Should men pay for dates or at least offer to pay?

[lottieandmia22]

This is a subject I have a lot of mixed feelings about really. On one hand I can see that it's not fair to expect the man to pay. If he was going on many dates initially he'd be severely out of pocket.

BUT my experience of men who don't at least offer to pay is that later on they seem generally tight. OTOH I was very put off by a man who made huge grand gestures.

What have your experiences been?

Neither do I find men attractive who cannot parent their own children and I see plenty of that.
Or anyone who doesn't do their own laundry and cleaning etc. Likewise I'm quite capable of sorting out my car paying bills gardening, clearing out going to the tip, decorating a house etc.

Purple - as far as I'm concerned, it's about integrity and respect for women, not belittling them. I don't think men and women need to act the same to be equal. You can be equal with differences.

Purple - as far as I'm concerned, it's about integrity and respect for women, not belittling them.

A man who has integrity and respects me should not assume I need or want someone else to pay for my dinner.

You can be equal with differences.

Yes, but when those differences only depend on whether you’ve got a penis or not that’s not any sort of equality I want. Why do women need doors opening or bills paying for them any more than men do?

Purple - as far as I'm concerned, it's about integrity and respect for women

I'd rather just be with someone respectful to both men and women rather than adhering to some outdated practise of showing their gentlemanly nature to women

Purple - maybe it's something that you either get or you don't. Personally, I think trying to quash the sexes into a "sameness" box (and confusing this with equality) is like sucking the air out of life.

The good news is, women who are happy to date men whose standard line is something like, "Cone over here, meet me in this pub - your round", will no doubt find their type. Women who expect a bit more than that will also gravitate towards a different type of man - so everyone's happy!

I usually pay in full because I can’t be stuffed with the nonsence of decoding people

Women who expect a bit more than that

Yeah thank GOODNESS you're leaving some of these lesser specimens for women who just don't expect enough 🙄

Purple - maybe it's something that you either get or you don't.

That’s sounds very much like “I can’t think of a counter argument to your last point”.

The good news is, women who are happy to date men whose standard line is something like, "Come over here, meet me in this pub - your round", will no doubt find their type. Women who expect a bit more than that will also gravitate towards a different type of man - so everyone's happy!

Come on. Nobody is saying that a man should aggressively tell a woman to go and get the drinks in, any more than a woman shouldn’t tell her date to go and get a round in. The default position should fe both people turn up expecting to pay for themselves since there’s absolutely no good reason in modern society to expect that men should be the ones footing the bill.

Purple - what I mean is, it's something that either appeals to you or it doesn't. If it's not your preference, then nothing I can say to you is likely to make any difference.

Duckdarlington - married for 15 years (since 21) . He still holds the door open, pulls my chair out, carries my bags and offers his coat of it's cold. He's a real gent and I'm deliriously happy. The whole time wasters comment comes from observing friends dating.

Also duckdarligton, that was very personal. I am very attractive thank you very much and obviously a keeper. Do you struggle to find men who want to treat you like a lady? That's sad head tilt.

Do you struggle to find men who want to treat you like a lady?

Oh ffs.

I would imagine that internet dating is much different, yes. Back in the 90s, it was a much bigger deal to go on a date, you almost certainly had already met them through work or a friend or at a bar and had decided that you liked each other.

So explain to me what you think chivalry is then?

I suppose this boils down to this: not everyone is the same as you. Some women want to be with men who are not carbon copies of women. You'd find my husband sexist, I'd find yours limp-wristed; blessedly, we're able to choose differently.

@1ndig0

My DP is ambitious and independant, I respect and value these qualities in her. My career is no more important that hers, our children are no more her responsability than they are mine, we are equal partners.
I would give her ever last penny I own but that is nothing to do with me being a man and her a woman, she would do the same.

You'd find my husband sexist, I'd find yours limp-wristed; blessedly, we're able to choose differently.

Excuse me? You’ve never met my husband. You know nothing about what he’s like. Keep your insults to yourself.

He still holds the door open, pulls my chair out, carries my bags and offers his coat of it's cold.

My husband does this too.

He also makes our sons carry any woman's suitcase to the guest room when we have company. It's just hopeless.

You're a MAN duckdarlington! No wonder you can't find anyone to treat you like a lady! You do lurk about on women's forums though so wouldn't be my type anyway .

@Champagneandthestars

I'm a straight male also in a 'deliriously' happy long term relationship. I dont wish to find someone to treat me 'like a lady' whatever that means?

I agree with Museum. In the 90s you didn't really go on speculative dates, so the guy had usually asked you out in person and it went from there.

To me men who expect to split the bill as default or who are not chivalrous are putting themselves firmly into the "friend zone" because I would find a man like this boring.

So we have ascertained that different things make different people happy - who knew!

Also that's great duck, but you don't need to have "equally important careers" to be equal in a marriage.

As usual, you'll find some of the more sensible feminists (and dare I say, older?) perfectly willing to make room for those who have different opinions than them, while the more orthodox ones want to berate those who don't interpret their ideology literally.

"The good news is, women who are happy to date men whose standard line is something like, "Cone over here, meet me in this pub - your round", will no doubt find their type. Women who expect a bit more than that..."

You are generalising, and conflating 'willingness to split' with the undesirable quality of aggressively insisting/bossing around the woman who is going on a date. One does not automatically imply the other.

As for "women who expect a bit more" !!! I expect my date to be: polite, considerate, attentive, willing to laugh at my jokes and intelligent. I expect him to have modern sensibilities and be witty and charming company. I also expect him to realise that I value my independence, incl. my financial independence and appreciate being able to pay my own way in the world. I think that is expecting plenty.

@Gah81

Exactly! I hope to teach my dd's to expect more than being bought by a man.