To find this offensive? No whites allowed

[chipvinegar]

www.google.co.uk/amp/www.foxnews.com/lifestyle/2018/02/12/wellness-retreat-in-costa-rica-that-bans-white-people-sparks-controversy.amp.html

I don't live an America, and I have no experience of racism in America, I somewhat understand the desire to have a "safe space" or a space to hold conversation around the issues, however the lady running it "eliminated all white people from her personal life" doesn't think white people should own passports etc

That's a lot of negativity for a "healing" retreat

The empowerment part... yeah, but the self segregation? Travelling backwards rather than forwards somewhat surely?!

Patriarchy what’s your definition of racism then?
And don’t you think that the fact black people aren't imposition of privilege compare to whites who are, also has something to do with such position??

No it's not Married, if you are thinking that was your on a very slippery slope down. So it's ok to be racist against one race, their game right! That is not something we should be supporting and encouraging in any race!!!!

Racism in any race, black, white whatever should not be tolerated, or where do we draw the line.

confused because even though some sub groups of whites have ‘less’ privilege than other subgroups, they still have MORE privileges than the black (or other ethnicities).

Eg have you read about Seren Williams and what happened when she gave birth?
She nearly died/lost her baby because she wasn’t listened to. Like a lot of other bald women, and despite the fact she is rich ANd famous, she still was part of the very high number of black women who didn’t receive adequate care (the number of deaths during the birth are staggeringly higher in black women)
If she had been white, even from an eastern country etc... numbers show that it is highly likely she wouod have been better treated.

Married3Children*

You are conflating two different things. The existence of a resort for non whites only which i think most people find 'problematic' but can understand.

And the racist views of the owner of that resort. They are separate things. One is acceptable, one isn't. Whether the owner has been 'oppressed' or not, making the statements she has made about white people is racism.

I think it's great personally (I'm white).

Married3Children

My definition of racism is the definition of racism, you know, the one from the dictionary?

aeroflot what IS racism in your view and can it ever be separated from the expression of power??

If you remove the skin colour from the equation and say
group A has been exploited and treated like shit by Group B for generations and generations
they now have decided to create a safe space and live their lives separated from Group B for their own safety

Is that ok because it’s not racist anymore as people from whatever colour can be Group A or B??

I really dint think you can separate racism from its roots, which the power whites had on blacks, as well as the way they have treated them. Esp when you remember that those people STILL live day in and day out the fact that white people have more power than them and still use it to their advantage.

Eg. Have you ever thought about teaching your 4 yo what to do if the Police comes close to them. Teaching they need to look nice and unthreatening. Teaching then to say their name as well as their age. Teaching your teen to keep the hands in the wheel if they are driving, to not move their hands Wo telling the cops first?
That’s what ouf is for black people in the US.
And that’s also why you cannot separate the issues linked with skin colour and privilege/over use of your power.

Oxford English Dictionary definition of Racism

1Prejudice, discrimination, or antagonism directed against someone of a different race based on the belief that one's own race is superior.

‘a programme to combat racism’

That can be any race, just because she might have been treated badly by whites, or just simply hold those views is not right. If this gives the green light for other black people to openly display these views, than it is totally unacceptable.

I think people are entitled to want a ‘safe space’ or even to have a space which specifically caters for their particular preferences or needs. Hairdressers for black people are OK as they will have specific expertise in working with black peoples hair. They don’t need to say no whites allowed to do this they simply need to slant their service towards a specific client group.
White men have much to answer for in terms of oppression across the globe but the answer is probably not a total ban on white men everywhere. The struggle of women has taken many years and there is a way to go globally but there is improvement. Suffrage, the number of women in positions of political power (thanks Angela for rebalancing the horrors of Thatcher), women driving in Saudi, married women teachers, female bishops. The struggle of black peoples is also an ongoing challenge but there are green shoots. A black president, Equally legislation but has much further to go. I suspect particularly in America. I’m not sure the owner’s perspective is helpful and trivialises the real battles.

But she didn’t say she though blacks were superior. She said she wants to have nothing to do with them.
Because Group B has happened to abuse her in many ways thanks to their privilege and position of power.

So Married would you not discipline your child if you heard them say "white people are trash, they are dirty" or would you just leave it as they are game. Then it will seep into other areas, should it be acceptable in schools and organisations. Sorry any statements or views like that against any race is totally unacceptable.

Married3Children

See I would argue that would depend on what country you happen to be in. And if we are taking individuals for example in England I also think class can come into play.

Some of my family are French & Jewish & lots of Jewish people are migrating due to anti semitism.

I think a Black only retreat is fine, if it was coming from the right intentions. This obviously, based on her personal feelings, isn’t.

She wants to ban all white people from travelling outside the US, and that they should not have passports. Totally unacceptable, yes she is entitled to her views, but she should not be stating them, they are racist, unpleasant and unacceptable.

I don’t actually see anything wrong with a retreat for black people. I just don’t think you can apply the American view of race to Europe.

Her views are suspect though.

Married3Children

What you are describing is white privilege, but you are missing the point entirely that privilege, in the social theory meaning of the word, relates to a class of people as a statistical average, not to individuals.

On average there is an ethnic majority privilege in the US against black people because of subconscious bias. (It's key to understand that in studies even black people display the same subconscious biases against other black people, which is one of the reasons why a lot of black men are shot in America by black police officers)

How does that relate to what we are discussing? It doesn't really. Just because there is a majority ethnic bias against some minority individuals in a country, doesn't mean it's then ok for the minority individuals to be racist.

What a load of crap is spouted here. All white people have benefited? Oh yes loads of working class whites are far better off than the middle class black professionals like Chukka and Asians like Kahn or Vaz because they are white. What utter hypocrisy. This is racism against whites, pure and simple.

This all denies agency and choice for black people. This is suggesting they must be criminals or an underclass because white people made them so without the, having any say in the matter. This is to reduce people to the lowest status and without independence and reinforces the idea that hard work cannot be rewarded because of "white people hoarding all the power". Yeah. 'Cos Colin Powell never became the most senior person in the US military. 'Cos Condelezza Rice never was senior in government. 'Cos Obama want president. So rather than confront your erroneous beliefs it's easier to state that these examples of success were successful because they were white on the inside.

The left wing identity politics is hateful as it denies potential for what you can choose to do and forever condemns you to live based on skin colour or whatever identity you have. Intersectionalists are even worse and the existence of empathy is denied.

People of colour in the West live in a context where they are subject to prejudice, hostility, discrimination and aggression on a continual basis. Economic and social structures restrict their choices and violence is consistently enacted towards them by the state as well as by private individuals.

Of course it's not all white people, but it's enough of us, together with endemic institutional racism, to explain why Black people are justified in being angry.

Getting exasperated with this situation and attempting to withdraw from it is not 'racism' ffs.

Oppressed classes (like black people, women, etc.) are entitled to gather and commune in spaces closed off to their oppressor classes.

Oppressed classes (like black people, women, etc.) are entitled to gather and commune in spaces closed off to their oppressor classes.

If you like. It's telling the alleged oppressors that they can't travel for pleasure or on business because of their race which is beyond the pale.

The idea that all white people have benefited is the reason there is a push back happening at youth level across Europe and in the US.

The Identity politics crowd are bewildered that when someone is told all of the problems other people face are because of your ethnicity or genitals then they will automatically start playing the same divisive games.

My son gets far more advantage than any of the white working class boys

Race relations in America are so unbelievably absurd that it spawns this sort of nonsense. It shouldn’t be allowed to spread. It is racist because it is so very obviously racist. This legalistic justification based on this and that is not conducive toward people living together and only splits groups apart