to think it's time to bin the word feminism

[whatnow123]

Good Morning Britain conducted two seperate polls. One asked the public if they identify as a feminist, 85% said no. The other asked if you believe in gender equality, 85% said yes.

Susanna Reid & Charlotte Hawkins, both feminists, stated they are the same thing. Clearly most people don't agree.

Regardless of the dictionary definition, the word "feminism" appears to be tainted. Does the word now do more harm than good by turning off both women and men from ideals we agree upon?

@RatRolyPoly charming, thank you. I see you too have your fan club to chuckle along at your witty responses.

The sort of thing that annoys me on Mumsnet is there was a light-hearted thread on Chat about some jacket Theresa May was wearing. It was all going swimmingly until a group of posters arrived to call us misogynist for criticising another woman. Effectively no platforming a conversation about the PM's dress sense, when she herself had made her fashion choices public by signing up to an article in American Vogue.

All the minute analysis of the lyrics of ancient pop songs gets me down too. Baby It's Cold Outside. Someone even objected to Wake Up, Little Susie. It makes women look ridiculous.

All those years campaigning to persuade people that women wouldn't have a fit of the vapours if they had to conduct an autopsy or their hormones wouldn't get in the way of making important decisions - and now it's all trigger warnings and trauma.

Emily Davidson must be turning in her grave.

Sorry you're having a shit time rat. Assassinated you mocked me with a bunch of self indulgent stuck up responses while backing up another poster on here who was ripping me apart. It was a while ago and I've since name changed so don't act so butt hurt. You give as good as you get, you're just a lot more condescending about it. At least rat was to the point and spared you a load of high and mighty bullshit. Why don't you start doing the same

Ah yes @thymeout. And that time someone started a thread saying they hated khaki parkas and black leggings and someone called them a misogynist because they weren't criticising men's clothes too.

Not allowed to have an opinion on anything nowadays or fart the wrong way without offending somebody.

@hollowtree whatever you like, whoever you are.

thymeout yep there was one about hair removal, started with a few helpful suggestions and descended into madness about how all women who shave are an abomination.

I feel like I'm in second grade and want to yell "You're not the boss of me!"
The verbal abuse of other women that some of you are indulging yourselves in says more about your failure to marshal a cogent argument than it does those you are name calling.

Lol. Must remember to be nice next time people throw shit at me, just like a good girl should. If it ain't men telling me how to behave it's feminists!

Or you could just accept the fact that if you tell porkie pies people will throw shit at you. It's a thought.

“I don't feel scared of men, I walk alone in the dark all the time, I've never been catcalled by builders, I've never had any sexist comments in the workplace, I get the same salary as my boyfriend in the same job. The only cases I know of of controlling/abusive relationships were women controlling men. I just do not feel oppressed or like a victim and never have done. Yet it seems really taboo to say that to a group of feminists”

It’s perfectly fine to say that’s your experience. It’s not perfectly fine to say that it must therefore be every other woman’s experience.

Oh do spit it out bewilderness, "porkie pies", my great big hairy lady-boy balls. What don't you advanced search my posting history and tell me why you think someone with a mainline in talking about breastfeeding and c sections - from personal experience - over the course of years - is in fact a dedicated transactivist handmaiden in the space of a week? But actually don't bother, I'll help you out: ITS BECAUSE I DON'T AGREE WITH YOU.

Now piss off with your underhanded jibes and "my way or the high way" feminism back to the Feminist board where I'm sure you'll all have a lovely time organising a "women in industry" conference or establishing a local event to encourage girls to overcome stigma and participate in sport... oh wait... you won't.

But yeah, you guys are the feminists, right on.

And I would apologise for derailing, except I'm not really am I. This is precisely the fucking problem.

Now I'm sure you'd like to tell me that I "have a cake to ice" gendered insult but I'll save you the bother. I'm off to do the washing-up in a pinnie whilst throwing women under a bus. Ta-ra for now.

Well, it’s not strictly true to represent feminists as believing that all transwomen are rapists and sports cheats, is it?

But saying that repeatedly is an excellent way of making discussion about legitimate concerns very difficult. I have concerns about self identification. For all I know, my concerns are completely groundless. But I don’t know, because every time I try to raise them they are either swerved or dismissed as hate-speak. If I raise them again, will you address them? More substantively than by saying “oh, i’m sure it’ll be fine”?

Bertrand, yeah, that whole feminist board where 99.9% of posts are dismissing your concerns as "hate speak". Why don't you head back over there and start another one of about 509,372 threads on the subject, all of which are almost exclusively populated by people who will dictate inform and validate your concerns - hundreds of them - and do so vocally; you poor thing with no-one to talk to.

I don’t want my concerns validated. I want them addressed.

Hollow and yolo, so should womens tits be in or out? Couldn't work out from posts?!

Ah I see. We've been kettled in the feminist area.

I think women's human right to have their tits photographed and splashed all over the media was being infringed. Although I had difficulty there too

Hahaha, yeah, okay. Go find someone to do that then, hey? It's not on my head.

“Hahaha, yeah, okay. Go find someone to do that then, hey? It's not on my head.”

I rest my case.

Yeah. Unless you've specifically stalked the boards looking for rat to pin her down and force her to answer your concerns that just makes zero sense!

Right, so feminists are whiny, victimy, terfy bullies..

And if you don’t agree that proves it.

A sort of modern day Morton’s Fork.

certain and lethal They should be exactly where women want them to be. Isn't that the whole point in feminism.

In fact, can't someone PLEASE do me a fucking huge favour and tell me exactly what IS the point in feminism now?

I thought it was equality, but if that was the case everyone would be agreeing. But this is one of the most hostile areas of MN. So what exactly is the point of feminism now?

If it's to make everyone feel shit and like they are wrong for not loathing trans people, hating pornography, being housewives and not blaming all men for absolutey everything then it's doing a fucking fine job!

I think that this conversation chain shows that women don't all agree on what feminism should mean and we have different points of view.

We're allowed to you know. Not all men agree on every topic either. But why does our disagreement fall to person pointed comments and slagging offs?

I'm not a feminist because I feel the term is marred by discussions like this that give it a bad rep.

I am an egalitarian (I don't understand why people are using equalise when there is a term already for this). I want women's rights to be taken seriously, along with the rights of everyone else.

I don't have an issue with trans women in dressing rooms, but I am concerned about implications in prisons and I am interested to see how everyone's interests can be protected in those scenarios.

I do get nervous walking in the dark. But so does my strapping ex military partner.

I've never been cat called or wolf whistled. I feel sad that I wasn't pretty enough to get one when I was young enough.

I have no issue with women who want to get their boobs out for the camera, but I'm not one of them.

We have rights to our own opinions and must also accept that others do to. Even when their opinions seem daft to us. We should explore their rational, consider whether there are ways to influence each other's thinking, but we should stop being mean to each other....