Should men pay for dates or at least offer to pay?

[lottieandmia22]

This is a subject I have a lot of mixed feelings about really. On one hand I can see that it's not fair to expect the man to pay. If he was going on many dates initially he'd be severely out of pocket.

BUT my experience of men who don't at least offer to pay is that later on they seem generally tight. OTOH I was very put off by a man who made huge grand gestures.

What have your experiences been?

Equally you seem to be clouded by your observation that "men earn more than women" and all I'm saying is

1. That's not always true.
2. Even if it was, so what.. that doesn't give you an automatic free ride.

I didn't miss the point at all. I just think that you're an adult and there's no written or unwritten law that says men should pay, and frankly I find that the idea that I need to be paid for by dint of being a female diminishing to my sex.

ruffian I'm fairly sure that I get to decide whether I call myself a feminist or not.

I hear you though. I'm embarrassed to say what I said but whilst I can agree that it's pretty meaningless whether a man offer to pay, in my experience logic usually doesn't dictate who we find attractive or not.

I appreciate that I may not have made that clear in my first post - or maybe it doesn't change your opinion anyway. Which is fine too.

So this wouldn’t be an issue with two women on a date regardless of their jobs or how much they earned because they would be paid on a similar scale because they are women.

Equality I’m not missing your point. I understand that women are statistically likely to earn less than men. I understand the the pay gap.

But the quotation I’ve copied from your post is just wrong.

I earn 3 times what my best friend earns and 4 times what my sister earns. I earn 5 times what my best friend’s DH earns. (And none of these people except me to always pick up the tab)

Now yes, it’s possible (even likely) that a male colleague of mine earns more than I do and that’s appalling and infuriating but I’m still very well paid and in a profession that commands more than the national average salary despite of the fact that I’m female.

So statistically women are less well paid than men across the U.K. but that doesn’t mean that all women are badly paid or on “a similar scale” to each other.

Eg A corporate lawyer will still earn more than a teacher regardless of their respective sexes.

I’ve been married a while so not sure how the dating world operates now. My experience was that when I went out with a man, he always paid. I would never have paid, and I wouldn’t have gone out with any man who didn’t pay. When I began dating my now husband, he always paid and would not have even considered not paying. Since we’ve been married, quite a few many years now, he’s always brought me his paychecks and I handle the finances, whether I was working full time or not (when I had dc). Isn’t that the way it’s supposed to work?

Many times I’ve read threads on mn from women who are clingy, desperate, and scared to death of talking to their partners about important subjects, namely commitment and marriage and loyalty, sometimes after being together ten years. Whoa!

One of the ways you know about a man is where he wants his money to go, what he does with it. What are his financial priorities, is it about him, or is it about his partner and his family? If he balks at paying for dates, then he will be stingy in other financial, and emotional, ways as well.

Words fail me.

If he balks at paying for dates, then he will be stingy in other financial, and emotional, ways as well.

Take out the “he” and replace it with “she”. Explain to me why it’s any different.

My DH and I have been very happily married for a long time. We have completely transparent finances and excellent communication. When we were dating we either halved or took turns.

I think the problem for me is that my experience is coloured by the fact that the only man I've been on a date with who didn't insist on paying for the first date (and who I ended up seeing again subsequently) turned into a situation where I ended up somehow paying far more for future dates than he did and he had a way of somehow getting things to his advantage so that I paid more for a variety of dates than he did. I will be honest - it put me off him and is one of the reasons I ended things. He also earned a LOT more than I do.

I've also read articles which say that some men think you don't like them if you don't let them pay.

OTOH if I'm seeing someone a lot I don't want them to be paying for me all the time - it isn't fair. The situation doesn't seem to be as straightforward as some suggest although in an ideal world it should be.

I thought the OP was going to get a flaming here.
Utterly astonished that so many women still feel the man should pay. I haven't been on a date for years but don't think I ever went out with someone who automatically paid because they were the man. Not expected at all in my social circle.

TBH I would find it weird and creepy if I went out with a man who expected to pay for me. All a bit patronising and controlling. I thought all that had died out years ago!

Holders or turn about. Anyone, male or female, who wants a free ride to me is avoidable. Relationships are about sharing responsibilities.

'I thought the OP was going to get a flaming here.'

Why? I did not say I think the man should always pay.

I dated in the 00s, and back then, the men would pick up the bill without evening mentioning it. I would offer to pay half but fully expected to be rejected. I think it's nice for the man to offer to pay but the woman should also insist on paying half.

Wily depends who you dated. I was saying in the 90s and always paid half or took turns.

Saying? Dating

He often buys me clothes when I can’t afford them and pays for dinner, the majority of holidays etc. I am currently on maternity leave so he is paying all bills and giving me money to buy clothes etc.

He doesn’t sound especially generous, in fact, as you just had his baby and are unmarried it’s rather concerning that you don’t share finances and he is giving you “pocket money” to buy clothes. It doesn’t sound like your position is financially secure if you aren’t earning at the moment and have no access to his account. What would happen if you split?

OP I completely agree, I think a man should pay and I’ve never been on a date with a man who didn’t, thank goodness. If he wanted to split the bill I would think it was really tight and ungentlemanly so wouldn’t go on a date with him again. Splitting the bill is what friends do so it would immediately put me off. There is something really nice and romantic about the man thinking your time and presence is precious and feeling lucky to have you go on a date with him.

I swear when I read these threads that we've gone backwards in the past 20 years. I'm in my 40s and when my friends and I were in our twenties I never heard of anyone expecting the man to pay, we thought it was some quaint throwback to the 1950s.

A lot of the inbuilt misogyny in society revolves around men thinking that women are freeloaders who expect men to finance them. It has always made me angry because I thought it an unfair accusation but when I read this thread I'm not so sure.

My husband never did grand gestures of 'oh I must pay, because I'm the man' (although he's certainly not stingy either). But nor has he ever expected me to take on the traditional wife work of washing and cleaning and childcare whilst he continues to live the life of a single childless man. We can't only strive for equality when it's beneficial to us.

And I will definitely bring up my DS with the expectation of paying on future dates.

And I will definitely bring up my DS with the expectation of paying on future dates.

I'll be bringing my son up to view women as equals.

Whoever asks offers to pay.

The other person offers to pay half.

The first person insists.

Then if the date has gone well, the other person accepts and pays for the next one.

If not so well then halves should be paid.

Done, next question?

Agree with above ^^
I don’t think it should be assumed in anyway that a man will pay. Also this idea that if a man doesn’t pay that makes him tight with money in a relationship - what on earth does that say about all the women who are expecting not to pay

On the plus side, £10 was a small price to pay to see all the warning signs upfront I suppose. Imagine if he'd kept his crappy resentment under control for a while and it all came out a few months down the line when you were already in a relationship.

Back in my dating days, if a man offered to pay, I would thank him, but always say that it was my turn next time. I would definitely pay on the following date too.

If it was one of those dates that I didn’t fancy repeating, I’d insist on paying half.

I’ve wanted to treat someone I like, and have budgeted to do that, so would’ve been disappointed to be told they didn’t want me to.

DS2 likes to pay for his girlfriend, but they’re both at sixth form, with part time jobs. I’ve told him to accept in a dignified way when she offers to pay.