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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Who is being unreasonable - joint finances

449 replies

namechange59295 · 16/03/2018 14:29

Namechanged for this but regular poster.

Please help me work out whether I am being unreasonable, or whether my husband is being unreasonable (I think he is, obviously!).

I'll try to make his as succinct as possible. Been with my DH for 8 years, married for 18 months, DS1 is 7.5 months. DH bought the house we live in when we had been together for 2 years, large cash deposit, small mortgage. I moved in and paid a reduced rent until the mortgage was cleared (approx. 3 years). I have then lived there for free ever since. The justification for this which we both agreed to was that I had to move around an hour from my friends, family and work to allow him to continue to run his business, which would obviously benefit us both in the future. His friends, family and hobbies are on his doorstep (literally, we can see his parents house and the rugby field from our windows!). I hate the town we live in, but we plan to move out of town in the next couple of years and as I have made lots of friends in the wider area I am happy with this prospect, although ultimately I would prefer to move back to where I grew up and where my family are.

So, mortgage is paid off and we both have significant savings, however he has about 3 times what I have. I believe his ability to save has been partly facilitated by me because by moving to his area I have allowed our relationship to continue and him to pursue his professional desires. Of course he has also saved very hard and worked very hard for that money. I have explained this part of our financial situation not to be goady, but I don't want to drip feed and I do think this is relevant to my AIBU.

Since moving in together we have paid into a joint account for food, bills, council tax etc etc. Basically everything that's needed to keep the house running. I have just stopped receiving maternity pay but have been paying in as normal until now. Agreement is that I will stay at home with DS1 because my commute to work means I would work for about £25 per day once we have paid for childcare. We have always been of the understanding that we would both prefer for me to be at home with the children for a certain amount of time whilst they are young and that was a large part of the reason we have settled in DH's area. All discussed and agreed years ago.

I do all of the housework, so cooking, cleaning, washing, ironing, food shopping, bins, recycling, night feeds etc. plus all those other little things like buying birthday presents, cards etc. He does bath and bed with DS 5 nights a week. He plays rugby twice a week and all day on a Saturday, with the occasional night out afterwards (not regular, say once every 2 months or so). He has a lie in at the weekend on both days while I get up with DS.

I have always said that I would prefer our savings to be held jointly, with a direct debit into an account for household stuff and then an equal allowance each for spending money. He has always said that he will just top up our existing joint account as needed. We are both relatively good with money so whilst I'm not really comfortable with this, in theory it should work as long as we are both reasonable.

With regards to our savings, we are both saving for a property investment, so in that sense our intentions for the savings are mutual. He obviously has a great deal more than I do at present, but my parents will be giving us a significant (approx £175k) sum to purchase said property when we find it so he will then benefit from my/their investment. Basically what I am trying to say is that we are on a fairly level playing field once all is taken into consideration.

Fast forward to today. We are looking after his parents dog for a few days while they are away. I took her for a run on the beach this morning and it was lovely down there so I bought a coffee in the cafe and sat outside for a bit longer. The coffee cost £1.50. DH has told me that I should take my own coffee in a flask because buying a coffee out is a waste of money. He says that if I was out for a walk with a friend and we went into the coffee shop that's fine because it's being sociable. I think that considering he disappears for 2 evenings a week plus most of Saturday week in week out (and there is a cost of say £20 a week for this) I should be allowed to buy a bloody coffee every now and then if I want one! I'm not one of these people who walks around with a costa permanently attached to my hand, I hardly ever buy drinks or food out. My social commitments are a buggy fitness group once or twice a week (£4 a time), baby sensory (£5 a week) and slimming world (£5 a week). I then go for a walk with a group of mums once a week and we have a coffee afterwards. This mornings coffee doesn't usually happen, it's only because I was down there with his parents dog and I just fancied a coffee because it was really nice there today. He is saying that if I had been with someone else it would have been fine because it's being sociable. I argued that if his hobby was cycling or running which he might do by himself I would still be happy for him to pursue it, it just so happens that he plays rugby and that is a team sport.

This next bit is the important bit.

He then said that he is spending his money when he does things, and I am spending our money. My argument is that all of the money is our money, including he money that my parents have promised me for the property purchase** whenever that happens.

I think this statement completely summarises his attitude towards me being a stay at home mum and whilst he is happy for me to do so, he is going to want me to account for every last penny I spend because as far as he is concerned, I am not the one who went out and earned it. I also think that this shows he does not value anything I do in the home and whilst I am happy to do it and appreciate that I am fortunate to be able to stay at home, I do not think that attitude is fair.

