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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

To think it’s wrong of this man to film a child?

358 replies

MrsA2015 · 14/02/2018 23:02

www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-5391341/Passenger-films-toddlers-eight-hour-tantrum-flight.html

I can see why he filmed it but for it to be put on the net is too far! I feel quite sorry for the mother she must have felt mortified

OP posts:
Spikeyball · 16/02/2018 16:15

I think people should at least consider sn granny. The child in the video doesn't appear to speak at all which would be unusual for a 3 year old without sn.

I've had people pull faces about ds ( who is 12) making repetitive noises and banging with his hands whilst sitting in an sn buggy. Perhaps they don't "buy the whole disabled thing" either.

FranticallyPeaceful · 16/02/2018 16:21

I hate things like this. It’s so annoying traveling and somebody has a crying kid, but... it’s also just life. What are they supposed to do exactly? It’s far more stressful being the Mum of a crying baby than it is having to listen to it as a third person. You can give the kids all forms of entertainment but if the kid decides he’s not happy then, it is what it is.

You should be prepared for long travel with earphones and a phone full of music or movies, maybe a handheld device? Or maybe some form of tranquilliser from the GP if you suffer anxiety on long journeys?

FluffyWuffy100 · 16/02/2018 16:25

The kid clearly has additional needs, but bloody hell that is a rough old flight for the other people on there!

Lettucepray · 16/02/2018 16:30

I have Misophonia, I'd have also had a complete neurological meltdown having to deal with that for 8 hrs! People are so fucking selfish, if you know your child is going to behave like that you do something to alleviate the stress for EVERYONE. Why is it always about one person's needs?

FranticallyPeaceful · 16/02/2018 16:31

I also have misophonia and I have learned to wear a decent pair of headphones on journeys. I suggest you purchase some

FranticallyPeaceful · 16/02/2018 16:32

And in that case, you know yourself and know you’d have a breakdown due to a condition so stay away from long flights etc. Take your own advice

ChipVinegar · 16/02/2018 16:35

Didn't we find out the video was 2 years old already? Or did I dream that?

Lettucepray · 16/02/2018 16:36

FranticallyPeaceful

What level is your Misophonia? I'm a 7-8...i would have reacted I'm afraid, no headphones would have drowned that out. As I'm sure you're aware, Misophonia is a neurological condition so outbursts are sadly unavoidable.

FranticallyPeaceful · 16/02/2018 16:41

Lettucepray - given what you said about if you know your child would behave then do something to elevate the stress, I suggest you just don’t travel if you would have a “complete neurological breakdown”. Probably safer for everybody else if you didn’t. That or find a bloody good pair of headphones, which do drown out the sound entirely - you just need a good pair

Lettucepray · 16/02/2018 16:43

FranticallyPeaceful

Oh I see.....I have to take action to control my condition but others don't.....🤔

FranticallyPeaceful · 16/02/2018 16:50

Lettucepray I’m saying if you have that opinion then it applies to you also.

I also said earlier that everybody should just prepare best they can because life throws all sorts at you on long journeys. If you can’t mentlaly handle it then don’t do it - don’t expect other people to not make noise around you because YOU have a condition. It’s entitled and not always possible

BoneyBackJefferson · 16/02/2018 16:53

FranticallyPeaceful

If you can’t mentlaly handle it then don’t do it

Yet its ok to force a child in to this situation?

It’s entitled

The same could be said for the people that put the child in this position. Their entitlement has caused this child distress.

FranticallyPeaceful · 16/02/2018 16:56

BoneyBackJefferson - there’s a difference between a crying child and a fully grown adult having a full mental breakdown from a child crying.

Seriously.

Lettucepray · 16/02/2018 16:59

FranticallyPeaceful

And yet everyone else on that flight had to endure that child. We have to be fair to every one. Why should I not travel because I have Misophonia? Surely that's not right? I manage my condition as best I can but sometimes I react, it's completly out of my hands and I have exactly the same rights as anyone else to live my life. Screaming children are probably one of my biggest triggers, usually I'll leave if I can. There woukd have been no option on that flight. I manage MY condition, other's shoukd manage THEIR'S.

Lettucepray · 16/02/2018 17:00

FranticallyPeaceful

You do not have Miso if you think like that.

BoneyBackJefferson · 16/02/2018 17:06

FranticallyPeaceful

The only difference is that the child had no choice but to be on the plane, the parents made the choice.

And this child wasn't just crying.

Lettucepray · 16/02/2018 17:11

I think this is actually interesting as an ethical dilemma. Who's neurological condition takes precedence. Let's ponder that this child has some form of autism (I'm aware we don't know), well what if an adult who also has autism cannot handle the noise as many with autism can't, and starts having a meltdown...who's conditions trump the other?

