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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

Is this allowed?

162 replies

ThisLittleKitty · 22/02/2018 13:28

Does anyone know if this is allowed. Ex doesn't work or pay maintenance. He lives in a 3 bed housing association and rents out the rooms in the house (sleeps in the living room on the sofa so rents out 3 bedroom.) This gets him enough to live without having to work. He says he is allowed to do it and he has permission from the HA but when I spoke to the Cms and explained to them what he does and asked if they could take money from that, they said it was illegal and he want actually allowed to do it so they wouldn't be able to take any money from him. I'm not sure who is right as when I was younger my mum use to have a
Lodger and rent the box room out to him and she said it was allowed, she just had to pay a small amount to the council. Anyone know?

OP posts:
PaperdollCartoon · 22/02/2018 16:28

He wasn’t allocated it, he inherited it, also totally legal. HA tenancies are passed on to children.

Bluelady · 22/02/2018 16:29

I beg to differ. He's using social housing like an ATM. If that's not a bloody benefit I don't know what is.

crunchymint · 22/02/2018 16:30

No HA tenancies are not normally passed on to children.
They can be passed on once to someone already living there. They have to be living there for a minimum period, and many in the case of children say there has to be financial dependency on parent.

Bluelady · 22/02/2018 16:30

SO the system's badly wrong then. I can't believe you're defending this.

crunchymint · 22/02/2018 16:31

So a disabled adult child can normally have a tenancy passed on to them.
In many cases, with older people, tenancies are only in the mans name. So if he dies first the tenancy is passed on to the wife.

crunchymint · 22/02/2018 16:34

Most social housing tenancies are now for a maximum of 5 years.

Adarajames · 22/02/2018 16:42

It's very hard to downsize in many areas for those wanting to move from a family house once kids have left, bedroom tax has meant majority of 1 and 2 beds are hugely over subscribed when become available. Even in my borough where family house, or any houses, are desperately needed, I know people that have waited years to downsize and from a really nice family 3 bed in a lovely leafy road, because there just weren't any smaller preoperties available.

vintagebella · 22/02/2018 16:44

In England, tenancies were changed to a) stop a child inheriting when their parents died, even if they were still living in the property and b) no more secure tenancies. All new HA and council tenancies are now 2-5 years. Along with the bedroom tax, these changes were supposed to 'free up' social housing.

You can't do anything about the law as it was when the OP's ex inherited the property and there are very few grounds on which he can be evicted. Like it or not, that's how it is.

As an aside, in Scotland you can sublet your whole property (with permission), have lodgers, the right to buy has been stopped and private renters now have the security of long tenancies.

I'm not sure the situation re housing in England has been improved for all the changes but that's how it is.

TheHungryDonkey · 22/02/2018 16:49

I’m allowed to rent out spare rooms in my HA flat if I had them. I’m not allowed to go over a set number of tenants though. Depends on his tenancy agreement. Lodgers are not the same as a sublet.

Poshjock · 22/02/2018 16:51

Its is legal to sub-let or take in a lodger and this is regularly advocated on Martin Lewis' moneysavirngexpert site. There are caveats, HA, home owner or mortgage lender must know about and allow it. House insurance must also be informed. Earnings of £7,500 are permissible, above that must complete tax return. There is a difference between sub-letting and lodging - and the "landlord" can live in the property in both instances. HA may allow one or the other or neither.

It is possible that he is acting completely within the law, which would suggest that the CMS can and should investigate it. Perhaps if you do a bit of groundwork (ie report him to the HA and HMRC) and if no action is taken then go back to CMS and direct them to the HA and HMRC if necessary?

www.moneyadviceservice.org.uk/en/articles/rent-a-room-scheme-how-it-works-and-tax-rules
www.citizensadvice.org.uk/housing/renting-a-home/subletting-and-lodging/lodging/taking-in-a-lodger-what-you-need-to-think-about-first/

APontypandyPioneer · 22/02/2018 16:58

Depends on the type of tenancy. Ones granted these days don't have rights to succession I'm sure of it. They don't even grant social tenancies for more than 5 years of a time around my neck of the woods. But back in the day they were issued for life with the chance to hand it onto a family member.

C8H10N4O2 · 22/02/2018 17:56

Dh and I pay tens of thousands in tax to house this piece of scum

No you don't HA properties are not subsidised and most take a profit. OP has stated he doesn't claim any benefits.

The shortage of family sized properties is due to

  • flogging off most of the decent public housing stock
  • banning LAs from building replacements with any of the sales
  • then deregulating the private rental market so that there is no security (in England at least) which would enable people even on lower incomes to build stable lives in private rental

Older people who want to downsize can't find a swap due to lack of suitable 1/2 bed properties.

But hey, lets mandate that all HA tenants should curtsey to those lucky enough to be on the housing ladder in their own right. Wouldn't want them to get above themselves and think they have actual homes.

x2boys · 22/02/2018 18:09

My housing association allow you to take in lodgers they even advertise it on their website and have a section called "find a room " .

