Active discussions

Meet the Other Phone. Protection built in.

Meet the Other Phone.
Protection built in.

Buy now

Please or to access all these features

Talk
AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

To think it's not the end of the world if you can't have children?

336 replies

Jaygee61 · 13/02/2018 12:36

I speak as one who couldn't. Ttc for 10 years. It broke my heart. But I healed. I have a different perspective on things now. I feel there were worse things that could have befallen us, being diagnosed terminal cancer (OH did have cancer but it eas treatable fortunately) motor neuron disease, being paralysed in an accident. We live lives of joy and dignity.. We have created a great marriage and I'm proud of that. I love spending time with my nephew.

But society seems to view being childless by choice as a fate worse than death. Something not to be accepted but fought against at all cost. . If you're not prepared to go to any lengths to have a child you can't have really wanted one in the first place....

OP posts:
twinkledag · 14/02/2018 23:21

My kid is not overrated and I don't miss my old life one bit.

Leiaorganashair · 14/02/2018 23:30

Oh good lord clark how insensitive are you? Hmm

Sevendown · 14/02/2018 23:43

I’d have rather lost a limb than not had a child.

ljlkk · 15/02/2018 04:54

I miss my old life, too.

Lweji · 15/02/2018 07:20

I do think it's insensitive, instead, of people who do have children to come on this thread and tell people who don't that they'd rather have lost a limb or that they'd have killed themselves if they didn't have a child.

No, it shouldn'tbe a reason to kill yourselves and if you did, you needed help.
So, don't come and tell someone who is coming to terms with the pain of not having children how much more you'd suffer. You actually didn't have to cope with not having children.
And, no, it's not offensive or insensitive to say that children are overrated, even if you think there's nothing better.

You do have children. The OP doesn't. And you're telling her that her life isn't worth living? Fuck that.

Farmerswife36 · 15/02/2018 07:46

I can't believe people say children are over rated . How insensitive. There will be people on here that have lost kids to cancer or other awful ways and would give anything to have their kids back ! How disgusting to say such things !!

MadMags · 15/02/2018 07:49

Equally, it’s insensitive to say it would be preferable to be dead!

You can’t stop people feeling what they feel.

Lweji · 15/02/2018 07:51

Losing children is very different from never having them.
I'd have continued my life and would still be able to be happy without DS, but I'd be devastated to lose him.
Don't mix the two.

Trills · 15/02/2018 08:05

This was a brave (but perhaps slightly foolhardy) thread to start.

Trills · 15/02/2018 08:08

I suspect that if not having children can "ruin your life", whatever is/was wrong with your life wouldn't have just magically been fixed by having children.

MargaretCavendish · 15/02/2018 08:36

And, no, it's not offensive or insensitive to say that children are overrated, even if you think there's nothing better.

Of course it's insensitive to tell someone who desperately wants something that you have that thing but you're not that fussed about it anyway. What people have done - over and over again - on this thread is the equivalent of going up to a homeless person and telling them they're lucky, really, because sorting out a mortgage is a real hassle. It's crass and thoughtless.

Trills · 15/02/2018 08:40

I’ve just realised that in the second paragraph of my OP I meant to say childless not by choice. Sorry about that.

I did think that the whole way through. It makes a lot more sense that way.

Society says that being childless when you want children is the worst tragedy that can befall someone, You say it's bad, but it's possible to come to terms with it and live your life happily afterwards. That seems like a sensible thing to say.

Leiaorganashair · 15/02/2018 08:44

What was wrong with my life was that I was bloody lonely. So yes, having a child did help.

Some of the comments on here from parents are some of the most horrible I have ever seen on MN. Thoughtless horrible. I hope you don't know anyone with fertility problems in RL.

bubblebat · 15/02/2018 09:09

I suspect that if not having children can "ruin your life", whatever is/was wrong with your life wouldn't have just magically been fixed by having children.* *

I suspect that then you have zero idea that some people's lives and relationships potter along just fine until they go through the stress of infertility. It's as traumatic as a cancer diagnosis I think has been found... divorce levels rise...

Then the grief when you have to come to terms with it

While others lives simply naturally settle and families grow

Yes it can ruin your life. Most people don't want a baby to magically "fix" their lives. Angry

bubblebat · 15/02/2018 09:10

Buggered the quote part of my post

Lweji · 15/02/2018 09:28

What people have done on this thread is tell OP, who can't actually have children, how terrible their lives would have been without children.
The crass and insensitive posts are from those. People with homes or hope of having homes telling the homeless person how terrible and worthless their life is.

What is the OP, or anyone who finds out that not even IVF will work, supposed to do? Kill themselves? Live their lives in misery?

Think about it carefully.

Much better to find a way to be happy with whatever they have. Be it relationship, career, friends, other family, whatever.