BoneyBackJefferson · 16/02/2018 17:18

Lettucepray

You are right, but there are several ethical dilemmas on this thread

1/ Whose condition trumps another?
2/Do the parent/s have the right to put a child in a situation that would cause them undue stress?
3/ Do the needs/wants of the many out weight the wants/needs of the few?

Masterbuilders · 16/02/2018 17:23

See this is where the whole ‘it’s my rights argument falls down’. Without either playing SEN bingo or the pity party. People deliberately avoid anyone putting that awkward status quo forward.

Whose rights trump who’s. Let’s say fuck it to all the NT people they have to put up and shut up. However two disabled people? Who’s rights beat who’s? People can’t answer that without sounding totally out of order, so they don’t. Or they do and they are really hypocritical without realising.

I remember once being a position where my child screamed and screamed. We were at Disneyland. We didn’t fly god no, like I said before my youngest have never been on a plane for good reason. That means me, my husband and our eldest have ‘given up our right’ to go on a far away holiday because it wouldn’t work. I call it adapting to our children’s needs myself and not forcing them into a situation.

Anyway my child screamed blue murder because the train left and he couldn’t understand why. I have to say also being deaf it just went on and I knew it wouldn’t stop. There was another profoundly disabled child, much older and I could see this noise was too much. It was ‘our right’ to access the disabled carriage on the train as much as it was ‘her right’.

Being a grown up though and not being selfish, I removed my child from the situation to save further upset. I didn’t want to upset my child and thought we’d come back later when the platform was empty. That situation was not working. Equally the other child could enjoy the ride. That parent thanked me later in the hotel and said I didn’t have to leave, however it would have ruined the rest of the holiday for her DD if we’d just stayed and got on the train together as she wouldn’t have coped. She was actually quite tearful because she wasn’t going to ask me to leave, but it would’ve ruined her DD’s holiday. As a SN parent you do have to make decisions if something will be suitable and change them at short notice. Not bang on about rights. Working with others and thinking about others in the same boat. The child was like that before take off and he should’ve been removed with the running around and climbing. For his safety more than anything. It was not fair on him or anyone else.

I don’t know why so many people over the years rather than become fighters and advocates for disabled rights FOR ALL have become so selfish. I have said it before and I stand by it. I’ve been in this world with these fights for 16 odd years. Although acceptance has increased, tolerance hasn’t. Tolerance has actually got worse in the last two decades.

I do put it down to selfishness and the my rights brigade. I can almost hear the eye rolls nowadays if people hear of my children’s conditions. Almost like here we go, the excuses are coming.

If people were more understanding as a whole and were more considerate of others, including other disabilities. Supporting each other. So many people with disabled children have said if this was their child on that flight. They would have to leave or if stuck after take off it would’ve been really debilitating. How’s that fair? If people were not so quick to join the outrage bus of offence, screaming my rights. You might find people more tolerant.

Lettucepray · 16/02/2018 17:24

BoneyBackJefferson

Interesting. I suspect most would instantly put the needs of this child above any other but that is problematic in terms of my scenario with an adult with Autism. Personally I think if the parents knew this might happen they should have been more pro active, sedation, discipline, whatever. You can get your bottom dollar an adult with special needs would have most likely been restrained if they were having a meltdown and self harming for example.

Aeroflotgirl · 16/02/2018 17:33

The man should not have filmed the boy, and the words he uses to describe him are awful. However, the mother must have known what distresses her child, and if she had to go on that flight, she really should have gone to the child's paeditrician and asked for medication to sedate him, as its not pleasant for passengers to have that for 8 hours. I say this as a mother of a child who has ASD and learning difficulties who is 11. When younger we had to avoid flights, if we did, we asked for something from the Dr to calm her down and to relax her.

Spikeyball · 16/02/2018 17:55

If a child or adult has a severe disability that means they are noisy, disruptive etc where are they allowed to go? Anywhere out in public there are people who will object to their presence.

crunchymint · 16/02/2018 18:02

Sorry there are limits. Inclusion does not mean you can go absolutely anywhere with no thought to others. And I say that as someone with a disability who is unable realistically to access some things without spoiling it for everyone else.

Lettucepray · 16/02/2018 18:04

Exactly, inclusion should be for everyone, not just a few.

Aeroflotgirl · 16/02/2018 18:09

An 8 hour flight trapped in one place with constant noise is not the place to be with a child who becomes distressed in these types of situations. I know parents of children who don't fly, due to this. That is something they have come to accept.