AIBU to think this child shouldn’t be in my son’s class?

[HicDraconis]

A boy at DS1’s primary school - P - arrived a couple of years ago having been excluded from several other local schools. He was violent and prone to angry rages if things did not go his way. One break time he jumped on DS1’s back and thumped him around the head. DS1 back kicked him off (he’s a brown tip belt in karate) and was taken to the office for observation (possible head injuries) for the afternoon. P has chased another boy through 5 classrooms and thrown a chair at him, smashed up one of the teachers’ laptops (family had to pay to replace it), that kind of thing.

This year DS1 started a new school (year 7, Intermediate, state school for what it’s worth). He sat an entrance exam which got him into the accelerated extension stream - this is a separate class from the rest of year 7 and maxed at 30 pupils.

Surprisingly, P has also been placed in this class as an extra. He can’t keep up with the standard of work, is disruptive and interferes with the ability of the other students to get on with things. When questioned, the head said he was put in that class for reasons of “strategy” - he didn’t sit the screening test but they think he’ll be easier to handle in this particular set.

The class teacher says they’re aware of his back history, that “strategies are in place and they are monitoring the situation carefully”.

When we accepted DS1’s place it was on the understanding that if he couldn’t keep up with the standard of work he’d be put into a different class.

DS1 is apprehensive about the possibility of being hit again. P has already scribbled over a piece of his artwork so far and we’re only a week into the new term. He’s also disrupted the class with bad behaviour, had various verbal warnings and one strike for verbally abusive behaviour.

AIBU to think that they’re doing P a disservice by putting him in a class where he won’t be able to keep up? Surely he’d be better looked after in one of the standard sets with a 1:1 TA (which he had at primary)? AIBU to think that if they were going to increase the class size to 31, the space should have gone to someone who narrowly missed out on the exam scores?

UK law has accountability at 10 and can be reported for assault

My son has a similar child allocated to his class and I had to fight to move my DS from this class - my DD has spent 3 years being terrified by him and she eventually moved schools - there was no way I was going to allow DS -

BUT I had emailed evidence of all the incidents that took place that I could present as a reason for moving him (this was unheard of in all the years the school had been open)

Email - keep a diary ask questions
After every incident report and ask how they intend to safeguard your child

If the child has a behaviour plan - it will need reviewing after EVERY incident - and amended

You should have the same curtesy

I think it’s probably human nature to want to protect your children. You are all right though. The only person I should be worried about is DS1. And P is none of my business.

DS1 will learn and achieve no matter who else is in the class. He’ll do it at home if he can’t do it in school. I’ll back away and let him handle himself. He’s more resilient than he used to be, karate is good like that.

Sounds like a good plan OP

He specifically asked about SEN / ODD type issues (I was prepared not to go postal if there were extenuating circumstances) but we were told there were none. And about the previous expu

DH didn't so much ask about SEN/ODD

Which was it?

Focus on your own child instead of participating in a witch hunt.

He didn’t specifically ask. I put it that way initially as it was easier - should probably have said it was specifically mentioned.

However. Focus firmly on DS1.

I would imagine the school intend to give him a few weeks in a small well behaved class in order to demonstrate beyond doubt that he cannot manage in a normal classroom situation.

And let's be honest losing a few weeks of education age 11 isn't going to affect your child in the long run. But this might enable P to get the support he clearly needs, without any long term impact on anyone else.

Fair enough OP. I'd be encouraging your son to keep talking and to report any incidents. He should feel safe in school.

I’m really surprised the school got into any discussions about the other child at all.
If a parent ever asks me about another student I say “sorry, I can’t discuss another student with you, just like I would never discuss your child with another parent”

You cannot choose who your child shares a class with. The school will be doing everything they can to manage the situation and are not answerable to you.
They cannot guarantee your child’s safety - nobody can guarantee human nature - but they will be doing their best.

Yabu And yanbu I think. Obviously your main concern is going to be your own child but if the school don’t have the resources to adequately support the aggressive child someone will be bearing the brunt of his behaviour wherever he is. They have chosen to go for the group where he will be least likely to get into bother which is likely the best they can do.
Ywnbu at all imo to request your child doesn’t sit with this child or be partnered up for any group work if he is fearful of him.

