To find my gentle parenting friends infuriating?

[Littlemissmuff]

NC as this may be outing.

I have 3 friends, all have toddlers between 2 and 3 years old.
Our children play together frequently and their parenting style is driving me mad.
One of them literally never says no to her son, he can hit our childre or destroy something but instead she insists on talking nicely to him even though he is definitely not listening.
Another one has a huge moan several times a day about how tired she is and she fed up of her toddler getting her up all night to breastfeed; however won't do anything about it and won't take any suggestions such as water or night weaning and states that it is cruel and our roles as mothers are to cuddle our children all night if we have to if that's what they demand even at age 3.
I don't care how they parent their child but I do when it's affecting my son, he is forever getting pushed about by these kids now and he is constantly seeing them doing really dangerous behaviour and "risk taking" without any parent intervention which then makes me look awful to him if i tell him no if he tries to copy them climbing on to the TV stand or windowsill.
I don't know what research shows, but my god these children are so much more naughty than any other children I know.
Aibu to end our playdates even though it might end our friendship?

Like previous posters, I would describe myself as a gentle parent, but yes, my son is certainly told 'no' is he is doing things that are destructive, or are upsetting others and other techniques have not worked.

I'm confused I thought gentle parenting was that you were not allowed to say 'no'. If it isn't that, then I'm a 'gentle' parent. And, OP, your friends just seem like they can't be bothered to discipline.

I know someone that does this style of parenting and she is endlessly posting on FB about how wonderful her methods are. There is something incredibly sanctimonious about it. However, the reality of her children's interactions are very sad. Her son in particular is completely out of control. No one finds him endearing, funny or cheeky. She is raising a child that is being socially excluded by his peer group as he has not been taught to self regulate in anyway. It is very very sad and is fairly dangerous rubbish that these websites that she is linked into put out there. Her son is being set up to fail on every social front imaginable and no doubt many of her friends are doing what you are doing which is dropping her because of it.

I've been around the block a bit, had many children all of whom are adults now. Gentle parenting is another much nicer name for passive parenting. I've seen many kids grow up. The ones who has no boundaries had issues as teens and as adults now have other issues . Some of these are spending money they don't have, failed relationships
Drugs and alcohol abuse, failing to hold down a job. I will get flamed for saying this but it's only based on the many people I've seen grow up without boundaries. These children you're talking about are the adults of the future. If they aren't taught how they should behave how will they know.

Loads of good advice from BertieBotts and others on this page, sorry not read all pages.

I have two kids and we use an attachment style of parenting. It works well and my kids are well behaved out of the house.

I'd never mix with friends whose kids hurt mine. I do have one friend whose son is a bit of a 'horror head' (as my mum would say!). I just never see her with her son now.

Posters on page 9 I was reading on this page, I mean.

Find new friends, seriously, they won't change their way of parenting and you will just get more and more upset. I know it seems bit harsh but it's just pointless getting upset about something you can't control. Done it, and believe me it's the best thing to do x

YANBU.

I’ve never read any gentle parenting books that advise not to say “no”, so not sure where that comes from? Everything I’ve read (Sarah O-S, Janet Lansbury) clearly states that small children need boundaries. What are they reading? I night weaned both DDs at 18/19 months with the help of a gentle sleep trainer. She helped me to put in place a great routine and ways to help the girls stay in their beds and sleep through. No CC.

TBH, your friends sound lazy and annoying and unless you really like them, I’d be looking to find some new friends. I’ve always chosen lots of different activities and places to go for variety. I have Mum friends from all walks of life, with different parenting styles. It helps a lot! I couldn’t hang out with the same mums every day. It would drive me mad!

As for the behaviour you describe:
Hitting and pushing - not acceptable. All small children do this at some point but a parents’ job is teach them it’s unacceptbale. How do you do this if you don’t say no? There’s a world of difference between smacking, shouting and saying no. I don’t buy that children are harmed by being told no. How will they stick up for themselves in the future?

