White privilege... really? In schools??!

[stellenbosch]

To quote Bastille, 'the world's gone mad' ...

So your position is you as a white person are entitled to tell me and force upon me I am a victim because of my skin colour when I tell you I'm not and your views are unhelpful ? I change my mind white privileged does exist.

How much white privilege do you think I would experience (as a white western man) if I turned up dirt poor in Guizhou Province, China for example, and tried to compete with locals for the same job?

You'd get the job. Probably even if you didn't speak the language or even knew what to do.

So if I turned up in Arabia or south East Asia 100-150 years ago I would have had privilege?

You would have been part of the colonial entourage, so absolutely yes. Lawrence of Arabia? You are seriously naming the most glaring example of white privilege in the Middle East?

whereas everything you were saying would be equally true based purely on his education and background alone

No, if he was white he would be treated even better. I'm not wealthy, but if I went to Ghana, I would more than likely be treated better than him absolutely everywhere. I've seen far to many Western born minorities treated like dirt in countries were I'm treated as an equal to the ruling class if not better, even if they're better educated or wealthier than me.
I'm starting to think you

So your position is you as a white person are entitled to tell me and force upon me I am a victim because of my skin colour when I tell you I'm not and your views are unhelpful ? I change my mind white privileged does exist.

I see where you're coming from. It's a difficult one. Maybe you are one of the 'lucky' ones, maybe there are plenty like you. That's not a dig at you, by the way.

It's kind of offensive to call me one of the lucky ones ? I have worked hard to get where I am.

I'm starting to think you

Sorry, didn't finish that thought before I pressed post. I'm starting to think you're taking the piss.

So your position is you as a white person are entitled to tell me and force upon me I am a victim because of my skin colour when I tell you I'm not and your views are unhelpful ? I change my mind white privileged does exist.

That’s not it at all - you’re not a victim because of your skin colour, but especially in countries like Canada/the UK/the USA your skin colour does not give you any form of privilege. You can be privileged in so many other ways, but the colour of your skin sadly doesn’t contribute to that because of issues in our societies.

I went to a top university. Factors that helped me get in were my family caring about my education, not being disabled, and being white. Factors that disadvantaged me were growing up without parents/in and out of care, not knowing anyone who had been to a top university, going to a failing school, living in an area where very few go on to higher education. We are all privileged in some areas and less privileged in others.

Jesus this thread is depressing.

Nobody is asking white people to feel 'guilty'. Guilt is a fucking pointless emotion that leads to absolutely nothing.
I am white. I acknowledge the fact that my skin colour has afforded me massive advantages that I don't even notice.

I do tend to agree that privilege is the wrong word, partly because it then makes it easy for people to say 'but I grew up on a council estate, I'm not privileged at all'.
The way I understand it and explain it to myself is that I am privileged NOT to be subjected to systemic institutionalised racism ON TOP OF everything else that makes my life hard.

It's kind of offensive to call me one of the lucky ones ? I have worked hard to get where I am

The point I was trying to make, I think, I lost.

Sorry.

Certcert do you want a hand out of that large hole you’re digging for yourself?

It's offensive to give black people a "leg up" all the time. All these drives and schemes to get diverse people into certain industries above white people etc. All it means is when black people are in these roles people know they've got there through a scheme and it undermines them.

Can we just tackle racism and stop treating non white people as victims who we have to give "extra help" to. If we are not being racist then no one needs or wants the extra help, everyone is happy enough to run along fairly.

Tabby you’re now telling someone they are a victim when they don’t feel like a victim? I’ve heard it all now!!!! 🤦🏻‍♀️

I know that white/male/class privilege is a real thing, but the p word always seems to get people's backs up, so I think in this kind of context it's the wrong thing to focus on. It would be better I think to somehow show the existence of this privilege (or maybe highlight inequality would be a better way of phrasing it?) So that people can learn that way.

As seen on this thread, the poster has put a lot of people into defensive mode which kind of limits what can be achieved by it. It's also open to misinterpretation, as a few posters have said "should I be ashamed of being white?"... I don't think that the poster is saying that btw, but I think the interpetation of the people it's aimed at is more important than the original intention. If it's not getting the message out that it wanted to then it isn't working.

Certcert do you want a hand out of that large hole you’re digging for yourself?

sleepfreezone
Just bury me in it, already!

It's so difficult, because I know what I'm trying to say, but can't articulate

Can we just tackle racism and stop treating non white people as victims who we have to give "extra help" to. If we are not being racist then no one needs or wants the extra help, everyone is happy enough to run along fairly.

The issue is that the starting point isn't fair. Especially in places like Canada. No matter how poor and white trash I was, my starting point was far ahead of anyone living on a First Nations reserve.

Huuwayeye I agree that using the word privilege gets people’s backs up, but I think it’s actually the correct term.

It’s frustrating, to those that don’t have a certain type of privilege, to hear the people with privilege saying that they don’t have any and that it doesn’t exist. That people need mollycoddled and need a friendly, positive approach to even consider where they might be at an advantage.

Or, should I be thinking that the end result is the most important thing. Should I stop feeling frustrated and just try to think of better ways of getting this across?

more likely to get a job, government bodies actively recruit BME candiidates. There are even drives now that BME candidates are guaranteed interviews. I can honestly say I have never been pulled over by the police, though it does happen to others, thigh there are drives to make stop and search evidence based now so the answer would be to ignore crime has commenced. Also you then revert to non tangible answers being seen and judged because your black

So things are changing. That's a good thing, isnt it?

Acknowledging that there have been barriers and prejudice and that attitudes are changing.

Certcert Look we all know you’re trying to be inclusive in your words but you can see how impossible the whole situation is.

No one wants to be seen as a victim, no one wants to be pitied, everyone just wants a level playing field and equal opportunities. I happen to think this country offers one of best chances of actually getting this which is why it pisses me off so much that we’re so bloody down on ourselves here!

Well then tabby if we say I don't have the privilege of being white but o do have the privilege of having two parents who earned decent money, should I denounce my middle class privilege ? Or do we just say everybody is different and we must fight racism, sexism, homophobia etc when we see it ?

All it means is when black people are in these roles people know they've got there through a scheme and it undermines them

Isn't that the same for schemes to help disabled people get jobs, women get jobs etc?

OTOH - you get people saying that they want that place on merit, not because they were given a 'leg up'. Because then they have to prove their worth etc

But OTOH - people do face barriers so what's wrong with giving people an advantage

It's a very complex issue with arguments on all sides - and it cuts across many areas - class background, ethnicity, sex, disability etc.

Lots of different groups face barriers. Once we acknowledge those barriers exist, how can they be overcome.

Certcert it's ok I get what your saying, I don't actually find it offensive as you weren't actually trying to be offensive, I just disagree.

Certcert Look we all know you’re trying to be inclusive in your words but you can see how impossible the whole situation is.

That is what I was trying to do, very badly.

People who deny white privilege are of course white 🤗

I think lots of people here on MN agree that men have certain privileges over women. I haven’t been on here super long and only dip in and out. But, do lots of MN users also think that we should be finding a nice, kind, positive way to point out to men that they have privilege.

I’m just interested, because on Facebook so far I have only seen this need to change the tone of the message regarding white privilege, never anything else (that I can remember). I’m wondering if people are more accepting of their other privileges compared to white privilege. Just interested.

Of corse I've faced racism but not any institutional, and only very minutely in the workplace once.