughtful and how i should have known she wanted to keep this thing and how it was all my fault.

i was tired and not in the mood for screaming and shouting so i went to walk out of the room, she grabbed my arm to pull me back so i turned around and pushed her, she fell over.

she is still not talking to me and claims i hit her.

i just wanted her to let me go so i could calm down and she wouldnt let me. she is still not speaking to me.

OP posts:

GreenVoyage · 23/03/2018 18:15

YANBU. You shouldn't be emigrating with this woman.

I think your biggest problem is how manipulative she's trying to be. Claiming you hit her when you both know she didn't. Very cunniving. Run.. Fast.

Stompythedinosaur · 23/03/2018 18:15

I think pushing her over was unreasonable and disproportionate to being grabbed (obviously the grabbing was wrong also but I don't think it excuses pushing someone with that much force).

Honesty your relationship doesn't sound great. If violence on both sides is the norm it might be time to call it a day.

If you want to resolve things then Relate can be good. But you both need to commit to having a non violent relationship in the future.

Stompythedinosaur · 23/03/2018 18:17

Also, I think you are being unfair leaving your wife to carry the mental load in deciding what and how to pack while you do jobs you are given. It is unfair and means she has to carry the lion's share of the stress.

SusanBunch · 23/03/2018 18:18

Avasarala you also said a load of stupid shit such as 'wouldn't have happened if she hadn't grabbed you', 'she started it' etc. Classic victim blaming. It matters not whether she started it- the point is he snapped and hugely overreacted by shoving her. Most domestic abusers are very clear that their victims provoked them and if they had just shut up, nothing would have happened. Very dangerous narrative.

Re the child point, if you violently shoved your child, I think you would find that the authorities would not think an apology for a 'natural violent reaction' was anywhere near adequate.

SusanBunch · 23/03/2018 18:20

I think your biggest problem is how manipulative she's trying to be. Claiming you hit her when you both know she didn't. Very cunniving. Run

Fucking hell. To think this is a predominantly women's site. Makes me weep. Do you realise that a violent shove is just as much an act of DV as hitting is? It's a question of semantics. Manipulative because she objects to being pushed to the floor by her husband? Indeed, what a bitch.

Avasarala · 23/03/2018 18:20

This is not a man who beats his wife. This is a wife who screamed and shouted at her husband and then grabbed him. He lashed out. But she sounds like the unhinged one who turns to being physical.

You should not have shoved, but she needs to deal with her behaviour too. Particularly if this is her normal way of dealing with issues - you say you just didn't want to be screamed at today as if it's normal and today you just couldn't deal with it. It's like a woman lashing out at an abusive partner after being berated over and over.

If this is normal for her, then you will end up reacting the same way again and you will end up in a lot of trouble. The whole relationship needs worked on.

If this was a one off for both of you then you need to respect her feelings but encourage her to talk about it or seek out help to out if behind you.

Ginger1982 · 23/03/2018 18:21

SusanBunch you appear to be conveniently forgetting that the person who started the violence was the OP's wife. To vilify him by saying she was shouting and screaming and he just lashed out and pushed her is to leave out a whole chunk of what happened.

SpringHen · 23/03/2018 18:21

It matters not whether she started it- the point is he snapped and hugely overreacted by shoving her

I wish posters would describe what they think that a reasonable proportional response to being grabbed and restrained WOULD be?

I think shoving in order to escape someones grip is entirely proportional

HonkyWonkWoman · 23/03/2018 18:22

she was making piles of "wanted" and "unwanted
So she put this item that she wanted into the wrong pile and then she got really angry and started ranting at you and telling you it was your fault.
You were in no mood for the screaming and shouting and try to walk away.
She grabbed your arm to pull you back.
You, wanting to get away, turn and push her.
She fell over!
If she had not been getting physical in the first place then she would not have fell over.
Now, she is lying and saying that you have hit her.
You say that you just wanted to get away but she wouldn't let you.
And now she isn't speaking to you.
Have you let her get away with ranting, screaming, shouting and getting physically abusive before?
She sounds a total arse and she should be apologising to you.
Then you could apologise for having to push her off and making her fall.
Don't let her treat you like shit OP.

Avasarala · 23/03/2018 18:23

@SusanBunch

There is a big difference between a child and a partner who screams, shouts and grabs. Hea talking as though her screaming is usual behaviour and now she's grabbing him. He defended himself. If it were a man screaming and shouting ans grabbing and a woman who finally pushed back, she'd be applauded.

What he did was not ok, but if he's being verbally abused by his wife then it's not just an act of domestic violence - it's a consequence of a toxic environment. She is not a victim.

Grimbles · 23/03/2018 18:24

TBF it is an eye-opener seeing the difference in responses between this thread and the one where a woman deliberately slapped her husband!

