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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

to ask for trans threads to stay in Feminism?

345 replies

yawning801 · 23/02/2018 17:11

Just that, really. This isn't meant to start a debate, or be goady in any way. I've just hidden the Feminism board to avoid the trans threads but they're seeping into AIBU (like this one I suppose Grin) and other places too and I'm trying to avoid them! Can we keep trans threads in Feminism please? TIA

OP posts:
Putyourdamnshoeson · 24/02/2018 11:17

Yabvu
That's all. The reasons have all been given.

Floisme · 24/02/2018 11:21

I'm another one who only realised what was going on because of threads in AIBU. I was slow to catch on because it all sounded so bonkers. I'm extremely grateful to the Feminism posters who were far quicker off the mark than I was.

walabaloo · 24/02/2018 11:24

but deliberately calling her "him" and deadnaming her doesn't add to your argument it makes you look like a bigot.
If you want to convince people your not transphobic, state facts stay polite
So are we suppose to state facts or lies? Your post isn’t clear. It’s a fact that Lily is a biological man, a man who’s been incredibly sexist to women. If your wanting me to call him, she, that is a lie.
We say he and she based on sex not gender.
I wouldn’t humour the flat earth society saying oh yes it is very flat isn’t it either.

^
I assume you are also going into schools to protest that kids are being told to call teachers "sir"? Or if someone calls Christopher Chris do you jump in then?

also, I have two ftm trans friends, for all the "vaginas belong in female toilets " posts I don't think any of you would appreciate my very bearded friends showing up in the ladies

FaithHopeCharityDesperation · 24/02/2018 11:26

saying all men who change gender past the age of 30 aren't "real" trans and have a fetish (the auto-gyne-whatsit that ive only heard of on Mumsnet?) Is ridiculous and is pretty transphobic.

It's actually the opposite of transphobic & is directly from research into transsexuals - I'm pretty sure it was categorised as such in earlier versions of the DSM under transsexualism, (although transsexualism was replaced with Gender Identity Disorder in DSM IV).

walabaloo · 24/02/2018 11:26

If you want to convince people your not transphobic, state facts stay polite and don't pull up extremists from tumbler as if they represent the trans majority.

I wouldn't, if it wasn't these extremist people in many cases getting public policy changed to disadvantage women. You are very naive.

^

And you are very condescending. Something else you may wish to work on if you want people to listen to you.

SwarmOfCats · 24/02/2018 11:30

I rarely checked out the feminism boards and wouldn’t have known anything about what’s going on if it wasn’t for threads in AIBU.

If you don’t want to read, don’t click on the threads. YABU.

walabaloo · 24/02/2018 11:30

saying all men who change gender past the age of 30 aren't "real" trans and have a fetish (the auto-gyne-whatsit that ive only heard of on Mumsnet?) Is ridiculous and is pretty transphobic.

It's actually the opposite of transphobic & is directly from research into transsexuals - I'm pretty sure it was categorised as such in earlier versions of the DSM under transsexualism, (although transsexualism was replaced with Gender Identity Disorder in DSM IV).

^

Really? I would love to see that research that suggests ALL males who transition late are just in it for sexual pleasure. Which is what I've seen stayed here. I'm not saying it doesn't exist I'm saying blanket statements are wrong.

gingergenius · 24/02/2018 11:32

I'm saying blanket statements are wrong.

Which is exactly why so many object to self ID. Because that's a 'blanket statement' of epic proportions, if ever I saw one.

walabaloo · 24/02/2018 11:34

I'm saying blanket statements are wrong.

Which is exactly why so many object to self ID. Because that's a 'blanket statement' of epic proportions, if ever I saw one.

^

Yes, as (I think) I said I agree there are issues with self ID but i was trying to make the point in my first post of WHY people dismiss some threads as transphobic.

gingergenius · 24/02/2018 11:35

@walabaloo try reading the most recent post by the user called AltogetherAndrew

Very very interesting reading about exactly why people are so concerned and not a blanket statement in sight.

gingergenius · 24/02/2018 11:36

Sorry @walabaloo - meant on the parallel trans thread that's running at the moment.