Climbing on your furniture - depends how really and as other posters have said it’s your house. I would stop a child from doing something unsafe or destructive.

I’ve also been outspoken about things I find unacceptable that other children are allowed to do. Mine are a little older and have said “but so and so is doing it” and I just say “well that’s up to their mum. I’m saying no” firmly to child. I’ve changed my thinking on some things over time. But I know what I find acceptable and age appropriate. That’s my job to decide not my child’s to define for themselves.

The sleep thing may be frustrating but I had all the sleep problems and it was super hard to make a call in a sleep deprived haze. Sometimes, cuddling or feeding to sleep in the early hours can seem like the only option. I imagine my moaning was grating. I honestly didn’t know what to do and wished I’d seen our sleep consultant earlier.

As a society, a lot of us are missing the point about childhood. Your DCs need help understanding and dealing with Authority. It will be with them from school, through work and always as the Letter of the Law. If you don’t introduce your children to how authority sounds, reacts and how best to deal with it ie, through explanation, negotiation & remorse where appropriate, then how will they handle the first experience when someone does not gently explain to them that their behaviour is ‘not nice’? We have lost the ability to be parents, we prefer to be doting best friends...

I am in the middle of the outcome of gentle parenting 10 years on. A child that does not understand how belting everyone round him has any connection with him not really having many friends. Walking home alone and generally getting the brush off from his classmates.
He is immature and self absorbed.
His mother seems oblivious. Blind. Incapable of seeing him doing anythign, even if it is actually happening under her nose.
He has hit my daughter many, many times and many many times i have pointed it out to Mother who told me night was day and black was white. We gradually ghosted them and now my DD keeps him at a very long distance.
Other parents have tried to penetrate her solid view that he is only interested in doing the right thing. Cannot make any headway.
The gentle parenting has come to fruition with a quite bewildered, unboundaried kid who when he goes up to secondary school, will hit or shout at the wrong kid who's big sibling will come down and have a straightner with him.
My advice is don't waste your energy. They are setting their kids up for a life full of surprises

No matter which parenting style you choose, of your children are unruly and badly behaved then it's not working

There were times I didn't set clear boundaries and stick to them when my children were much younger. My 21-year-old son is serving a very long prison sentence, at least partly because of this. EXTREMELY difficult for ALL our family, friends and everyone else affected by his case

People dont realize how very unpopular you have to be to be a half way decent parent.
It doesn't mean shouting and roaring day in and day out or military marches through the front room to keep the kids in order.
I noticed that often, kids regulate other kids who are getting a bit beyond themselves. They simply won't play with kids who wont follow the rules or are selfish etc.
And i think we should lead by example too. No point telling a kid to do something if we ourselves aren't following regulations. If a parent doesn't say please and thank you then why should a child?

End the playdates. Here’s my experience, the mum was a gentle parent and their kid was allowed to run near roads, climb on anything their little heart desired and had never heard the word no. I was constantly worried about my DC copying them and getting hurt despite me saying ‘No’ and ‘I don’t care if they can do X you cant’ I hoped that my parenting would override their influence. Guess what happened? My child copied them before I could stop them and the consequences could have been horrific. I was so angry at myself because I knew it was only a matter of time. Trust your gut and protect them in any way you can.

sallyfox that sounds like an ongoing nightmare. Sorry to hear that has happened to your family.

As previous posters have said gentle parenting does not mean setting no boundaries and not saying no.

sallyfox
Can I just say how much I respect you for your post? Expressing that thought about your DS can’t have been easy. My best wishes to you and your family and hope that dealing with this will get easier for you all

I'm going to disagree on some level and say that I've always been quite impressed by people who were patient with their small children, and didn't spend a lot of time shouting at them to behave. There are plenty of parents telling their children off, smacking them in public, giving warnings and threats, swearing at their behaviour, criticising them and I often wonder whose benefit it is for? Stress reliever, saving face? The children don't appear to behave any better for it and usually they are behaving badly because they are bored, tired or hungry or trapped in a plane seat or buggy. All toddlers have tantrums not just the gentle parented ones.