Well done if you are still reading - I am happy to be told I am unreasonable if I am and in which case I need to start grovelling after the argument we've just had. If I am not being unreasonable and he is being financially controlling, then I am just disappointed in myself for being so stupid as to think we were on the same wavelength.

Thank you.

OP posts:
timeisnotaline · 18/03/2018 18:48

I wouldn’t say Ltb yet. The op is making progress. I would get on the house deeds, let the existing savings go, but even though I know neither of you really want you to go back to work I think you really need to do this at least for a while to embed the mindset change.

ExpatTrailingSpouse · 18/03/2018 18:53

RockPaperCut said the short version of what I was trying to say.

Categoric I didn't see that post before my longwinded one - totally agree. Someone like this will not play nice if you do end up splitting. They would actually rather you wasted 1000s on legal fees than you actually have the money for yourself and DC. (I say this being $35000 in for legal fees and we're not even close to the end of the divorce).

GabriellaMontez · 18/03/2018 18:54

Some people do change. Good luck trying to improve stuff further between you. You're doing the right thing.

I did ltb which I'm happy about. But it has brought a whole new set of problems which I'll have until the dc are adults (and beyond). It's not the answer to everything.

reallybadidea · 18/03/2018 18:55

I wouldn't say ltb now, it doesn't seem irretrievable yet, but I wouldn't be waiting years for him to change. What about couples therapy?

Neweternal · 18/03/2018 18:55

If you were to separate and his declared income is over £100k. That's quite a lot of child maintenance, much more than £300 per month. You could buy a decent house outright with your savings and parents money or with a small mortgage go and back to work, is that your biggest fear? You have options and you don't need to take this.

namechange59295 · 18/03/2018 19:01

@Neweternal his income is approx £50k at the moment. He gets £30k basic at the moment then last year he got £20k dividends. Obviously this will change year on year and over time his dividends will increase because he will become a greater shareholder in the business (he'll take over his father's shares so instead of him, his father and a third director, his father will retire and it will just be him and the other director)

OP posts:
ExpatTrailingSpouse · 18/03/2018 19:01

"I wouldn't say ltb now, it doesn't seem irretrievable yet, but I wouldn't be waiting years for him to change."

^^ this. But don't hold your breath, in my experience, and based solely on the examples you gave, I doubt he will.

Actually, if it's legal there, suggest to him that you have a postnup made up to deal with the existing house/cash assets and how it would be split in the event of a divorce. If he truly thinks your money is shared, he shouldn't be worried and refuse to do it.

namechange59295 · 18/03/2018 19:02

It's not my biggest fear to go back to work. It's more that I have a life here now that K generally like and I don't really want to start all over again. I know that's not the worst thing in the world either and plenty do, but I don't think this is a completely lost cause yet. Obviously I may still need to, and who know I might be happier.

OP posts:
namechange59295 · 18/03/2018 19:04

I won't be able to wait years for hi to change, the deadline is August because that's when I have to go back to work so decisions and actions need to be in place by then. Actually sooner that that because I'll obviously need to make decisions a few months before my return in August.

OP posts:
RockPaperCut · 18/03/2018 19:05

I agree you’re not quite at the LTB stage. I hope he’s able to change his attitude. And definitely regain your financial independence.

Ha Neweternal you do know that a person who is this miserly in a marriage will almost certainly be the first to avoid paying maintenance by declaring a pittance in income.

iheartmichellemallon · 18/03/2018 19:07

Oh Op, I'm so sorry to read this. I know you don't want to, but I'd urge you not to give up your independence & carry on working, even if it's just part time (& you jointly split childcare costs & costs of cleaners in the house). Good luck Thanks

Categoric · 18/03/2018 19:07

I hope it works out for you OP but please don’t disadvantage yourself by trying to change him for too long and don’t give up work. You seem so considered and thoughtful, your DH sounds selfish in the extreme. I genuinely don’t think I could look him in the face if I was you.

timeisnotaline · 18/03/2018 19:08

I would balk at a post nup to be honest as I would be really upset at what my dh of 10 years was thinking to want that! And £300 a month is extra for the op- getting paid the same for child maintencae would just go on bills which is coming from the joint account at the moment, the op would definitely not be better off. And even if the op were planning on leaving, probably far easier to go back to work with a dp there then leave than be job hunting a single Mum, there are plenty of times I’d say get out now and worry about the rest later but this isn’t one of them. He needs to get over the defensive I disagree attitude and the op can’t wait too long for this to happen.