FaithHopeCharityDesperation · 24/02/2018 11:47

Really? I would love to see that research that suggests ALL males who transition late are just in it for sexual pleasure. Which is what I've seen stayed here. I'm not saying it doesn't exist I'm saying blanket statements are wrong.

Well the ALL in your post is a pretty blanket statement tbh.

Regardless, if you're genuinely interested - there were 2 categories of transexual proposed - wiki can give you an overview & then you can look up the different studies etc if you want.

Blanchard's transsexualism typology.

SpringHen · 24/02/2018 11:48

The banket statements here are that all boys/men who like dressing like girls or being called girls names are transgender and should have full access as such and should never ever be called a man in a dress.

Transexuals are basically told they dont exist, and the word THEY use to describe themselves is a dirty word (old school transexuals are the ones who have really and LITERALLY faught opression, these TRA kids know NOTHING of opression by comparrison and have no right to call transexuals traitors!)

People who have a genuine kink told "no, youre just in the wrong body, youre really a lesbian" instead of encouraged to find a partner who consents to indulge in the kink.
Kids playing with toys that are assigned yo the opposite sex, or girls not wanting to wear dresses or boys wanting long hair = transkids

Theyre your blanket statements!!

Ereshkigal · 24/02/2018 11:51

And you are very condescending. Something else you may wish to work on if you want people to listen to you.

Thanks so much for your concern!

FaithHopeCharityDesperation · 24/02/2018 11:52

I've started using 'transexual' now to cover the genuine group of people who I would absolutely fight to protect.

Transgender is a totally bollocks thing - it's basically just individual personality & expression by a different name.

Ereshkigal · 24/02/2018 11:53

Calling me condescending has no benefit on whether what I said was true. And it is. I don't post for your approval.

YellowFlower201 · 24/02/2018 11:54

Yabu. Dont read them! Why should other people stop discussing something because you don't like it. Confused

Ereshkigal · 24/02/2018 11:55

Bearing, not benefit.

walabaloo · 24/02/2018 12:09

Calling me condescending has no benefit on whether what I said was true. And it is. I don't post for your approval.

^
You have no idea of my level of naivety based on a few hundred characters, the fact you decided to dismiss my opinion based on it differing from yours by calling me naieve only to be upset when I pointed out you were being condescending shows ... well it shows you are close minded. I did not say trans issues should not be discussed, I did not say I believe in a any of the "blanket statements" people have given examples of or any of the other ideals/ thoughts that people are claiming the 'trans agenda' supports I was just explaining how to get the average joe to listen to your arguments without writing you off as bigots. You are free to disagree with what I've said but don't be so bloody dismissive when half the posts here about trans people are people complaining about their concerns not being taken seriously!

papayasareyum · 24/02/2018 12:10

YABVVU

Theglobe · 24/02/2018 12:10

Whilst I do see the potential problems with self ID, I don’t actually think that MN has decent discussions on it. There is one way of thinking and that’s it. Dissent isn’t tolerated.

It’s noticable on many of these threads that it’s the same posters shouting loudly and often. They appear to work in consort to drown out opposing voices. I imagine that an awful lot of posters have just given up trying to engage and now ignore.

The tactics that TRAs are accused of employing are no different to the anti self ID group on here.

gingergenius · 24/02/2018 12:13

So @Theglobe you have the floor. What's your take on it all?

SpringHen · 24/02/2018 12:13

Well thats just that old chestnut of telling women that if they would just be nice and polite instead of "hysterical" and loud, THEN people would listen to them. Never mind that loud angry women usually started off as polite reasonable women who were being ignored and walked all over so we know that doesnt work!

JigglyTuff · 24/02/2018 12:15

Women trying to stop our hard win rights being eroded are right to speak out.

UpstartCrow · 24/02/2018 12:17

Theglobe
As an analogy, if you put chilli in the stew, you only cater to people who like chilli. It excludes people who don't like it, dont fancy it, or can't eat it.
An inclusive meal would offer the choice of chilli or no chilli.

Now whats your take on it?