Some mothers who breastfeed for a long time may be suffering Vitamin D/iron deficiencies which accounts for exhaustion - their toddlers may also be suffering from deficiencies/weak immune systems if this is not noticed. But it isn't to do with gentle parenting and very much to to with deficiency.

Attached babies usually grow into quite nice 5 year olds, who trust grownups ,not the clingy malfunctioning creatures you describe.

Gentle parenting is about putting your relationship with your child/children first before you worry about what everyone else thinks, and then usually babies and mothers in these situations benefit society long term rather than being destructive anti social angry people, which is what neglectful relationships in extreme situations create. But it doesn't mean neglecting respect for yourself as a mother and that can mean setting some boundaries, around sleep and behaviour - babies usually understand this quite quickly, and they learn to "take turns", rather than being entirely selfish, if you let them.

God, I didn't even know gentle parenting was an actual thing.

I guess the intention is to raise kind gentle children but it's funny that these parents don't have kind gentle children. They have feral little gits. At least my kids are feral little gits who do know boundaries and understand that hitting is not on, running around like a loonie in a cafe is not on, totally ignoring the swimming teacher and nearly drowning is not on.

I also hate this style of parenting and I think they are just lazy fuckers who can’t be arsed to enforce any rules or boundaries.

I had exactly the same issue when my child was young. My two friends let their children run riot and let them do really dangerous things while parents sipped wine and pretended they didn’t exist. I withdrew from the friendship slightly by sending my child to different school. The stress of them wanting my child to do sleepovers etc terrified me. We have had no problems with School friends so I know I was right to withdraw slightly!

I guess the intention is to raise kind gentle children but it's funny that these parents don't have kind gentle children. They have feral little gits

That made me laugh.

Peoplr who implement boundaries witb gentle parentinf techniques generally don't bleat on about it and their kids are well mannered and well behaved.

Parents who raise little brats who have no boundaries tend to use selective elements of gentle parenting to justify their permissive parenting and usually turn into the parents who are raising hell with school because school expect rules following

My gentle parenting acquaintance seemed to think she was a natural at parenting and thus didn't need to do all the silly business with rules and what have you when everything should be organic and free.
She picked out the pieces of parenting theories that slotted neatly alongside this outlook, wrapped it all up with hairy twine and jogged along in varying states of chaos.
She thinks housework is boring and washing over rated for bodies and clothes. Everything has to be an adventure or a memory, preferably with a lovely cafe nearby....
I see it as Parenting a la National Trust.

As previous posters have said gentle parenting does not mean setting no boundaries and not saying no.

The we don't say no thing would do my head in. Call it a day, the play dates sound boring as anything....its remimds me of those early playgroup days with your PFB but yeah after 3 years conversation needs to move on imo!

Lola with all respect, you have no way of knowing if that child (aged 10 btw) has some special educational needs, pyschological profile which has nothing to do with gentle parenting. Maybe his parents have had all sorts of difficulties trying to deal with him and this is the best fit they could come up with. I speak as the mother of three children, one with HFA and one with dyspraxia, who were not gentle parented yet one of them could fit your description at one point in his life when his SEN became more apparent.

Sally please do not think that your boundary setting is entirely to blame for your son's prison sentence, it could be all sort sof reasons that has led to this point. I know someone else whose son had to serve long prison sentence, and it was the result of undiagnosed SEN, mental health issues and again not to do with gentle parenting. There are so many things that can wrong in a person's life and it is not just the parents' responsibility. I am so sorry - I talk to my kids a lot about how what they do is their responsibility and even if they are angry or upset they will held criminally responsible for things - I know it is so difficult to know where the crossover is between our input and their output.