OP, the disruptive boy's needs do not trump your son's needs.
If your DS is anxious about another attack, continually on edge waiting for some incident, then he will not feel safe and will not be able to fulfil his potential.
Imagine if you were at work and, without provocation, one of your colleagues jumped on your back and punched you repeatedly in the head... You'd want action taken. You'd probably go to the police. But children, CHILDREN, are just expected to take it...
If the disruptive boy's behaviour is not improving in the accelerated class, then it sounds like it's not the solution for him either.

Fair enough OP. If it was my son, I would take a step back too. He proved he can fight his battles. Let him feel confident.

Of course it's your business, OP. Foolish of some to think otherwise.

If he didn't take the test he shouldn't be there, let alone his violent behaviour. You are right to monitor closely what's going on and to demand the school keep your child safe. If the child cannot be controlled he should be expelled. s should all violent children.

🙄

YANBU to be concerned about your child's welfare , but you can really only influence what happens with your own child directly, as the school will not be able to discuss the situation with the other student. Being the mother of a DS who struggled at school for a number of years and then got excluded last year (My DS was disruptive rather than aggressive-turns out he has ADHD and most probably ASD and could not cope in mainstream) , I see both sides of the story. My DS was placed in top set for English-because the teacher was used to dealing with challenging kids and the other students were not disruptive-he did very well in that class and managed to stay on track-that COULD be why they have placed him in that group. But essentially, it feels like this poor child is really struggling. And I find it really heart breaking. Kids do well when they can. No one wants to do badly and poor behaviour shows there are real issues at play here that need supporting in the right way. We had to fight for everything for our son who now has an ECHP which clearly shows, he needs extra support in learning, as they are very hard to get. Focus your energy on supporting your own child's learning-and i hope P gets the right support in place also to help him reach his full potential

It sounds like P has no business being in mainstream education at all given how violent and disruptive he is. His needs shouldn't trump those of the other 29 kids in the class, regardless of whether the rest of the class is high, low or average ability. Don't give up on the situation and don't feel bad for putting your own kid first! Keep a detailed log of any incidents involving this lad that adversely affects your son, report them to the school each time. Work with the other parents of the other kids in the class too, your voices may have more impact collectively than individually.

A 1:1 TA? He won't be entitled to that unless he's fully statemented for learning needs. Your best bet is to keep up the pressure on the head and if you get no joy there then take it up with the governors. There is actually very little you can do otherwise I'm afraid.

Rabbity the OP is in NZ not the UK so funding etc works differently. Also no governing body.

Sigh...

Some of you need to accept that a child who is disruptive DOES most definitely have an adverse effect on the learning of the other children - even if that child has additional support.

Actually, there will probably be a handful of children in the majority of ordinary classes across schools in the UK, whose behaviour impinges on the learning of their peers. (The exceptions are fee paying schools.)

Perhaps those of you who are accusing the OP of this or that, have children yourselves who are not that well behaved?

New Zealand, the UK - it really makes no difference. The point is disruptive children are part of an inclusive system. It is the modern way. So if you are a well behaved little soul who just gets on with it, you are expected to cope, somehow.

Treat the child as you would want your own child treated inf he had a similar life

If you were attacked in the street, the impact isn't 'less' because of any personal problems or previous up bringing.

Sometimes their hands are tied unless people complain. They have to gain evidence of issues and problems - until they can act.

Children attack teachers and they can't be removed from their classes (disgraceful)

I bet all the people being so righteous on here and giving the OP a hard time would act entirely differently if it was their child being affected, if their child had to be monitored for a potential head injury after being attacked - that could have been a real head injury

I feel for P - I really do - but he needs more individual attention and better strategies to help him cope in mainstream education because incidents are still happening .

It doesn't matter what class you are talking about - the kids will be affected

Children who are not in mainstream also don't deserve disruption and violence in their classrooms either. They also deserve to learn.