Incywincyteenyweeny · 15/02/2018 09:30

Interestingly, I have found attitudes different to the ones on this thread. Having ds in my late 20s most of my friends were focusing on career and the found my decision odd. Some actually looked down on me for not establishing my career more and now of course with part time hours the opportunities to progress are largely reduced and I wouldnt want to take on extra training. Some of my child free friends looked at my decision to have a child with a more modest home, older car and less experience of travel and the finer things like complete madness.
Now we are heading or into our 30s a couple more friends have dc but children still are not Part of the plan in the immediate future for many of them. I expect some will come to the conclusion that other things matter more than starting a family. I know that being childfree doesn’t guarantee a fabulous career, excellent social life and tons of spare cash, but whatever your circumstances you are more likely to have more of these things without children than with purely because of the time and financial commitment of children.
Some of my friends may eventually find they have left it too late for dc. Others may have their family later in life.
Whilst most in my social circle would acknowledge the grief of someone childless who wants to be a parent, I don’t think anyone I know universally feels as though children are the means to being fulfilled. Many of them look at me, and I think it puts them off dc. Although I wouldn’t change my lifestyle for the world.
I suppose it’s all about what you want, and if you can’t have what you want whether you can adapt to what you have and How you are able to view it. My heart does go out to those struggling with infertility if they are not able to come to terms with things. It’s good to hear some like the op find peace and other ways to enjoy life that are just as fulfilling.

welshsoph · 15/02/2018 09:34

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

LoniceraJaponica · 15/02/2018 09:49

That's an excellent post Incy

MargaretCavendish · 15/02/2018 10:07

But you're completely ignoring the wider context, where the infertile find it hard to get people to take their grief seriously as a grief at all. The flippant response that 'oh, having kids isn't all that' is a huge part of that. After one of my miscarriages someone told me 'oh, you can have one of mine if you want' and some one else said 'but it's not really a big deal if you can't have biological kids, is it, because you could just adopt?'. This thread has bought out those responses in droves, and while this clearly wasn't OP's intention, it has been full of people dismissing a pain that is already really badly supported and acknowledged.

MargaretCavendish · 15/02/2018 10:15

I guess my point is that you can both acknowledge infertility as a real and continuing pain and loss and to suggest that there may be ways to move forward beyond the initial grief - just like we do with any other kind of loss (we don't tell widows that it's no big deal because having a husband is annoying, but nor do we tell them that we'd kill ourselves if our husband died or that they'll never feel happiness again - and if we do say either of those things we're insensitive idiots). Saying 'oh having children is a bit shit anyway lol' doesn't do either of those actually helpful things. People don't learn to live with loss by being told that their loss was trivial in the first place.

ralfeesmum · 15/02/2018 10:23

Many religions, the Roman Catholic church in particular, stipulate that the main (and indeed ONLY reason) for marriage is to produce the next generation.

Really? That sidelines a lot of couples who can't have or have made an active decision not to have children.

Is that truly the one and only reason for women's existence? Otherwise we're just a pointless species?

Nah - 9 and a half billion people on our little planet and we're urged to churn out kiddies like we're a fish finger production line........if that it supposed to be our ONLY mission in life then we may as well give up now!

SaskaTchewan · 15/02/2018 10:28

At least our fairy tales end with "and they live happily ever after"
In some other countries, the final line is "and they got married and had lots of children" Grin

Lweji · 15/02/2018 10:36

Many religions, the Roman Catholic church in particular, stipulate that the main (and indeed ONLY reason) for marriage is to produce the next generation.

It used to be.

Not so much anymore.

"1654 Spouses to whom God has not granted children can nevertheless have a conjugal life full of meaning, in both human and Christian terms. Their marriage can radiate a fruitfulness of charity, of hospitality, and of sacrifice."
www.vatican.va/archive/ccc_css/archive/catechism/p2s2c3a7.htm

Lweji · 15/02/2018 10:50

I guess my point is that you can both acknowledge infertility as a real and continuing pain and loss and to suggest that there may be ways to move forward beyond the initial grief - just like we do with any other kind of loss (we don't tell widows that it's no big deal because having a husband is annoying, but nor do we tell them that we'd kill ourselves if our husband died or that they'll never feel happiness again - and if we do say either of those things we're insensitive idiots).

I agree to a point, but infertility is more akin to never getting married (or having a partner), IMO.

It is different to lose a person than to never having them in our lives.

I don't think we should ever assume that we'll have children (or a husband) or make our lives or our happiness dependent on having them. It's a recipe for unhappiness if it doesn't happen or it takes longer than expected. I understand that some people view it like this, but they should also acknowledge that it's not the same for everyone. And it doesn't invalidate their feelings or pain, but they shouldn't try to shut down people with different feelings either.

If you are trying to find meaning to life without having children, the experiences and points of view of those for whom having children was/is important but not so much that it consumed their lives, should be valid and useful.