Bluelady · 22/02/2018 18:09

As taxpayers we do subsidise this guy because we're paying for his children.

C8H10N4O2 · 22/02/2018 18:21

As taxpayers we do subsidise this guy because we're paying for his children.

SRSLY?

x2boys · 22/02/2018 18:28

How exactly are housing associations subsidised ? For a start we dont all live in London or the south east and in some places including where I live the rent is comparable to private rent Hmm

lovemylover · 22/02/2018 18:40

Notasunnybunny even if i did want to move,which as i said i have no intention of doing,[unless something came up that suited me] there are no properties here such as i or 2 bedroomed flats/bungalows, when the bedroom tax came out there was only 2 on out local housing ASS website available, and the ones there are,which are occupied people have been in them a long time, some are even allocated to Druggies with warden care
I wont be pushed into a tiny 1 bed flat even if there was one,why should i give my pets up, to be miserable,
I do feel sorry for families wanting houses,and believe it or not there are young single mothers with 1 child in a 3 ved house, and an ex of my grandsons has just got a 4 bedroomed one with 3 children all under the age of 10, [not his] there are just no small properties to be had, but as i said before if something came up suitable for me,i would think again,
I have been told by my HA that i dont have to move if i dont want to,and at my age doubt if they would make me anyway

Original poster
ThisLittleKitty · 22/02/2018 19:02

Right op back just to clear a few things up

He will never downsize he has no intention to.
He lives in west london (a very nice part) which is why he gets enough to not have to work.
He is absent so not worried about any fall out.
And lastly I just wanted to know if anyone knew if it was allowed as I've heard mixed things about it. Seems he may actually be allowed.

OP posts:
x2boys · 22/02/2018 19:13

Check with the housing association Op mine does others may not these types of threads always end up full of misconceptions@

crunchymint · 22/02/2018 19:14

You do know Housing Associations are separate to Government? They have to raise enough money to pay their own way. Sometimes they get Government grants to give extra support to particularly needy tenants e.g. to take so many people who have come out of rehab and give them extra support to help them maintain their life and not go back to taking drugs. But for your ordinary tenant, the ONLY government payment is housing benefit.

LoveInTokyo · 22/02/2018 19:17

I’m pretty sure that even if you own the property yourself you can’t have more than two lodgers unless you get an HMO licence. Grass the fucker up.

lovemylover · 22/02/2018 19:27

Graphista thare are NO available properties for single people here, there are a few which come up, but there are so many single people needing them, people who have been sofa surfing, or homeless, this is a small town, and a lot of people, many are pensioners like myself,
I had my family with me of course, when i moved here, they are mosly all gone. married and moved away, one to Spain,
One of my sons who was living with me for a short time after a break up had his name down since he was 21, and hes 46 now,and just got a 1 bed flat close to me because of health problems,
He wasnt told he should stay here,even though i have the room,
You have to bid for a place here, its not a case of who is first on the housing list, its a case of bidding and if in enough need,hope someone else isnt in greater need, and as stated in my other post,there were 2 1 bed flats ,25 bidding for the flat my son got
and and 1 1 bed bungalow
Also as stated in my other post, sinle mother with even only 1 chil given a 3 bed house and 1 given a 4 bed house

Snowysky20009 · 22/02/2018 19:53

Jeez some lovely comments on here!

'He's not allowed to do it!!' Ummm yes, actually with most HA he CAN!

'He should give up his home!' Umm yes and go where? There are not enough smaller properties to meet demand.

'I'm subsidising his rent' ummm no HA rent is not subsidised. It's market value- a lot of private rental LL choose to charge higher rent.

Funny how so many on here appear to knows the ins and outs of a HA tendency, when they aren't a HA tenent!

Guess what- News Flash! ANYONE can apply for a HA property, as long as they reside in the area and don't own their own property. You are then put into a band depending on need. So you could have a household income of 60k, 3 kids and your private rental lease is about to expire and you will become homeless. Providing you are registered you would move up the bands.

Have to laugh at the amount of
People that have opinions on this, (not necessarily on this thread just in general), who complain about lack of housing, and issues such as this, yet actually their home is an ex council house! That's where our housing stock have gone too! That's why we have such a housing crisis!

Original poster
ThisLittleKitty · 22/02/2018 20:28

I'm not too fussed if he is allowed to do it or not. He's lived in the house all his life and I don't see him moving and that's his choice but if he is allowed to do it should be classed as an income.

OP posts:
Mossbystrand · 22/02/2018 20:38

If you want him to pay income tax then report him to HMRC. He's probably receiving the rental money as cash in hand to avoid paying tax. I'd make a discreet call to HMRC and let them investigate. If he's benefiting from the state by receiving subsidized housing then he has to be made to pay his way. Shop him to HMRC.

www.gov.uk/contact-hmrc

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