To genuinely wonder how or why anyone believes in God?

[ChaosNeverRains]

Genuine question.

I was until fairly recently I think probably agnostic rather than anything else, having been brought up in a very church oriented school where the emphasis was all on sin and retribution and the need to worship this higher being and that if you lived every day then it was through God’s will - you get the picture. Until recently though I was prepared to believe that perhaps there was a higher being out there somewhere, and even now I can see that some could believe that there is a higher being out there or that there was at some point.

But what I don’t understand is why people seem to believe that there is a God who looks over them individually when everything points to that not being the case. People talk about the power of prayer when actually no such power exists. The man dying of cancer is no more or less likely to die if you prayed for him than if you didn’t. I know of some very devout Christians who have fallen victim to the most horrific illnesses and where the church have genuinely believed that praying for them means God will heal them, which of course he hasn’t. But when they die those same people are thought to be up there eternally worshipping the lord. Why?

I can see that a belief in God might somehow make people feel comforted that this isn’t the only life we will have, but what I can’t see is that a God who allows the amount of bad and suffering that goes on in the world, even on an individual level should be so worshipped. If a father treated his children in the way that the supposed Heavenly Father treats his, no-one would want anything to do with him. Yet worshippers of a God go to all and any lengths to ensure that they continue to do things in the name of the father and to not upset him for fear of the retribution they will receive.

I’m not one for dismissing belief as believing in the fairies and what-not (with the possible exception of the dinosaur deniers,) but I am becoming more and more curious as to how it is that people can believe in this individual God and actually believe that it is true when there is no evidence to suggest anything of the sort.

PS: I am talking about any and all religion not just one. My thought process being that if there were one God it would be the same God whether you are Christian muslim or Jewish but that the scriptures are defined by humans to make for the individual religions.

purplerain your mum believes the same as me 🙂

I'm interested in how people pick which religion to follow or God to believe in!

My DS goes to a school where a variety of faiths are discussed and represented. He has many Muslim friends so a few weeks ago declared he believed in Allah. More recently he said he believed in a christian god. This week he reckons there is'nt one, but many gods and they are all robots that control us, much like kids move their toys around.

Back to your question: I suppose it's because some people still believe that the world is a mysterious and beautiful place.

you don't need god for that. I am an atheist and I think that.

It doesn't make any sense that someone who (crucially) believes in the power of prayer wouldn't benefit from it. ´
Performance anxiety, they think, might be the reason people got stressed knowing others are praying for their recovery.

Prayer to a God can be a some anyway what you doing is focusing your energy and mind.. You can do this any way you want.

It doesn't have to be to a god, it's just a way of focusing!!

I don't know how anyone can believe anymore.. It's refreshing to hear authors like Philip Pulman speaking out about organised religion.

Absolutely I believe in God. I've had my prayers answered many times, but in unexpected ways that aren't always apparent at the time. Seems so illogical NOT to believe. But i don't go round preaching and trying to convert people. I respect people's rights to their own views, as i expect them to respect my views.

It’s easy to instil in a child, then it becomes harder to disassociate from it as you grow older.

Actually, that's not true. People who know that someone is praying for them actually benefit from it.

^studies show otherwise and that it complicates recovery. Google 'prayer research heart complications'

I think what makes faith so impossible to understand for those who don't have it is that they only 'proof' is personal and not seen or known by anyone else. Many (maybe even most) believers who are truly convicted of the truth of their religion are that way because they have had their own proof - experiences they believe to be communication from God (whether that's voices, dreams, feelings, signs, prophetic words, visions, reading the Bible or something else). But to anyone other than that individual - that means nothing so cannot be appreciated or understood.

It was once described to me like this: 'imagine you are hanging off the edge of a cliff and can see nothing but cloud/fog beneath your feet. You are told there is a ledge just inches below your feet and that you can let go and be standing on solid rock. But you can't see it so how can you really know it is there? Only by trusting, letting go and waiting to see where you land. Once you are standing on the rock you have proof that it was there all along. But you've got to let go to find out.'

Logical I have prayed to the sky the universe and I too have had prayers answered.. But not by God, by the focusing of my mind. That's what prayer does it focuses the mind.

You say your prayers are answered by God, I say mine are by simply focusing thought

I think some people are more inclined to believe in something than others. It's part of the human condition, and we all get varying degrees of the inclination in our brain chemistry - which is then affected by upbringing and experiences in life.

