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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

Have I been mean to this child?

435 replies

SureJan · 07/01/2018 19:52

My baby DS is 6mo. My cousin came round to visit with her 4yo DD.
Baby has some toys, obviously nothing really for a 4yo to play with but I didn't mind at all her playing with the baby toys.
4yo started getting a little bit naughty (probably bored) & was snatching toys off the baby. Cousin, her mum, didn't say anything to her about it. Eventually I gently told her not to snatch, he's only a baby etc. Cousin not phased, didn't say a word to her. She didn't stop doing it so I started wrapping up the play date, picked up baby & said he was due a bottle, that sort of thing, to signal it was time they went home.
4yo started making a fuss when cousin said it was time to go & she was flustered. 4yo had baby's rattle in her hand & looked like she wasn't going to put it back. I nicely asked are you going to put the rattle back? They both ignored me. Cousin started saying bye, thanks for having us, 4yo still had hold of rattle. I said (nicely again) I'll take that rattle off you now, & she started kicking off really bad, screaming, crying etc. Cousin said nothing to me, just looked at her DD & looked blankly at me. I tried to tell 4yo it was baby's & baby needs it so it has to stay here - more screaming & crying, still no input from cousin. Then cousin says to 4yo, maybe SureJan will let you borrow it until we come again? I said sorry, no. Cousin rolled her eyes at me & said 'really?' in a very pissed off tone, & I stuck to my guns & said yes really, it's not hers to take!
Cousin cajoled & begged 4yo for a good minute or 2 to hand it over, with her screaming full pelt in her face, & eventually cousin snatched it off her, threw it onto the floor & dragged her out of the house saying 'thanks for fucking nothing' to me!
WIBU? Part of me feels bad because it was just a rattle & baby probably wouldn't have missed it, maybe I was being a bit mean? I'm sure cousin thinks I was just being awkward & making her suffer through an embarrassing tantrum that I could have easily stopped by letting her take the bloody thing.
But part of me thinks no, it's not my fault she won't discipline her DD & why should I just give her stuff to take home so that she gets an easier time? It was a rattle & she's 4yo so not age appropriate for her, I feel she was just pushing boundaries & didn't really want it.
I know it isn't my place to tell cousin how to discipline but I do feel she should have stepped in way before the rattle incident by telling her DD to stop snatching, play nicely, be gentle with baby etc. It annoyed me that she didn't!
Am I mean/unreasonable? I have no doubt that there will come a time when baby is older & tantrumming in similar fashion & I'll be able to empathise more, but I don't think in that situation I'd let him take the toy to keep him quiet.

OP posts:
OuchBollocks · 07/01/2018 20:07

YANBU. Granted my 3 year old is fascinated by her baby brother's toys but I don't allow snatching (from either child!) and it will be a cold day in hell before I allow her to walk away with someone else's toys from their house. What way is that poor child learning to behave?

ShiftyMcGifty · 07/01/2018 20:08

Yes and you should have also given her your iPad to entertain her and then let her borrow that too, because she’s just a child Hmm

Maxstress3 · 07/01/2018 20:10

I have a four yr old and he was taught from a very young age to share and wherever he went he played with friends and cousins and then left the toys there. If he had then to hand I would ask him to leave them and that he could come and play again next time. He accepted this. At four years the behaviour is worrying and shows how spoilt she is. It's not your fault.

HumpHumpWhale · 07/01/2018 20:10

Ffs. You were totally reasonable. She's ridiculous to even have suggested taking it. I can kind of understand if the kid was 2, although I'd never have had the cheek to ask - I've offered to let friends' toddlers take toys if they were kidding off, but in general the mums have said no, they have to learn - but 4 is definitely old enough to understand ownership.

lurkingnotlurking · 07/01/2018 20:10

I have young children including a 4yo. Your cousin was taking the easy option of not guiding her child towards behaving nicely with your baby. And yes you could have allowed the rattle to go, but with my 4yo there's not a chance he would get his way like that through having a screaming tantrum. So no, I don't think ywbu. But you might need to think through doing things differently if you want to invite them over again. Don't worry too much about your cousin's reaction - the tantrum would have rattled her and it's possible she didn't act her best because of it. Forgive her easily if she wants to brush over it.

Zaphodsotherhead · 07/01/2018 20:11

OK, so it was 'only a rattle' - but it sounds as though your cousin would have been the same if it was something you might really miss! You asked for it back - that's her cue to tell her DD to hand it back and deal with the resulting tantrum effectively. Not ask if she could keep it for later - what if she'd got hold of the TV remote or something?

BackforGood · 07/01/2018 20:11

Of course YWNBU.
Your cousin needs to
a) take something out and about with her if she is expecting a 4 yr old to be well behaved for any length of time, when somewhere that isn't set up for 4 yr olds
b) teach her child that no, you can't just take what you fancy from other people's homes
c) intervene when her child needs distracting in the first place
d) teach her child that a tantrum does NOT get her what she wants (especially by 4..... although, if she'd done it at 2 maybe she wouldn't still be tantrumming at 4 ??)
e) Pick up on what other parents are saying, and back them up, even if it weren't what she would have done herself
f) control her language in front of children.

SeaToSki · 07/01/2018 20:11

There is no way she should have been allowed to take someone else’s toy home with her, just because she wanted it. It sounds like she has been allowed to do this before and its such a bad precedent to set with any child.