ExpatTrailingSpouse · 18/03/2018 19:22

I would balk at a post nup to be honest as I would be really upset at what my dh of 10 years was thinking to want that!

Sure if you had been treating your DP fairly regarding money. In this case, OP's DH has basically been telling her that their money is his money because he works and she's SAHM. So if he's now telling her of course he doesn't think that, his reaction to even bringing the subject up of a postnup (considering his past behaviour/attitude) would be very interesting.

Bluelady · 18/03/2018 19:26

Not being remotely patronising, OP, but the way you're handling this is completely brilliant. I completely get that you don't want to give up on your marriage. Your husband needed a wake up call and it seems he's certainly got one. I was just wondering - your mum sounds like a wise old bird - what's her take on all this?

namechange59295 · 18/03/2018 19:39

@Bluelady - thank you, not patronising at all and lovely to hear when I'm feeling like a bit of an old fool.

And thank you again to all of you who have contributed to this thread. If I hadn't had such a fantastic response we'd have probably had a bit of a tiff about the coffee and carried on as we were.

Mum would love to know she sounds like a wise old bird! She and dad didn't start out with much, they have run a business all their life that dad started from scratch which has bought them a farm, their amazing house, other property, put their 4 kids through private education and university and paid for the house contribution for each of us. Mum is very much the woman behind the scenes in the business but dad definitely couldn't have done it without her. She's had a tough life really, her mum committed suicide before any of us were born and we lost my sister aged 24 to a very rare immunity disorder. She brought us up on her own really because dad was always so busy with the business. Love him too but he's not the easiest to live with (admits that himself!) and isn't around much even though they are both approaching 70. They've got a comfortable life now but it hasn't always been that way, she's seen some hard times.

OP posts:
namechange59295 · 18/03/2018 19:41

Oh sorry, you asked what mums take on all this is not who she is and what her life story is! How embarrassing!!!

She agrees with me, she says he's a tight old bugger who has had a very expensive coffee this weekend. Ultimately she says we are a well suited couple and she thinks it will ultimately all be alright, but she is a stickler for having things in writing and vein for fair and square so she wants me to push for the name on the deeds.

OP posts:
namechange59295 · 18/03/2018 19:42

Sorry - being fair and square

OP posts:
Bluelady · 18/03/2018 19:47

Your mum sounds amazing, my kind of woman. I'm very pleased she's got your back. I hope all this works out. And, as for being a fool, no way. Just a little too trusting but those days have gone!

Neweternal · 18/03/2018 19:48

And what if he refuses to put you on the houses deeds?

namechange59295 · 18/03/2018 19:50

@Bluelady - thanks, she's a gooden Smile

@Neweternal - that will be the next instalment, if you can bear any more!

OP posts:
Snowmagedon · 18/03/2018 20:12

The other thing with names on deeds is if one person dies ie ops dh.. Op should not worry about houses, if its not in her name it's not automatically hers unfortunately.
.

rookiemere · 18/03/2018 20:13

OP sounds like you're making good progress.

Another one to urge you not to give up work. I'm part time and have been so since I came back after mat leave. On occasions it has been hard, but now that he's older and I'm back to earning a decent salary, it's so worth it - not just for the money, but also for my self-esteem and independence.

I found a marvellous CM for DS to go to at 11 months when I went back and he was very happy there. In many ways I felt the interaction he got with the other DCs there was probably better for him than just being with me all the time.

If you go back to work part time no decision is set in stone. If you decide to up your hours to full time then employers are always delighted to do this, equally if you decide that it's not what you want, or decide to give up if you have more DC, then at least you have options. When I went back I gave myself 6 months to fully appraise the situation and decide if it was working or not - luckily it was.

Snowmagedon · 18/03/2018 20:18

Op if your going to stay with him sort out the budget... Do envelope system.. Bills, saving first house etc all done. What's left.. What do you want for bday, holidays fund, Xmas, save all separately..

Then have weekly free budget for coffee, drinks, eating out. Then you know exactly how much you have, physical take it out of bank and have it in cash in drawer. Then you can relax knowing your not robbing another fund.

Snowmagedon · 18/03/2018 20:20

Your lucky to have switched on dp who are alive still to support you in many ways

What a great three ad, this is mn at its best and I'm sure other posters like me have learned something too as I need to get name on deeds!

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