I was bought up by atheist parents and honestly don't understand how or why people believe in any religion, but so long as it makes people happy and gives them peace it's none of my business. What I do object to is religion being used as a form of social control - religion has no business in the state, and I am very against faith schools.

Kerela but much religion is about control as well and even in poor communities its about control.

I think it's easier to believe in god if it's like 'wallpaper' that's to say it's something that's been in you're life so long you almost don't scrutinise it. I scrutinised it and realised it made no sense. Felt a bit silly but can appreciate how people can think 'oh what lovely wallpaper.'

Knowing a religious family (we are not) I would say that it is about a framework for life. They have answers for all the difficult questions (ok, maybe not all) about why their kids should behave (along with helpful quotes from religious texts), why they should be kind, why they were born, what happens when they die, what things are right and wrong to do in their life, etc. It is a form of delegation I think. Can always have structure and explanations and if all is going to sh*t, can always pray. If you're not religious, you deal with the harsh reality of life on your own, can feel very alone at times, have no answers for all the terrible stuff that goes on and sometimes feel helpless as to how to stop it. I think it's easier to be religious and share those feelings and believe that something/one out there is working on making things better. For that, am a bit envious that I can't believe in a God. I do think that wanting to do the best in life and helping others is all good and good on those that take that approach and dedicate to their time to helping others in a community within that framework.

I genuinely wonder why atheists think they have all the answers. I'm not in any camp but the arrogance of atheists grates on me.

I’m not sure what I believe - I am certainly not a strong atheist, agnostic is probably closer. I am not comfortable with organised religion/indoctrination/guilt/the concept of worship/evangelicalism, but there is so much that is mind blowing about the world, I’m not sure I completely believe that everything is simply ‘science’. I also believe in the spirit and caring for the well-being of your spirit is part of good health. Ultimately, nobody really knows for certain either way.

Vicki it's interesting Joe you can acknowledge your own up bringing has impacted on your own thoughts and choices.

This is what many people can't grasp when they have been raised within a religion or even in any extreme circumstances eg politics.. Etc. The religious person would argue to the death.. It's their choice.. But they can't step outside that they have been raised to think that way so it's not a choice.

Little I agree I find science quite cold too, there is more magic in the world than science allows for but it's not jesus or Allah!

I dont give a fuck what people believe in

But as soon as they start using their god as some sort of moral authority over others and telling others what they should or shouldnt be doing, then they have invited me to ridicule their bullshit

THIS

Most people cherry pick anyway, it's to give their lives some meaning.

I also don't give a damn what people believe in

But as soon as they start using their ‘absence of god’ as some sort of moral authority over others and telling others what they should or shouldnt be doing, then they have invited me to ridicule their bullshit.

Also, Atheism - totally a religion.

YANBU. I find it totally understandable that some people find solace, companionship, cultural togetherness etc in the idea of religion, but I find it baffling that they manage to convince themselves of the actual existence of a god or gods.

Anyone who claims that atheism is a faith or a religion clearly doesn't understand what atheism means. If a person was somehow born and raised without any knowledge of the existence of religions, and had never thought of inventing a god themselves, would you really claim that their atheism (i.e. their lack of belief in a god) was some kind of faith or religion in itself? The absence of belief isn't a faith.

I was brought up as a Christian and I could never understand what place the Old Testament had in the Christian religion. Still can't.
I have never had any religious belief. My opinion is that people believe in god(s) because they need to - man created god rather than god created man.
If you think back to early human society when there was no electricity, police, shops etc, and little scientific understanding of the universe or animal or plant biology, you can see why people would have been praying to the sun god, the sea god or whatever. And when you are going through a tough time it must be a great comfort to have religious belief. But even if I suddenly got faith I would still kind of know that there was no evidential basis for it.

@lethal
"I genuinely wonder why atheists think they have all the answers. I'm not in any camp but the arrogance of atheists grates on me".

I think youve got them the wrong way round. Atheist will happily say ' i dont know' when they dont know. They might have some ideas but until they have evidence they dont say that they know. Unlike religious types.

On topics where they say they know, they back it up with a fuckton of evidence. Unlike religious types

But they would be agnostic. Atheism is an group of people who share the active belief in the non-existence of any god.