I have been asked many times if a child can ‘borrow’ a toy from my dc after they have been over to play. If i said yes to all of them, we would have no toys left. My answer to all of them is that no we dont ever lend toys and if you really like to play with it, you should come back and play with dc again soon. (While planning to not be available if the child was a pita). The same goes for my children if they are at someone else’s house and ask to borrow a toy. I tell them no, thats not what we do. It only takes repeating it twice to have them stop asking.

SaucyJack · 07/01/2018 20:12

YANBU.

Totally agree that you need to pick your battles, but teaching your child not to half-inch things from other people's houses most definitely is a battle worth fighting.

MyMorningHasBroken · 07/01/2018 20:12

I'd be really worried tbh if my 4 y/o was still having tantrums like that over a rattle!

Marmite27 · 07/01/2018 20:13

YANBU.

I have the opposite at my mums. Child has toy. We leave. Child wants to take toy. DM says oh let her take it.

No she has to learn she can’t take things from other people’s houses home, and if she takes everything home piece by piece then there will be nothing to play with next time she visits.

Child stops tantrumig in the car when she’s forgotten what ever precious it is she wanted. DM still tantruming by text hours later.

It does my head in. Especially as DM works in early years childcare Angry

Can we come and play at your house instead? Grin

Steeley113 · 07/01/2018 20:14

If they were 2 then I’d probably say yabu and to pick your battles. At 4, it’s completely different and they are more then old enough to understand it’s a baby toy and for the baby!

Steeley113 · 07/01/2018 20:14

Also, did you not have anything like paper and pens? To stop her from bugging the baby?

MrsNacho · 07/01/2018 20:15

Yanbu - if she gets her own way by tantruming that just teaches her to do it more! Your cousin should have stepped in much earlier.

Greensleeves · 07/01/2018 20:15

No, you weren't unreasonable. The rattle is one of your baby's toys and the 4yo would have got very little enjoyment out of it.

I do feel very sorry for the little girl though. The rattle incident is the least of her problems. Your cousin sounds disengaged, impatient and unempathic with her, which is awful. No wonder her behaviour is all over the place Sad

HermioneAndMsJones · 07/01/2018 20:15

YANBU
Sorry but I can’t imagine when on earth it should be ok for a child to take something that isn’t their back home, someth8ng they have absolutely no interest in Just because.

The child is 4yo! They will go to school (reception or nursery) and will have learnt by now that you don’t take home stuff that isn’t yours.
Pandering to that sort of silliness isn’t going to help the child tbh. (Or the mum if she has to face constant tantrums like this)

Sandsnake · 07/01/2018 20:16

Absolutely YANBU. No doubt. Your cousin's DD is four - plenty old enough to understand the concept of not taking things that don't belong to you. DS has just turned two and understands that we leave things where they come from. If he was to have a tantrum and wanted to take a toy from a friend's house then fine - small children are irrational sometimes - absolutely not a chance that I would try and persuade the friend to let us 'borrow' it though.

It sounds to me like your cousin panders to her DD for a quiet life, which will be why she acted like that. It's not the DD's fault (obviously) but how she's being parented. Presuming you aren't super close, then the cousin swearing at me would be enough to make me want to limit contact for a while.

Wakeuptortoise · 07/01/2018 20:16

Your cousin sounds like a useless parent and very rude. Send her a leaflet for parenting classes. Her dd could do with learning some social etiquette.
When my ds was younger someone once offered to let him take a toy home and I refused and urged him to return it. It sends entirely the wrong message to give in to this sort of thing.
When I visit younger kids with my 3.8yo and 21mo, I keep a close eye on them that they are not too rough, etc. 21mo already knows how to use gentle hands and that throwing is not acceptable. 3.8you would probably get carried away piling too many toys on top of the baby.
They have their moments when they tantrum I'm not perfect btw.
If you decide to have them another time, I would have some inappropriate chocolate bars or sweets handy and offer to swap with the kid. Wink

buttercup54321 · 07/01/2018 20:16

Exactly what SeaTOski said.

What will cousin do when her
daughter wants to borrow an expensive toy from a shop?
Sounds like cousin is a spoilt brat herself as well as a lazy parent.

Tedster77 · 07/01/2018 20:17

Christ - kids kick up a stink about these things but it’s part of being a decent parent to teach them it’s ok to let go and no terrible harm will come of it!

I’ve witnessed (many moons again) the odd person doing this is toddler groups etc - slipping toys in to their bags because they’re not willing to disappoint their little darling Shock. So theft is ok and everyone’s entitled to everything then?!?

Cakescakescakes · 07/01/2018 20:17

Marmite my mum is exactly the same. I don’t letting my DC bring toys from anyone’s house - once you set a precedent that it’s ok to do that then it is harder to say no. And they always forget about it within 30 seconds of leaving.

OP you were completely in the right.

PerfectlySymmetricalButtocks · 07/01/2018 20:17

Don't most 4 year olds understand the concept of possession and stealing?

CherryMaDeara · 07/01/2018 20:17

Yanbu, OP, well done I say.

It doesn't stop at a rattle. My cousin was 5 years younger than me and she took a toy home nearly every time she visited (nearly every day). Her mother never a word, and neither did my parents.

Fraying · 07/01/2018 20:18

I think it might all have been a misunderstanding. You asked if the 4-yr-old was going to put the rattle back. To some DCs and adults, that implies there is an option of not putting it back. I think this caused the confusion with your cousin and the DC.
You should just have taken the rattle from the child. No question. No options. No big discussion.

ThatsWotSheSaid · 07/01/2018 20:18

YANBU you have to set boundaries early on. Mainly for your cousin.

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