SpringHen · 23/03/2018 18:24

You should not have shoved

Whay SHOULD he have done? Stood there until she had finished lashing out at him? She physically prevented him from walking away so that wasnt an option so what are posting thinking would have been a correct response from him?

SusanBunch · 23/03/2018 18:26

This is not a man who beats his wife. This is a wife who screamed and shouted at her husband and then grabbed him. He lashed out. But she sounds like the unhinged one who turns to being physical.

Glad you can be so sure. You clearly have no clue about domestic violence. In most cases, there is 'tit for tat' in that there will be shouting and screaming, possibly grabbing. The point is that one person then takes it too far and reacts hugely disproportionately.

Example (taken from an old post on here): man and woman argue, woman is shouting at man. Woman grabs man forcefully by the arm and he reacts by shoving her against the wall, putting her in a stranglehold and then punches her. According to your logic, she started it.

Very few DV situations are totally 'unprovoked' in that the perp will just randomly start beating the victim out of the blue. This is yet another dangerous myth.

SpringHen · 23/03/2018 18:26

Theres a FUCK TONNE of difference between shoving someone away in order to escape them & approaching someone in order to aggressively shove them!

Avasarala · 23/03/2018 18:27

@SpringHen

If he's strong enough to push her over then he's strong enough to pull his arm away and keep walking. But, when someone who is screaming at you then grabs you, it would be a self defence mechanism to push them away. Just need to try and control yourself because it can end up a lot worse if you don't.

SusanBunch · 23/03/2018 18:30

You said he snapped though and that it's an instinctive reaction. Surely if a child was screaming and grabbing, you would have the same instinctive reaction. If someone grabs your arm, you remove their hand from your arm. It's quite simple. You don't throw them to the ground.

There is a different dynamic between men and women which is why female on male violence is not the same as male on female, due to a significant difference in strength. Female violence is not acceptable either though and I doubt it would be applauded.

SpringHen · 23/03/2018 18:30

Someone in a rage will usually have strength beyond their size.

She was in a rage. She did not want him to walk away and grabbed and restrained him.

If she had a strong grip on him it would take a strong push to get her off.

Avasarala · 23/03/2018 18:30

@SusanBunch

But everything he did was to get away from her. Not to further engage/fight/attack/terrify or control. He wanted to get away.
Again, a woman would be told do what you need to do to get away.

She's starting the violence. If it were reversed and the man was starting the violence, I'm sure your response would be different. He didn't approach or engage. He escaped her grasp and walked away.

You need to back off and stop accusing people of being domestic abusers when they were the one being grabbed at.

Vitalogy · 23/03/2018 18:31

One of the most stressful times moving.
Next time give her a hug and say you're sorry. Yes you weren't to know but we like it when you say sorry that was a line in a film I watched recently but seriously, go try it, we all have to give and take in relationships. Hopefully she'll respond positively. Best wishes.

SusanBunch · 23/03/2018 18:32

Theres a FUCK TONNE of difference between shoving someone away in order to escape them & approaching someone in order to aggressively shove them!

If you knew much about DV, you would know that very often violent assaults on women happen in exactly the situation you describe, where the perp claims to be wanting to 'escape them' and uses this as a justification for using brute force.

SpringHen · 23/03/2018 18:32

He was trying to walk away from her
If he was trying to provoke a physical fight so that he could justify violence then he would not be leaving the room would he?

SusanBunch · 23/03/2018 18:33

I am out. There are some misogynistic fucks on this thread and I can't be bothered to read any more excuses and justifications for male violence. No wonder DV is endemic. Hiding this thread. Your wife deserves better, OP.

SpringHen · 23/03/2018 18:34

SusanBunch so what should he have done? Stood there and taken it?

Avasarala · 23/03/2018 18:34

@SusanBunch.

It's nothing to do with a fucking child. You're coming across as a total idiot. A child would not be abusing him in the first place. If a child grabs you, it's a child. Even angry, they wouldn't be intimidating or have much strength.

This is completely different - it is a grown adult berating and grabbing. It is nothing to do with a child. The situations and reactions cannot be compared. You are trying to put words into people's mouth to make it seems as though they're saying it's ok to hurt a child, just to justify your feelings that he's being abusive when it doesn't seem to be the case and is not clear cut.

With a child, it's clear cut. With two adults, either one can be the abuser. (And yes, children can be abuser but that's a while other thing and again, nothing to do with this).

Wind your neck in.

Ginger1982 · 23/03/2018 18:35

SusanBunch your last example is ridiculous as it is quite clearly a disproportionate response. But you clearly view yourself as some kind of expert on domestic violence so what's the point in arguing?

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