AIBU to wonder if earlier generations really viewed early miscarriages differently?

[KitKat1985]

Just interested in garnering opinions on this really. I have debated whether to post this at all as I'm aware the subject matter is a sensitive one for a lot of people, so I've tried to really clear in the title that it's a thread about early miscarriages so those who don't want to read the whole post don't have to. But it's a conversation that really got me wondering recently so wanted to hear some views on it. I had a conversation recently with some women who were from a previous generation (think late 50's onwards). They basically said that back when they were having babies you weren't even really considered to be pregnant until you had missed two periods (so I guess would be about 8 weeks). They said they may have had occasions whereby they were late etc, but if they bled before the '2 missed period' mark they said they just put it down as 'one of those things', and were a bit dismissive about people in this generation who would report being really upset because they were having a miscarriage when it was very early on in their pregnancy. They also said that these days because of early sensitivity tests etc, people often consider themselves to be pregnant sometimes before their period is even late, which in their opinion was wrong and just led to a lot more heartbreak if things then didn't progress well. I'm wondering if they're telling the whole truth or not about how previous generations viewed early miscarriages. I can't completely believe that in a previous generation women didn't also feel a bit devastated if they started bleeding after they were late, and therefore must have probably also worked out that they were having an early pregnancy loss. I can to some extent sympathise with their theory though that testing really early can lead to more heartache. Do you think early miscarriages really were viewed differently a generation ago? Or do you think it was just more a taboo subject and if women were very upset about early losses they were just under societal pressure not to say it?

First 2 miscarriages were 7 then 12 weeks and i knew i was pregnant early on but nothing could have prepared me for not knowing i was pregnant and loosing one at almost 17 weeks on a trolley in a&e and delivering alone, had no symptoms whatsoever and no missed periods although they had become very light and irregular so maybe they were just bleeds. First 2 MC i knew straight away i was pregnant and the same with the DC. The MCs happened in between having the DC so MC, DC, DC, MC, DC, MC

I really must change my Halloween name now!
Great thread OP, and enjoyed reading the replies as I have suffered many early miscarriages( 4-6 weeks ) so, very early. And even now Doctors don't class those as Miscarriages as they are too early as nothing would show up on a scan. It's all a bit sad really, because early or not, it's still the start of a life. It's how life starts at the end of the day isn't it.

On the one hand we are expected to test before a boozy dinner party so we can know whether or not we are drinking (see post above) but on the other, testing early is self indulgent snowflake behaviour

I am not sure who you think "expected" me to test. My personal view then and now is that pregnant women should not drink alcohol or smoke. Both can be avoided easily with no implications whatsoever for the woman so why risk it ? Other women are free to do whatever they want but don't paint my decsion to not drink (I've never smoked) at all during my pregnancy as some sort of patriarchical oppression.

I do think testing for pregnancies that are a few days old, are setting yourself up for heartache. I know that anyone desperate for a child, can be tempted to do this, but I suspect many many pregnancies fail at this very early stage.

I agree with a previous poster that I don't really get young women these days talking about angel babies and fixating on early miscarriages. It seem the opposite extreme where in the past women were not supposed to talk about a miscarriage and just forget about it.

Maybe because miscarriage is still a taboo subject and more people should talk about it and how it made them feel so as to normalise it for other people in the same situation. Just because previous generations didn't necessarily discuss it doesn't mean they didn't feel it and just because we do talk about it more nowadays doesn't make us snowflakes and doesn't mean we're acting in extreme ways. Women in the past were expected to do a lot of things and just get on with it, it doesn't mean they were happy about it.

Just because previous generations didn't necessarily discuss it doesn't mean they didn't feel it and just because we do talk about it more nowadays doesn't make us snowflakes and doesn't mean we're acting in extreme ways

We don't know how they felt. I don't know how I would have reacted if after having done my very early test my period had come on. I suspect I would not have treated it as a miscarriage.

Another reason for my doing a test at the earliest opportunity was, like the current Pip Archer story line in the Archers, that Christmas and New Year were imminent but I was months away showing as pregnant. If I had waited for 2 missed periods that would have been after New Year.

I know that anyone desperate for a child, can be tempted to do this, but I suspect many many pregnancies fail at this very early stage

I wasn't desperate. It was simply that it was literally the only time we had not used contraception. A pregnancy was unplanned if it had not happened , then so be it ; if it had , then it was going to be a pregnancy following best guidance from as soon as possible.

The girl I work with got married last August, by October was pregnant, announced about her pregnancy everywhere: FB, colleagues, etc. Miscarried at 4 weeks and was devastated to the point that only managed to go back to work last week before Christmas. Her husband had 3 weeks off from his job too! I find it quite snow-flaky. Sorry, I do not want to seem insensitive, but why does anyone would want to share such personal thing as pregnancy so early on? She wasn’t even trying to get pregnant yet. Early pregnancy testing is not really healthy thing in my opinion, as lots of early pregnancies end in ms, and it is just easier to think of them as late period, heavy bleed. That’s what I have done 20+years back.

I don't understand why you would announce it at 4 weeks. I didn't I tell anyone (not even my mother) until at least 3 months - by that time I'm sure some friends had guessed due to the non- drinking at Christmas and New Year parties and my months long headache/ tummy bug!

I disagree with you re early testing. I was perfectly aware many pregnancies don't take. I could have lived with that.

Oh and as for "20 years back" mine was nearer 30 years ago.

I remember my grandmother (born turn of the century) claimed that you had to miss 3 periods in order to be pregnant - or consider yourself pregnant I guess. They seem to have had a much more pragmatic acceptance that a great many people did not progress pregnancies past the early stage and so they just accepted it as not really being pregnant as such until a certain point. It was probably a much healthier mental perspective to take as it seemed to negate upset regarding early miscarriage which these days is incredibly common. Obviously people were still upset about late miscarriage which was obviously a pregnancy and stillbirth though.

No chance of that these days with medical methods of detection (non existent in my grandmothers day, just no periods, pregnancy symptoms, expanded stomach then movements being the 'diagnosis'), early dating ultrasounds, 11 week ultrasounds etc.

Yes I think it was/is viewed differently- even later term ones. The development of the early detection tests where you know before your next period, has meant people finding out sooner, and we are more open with family and friends and ‘tell’ at an earlier age. There used to be ‘rules’ and it wasn’t a pregnancy until it passed a certain stage. Even a later term 8+ MC wasn’t seen as sadly as now- several older family meme era have had then and whilst disappointed weren’t devestated by it, as nature said no (paraphrasing) everyone has a right to view it how they won’t, and how makes them feel most comfortable emotionally- I prefer my parents way for me personally, but respect that others feel differently.

I mean 8+ weeks- not 8months.

Infertility is more of a problem today than it was 50 years ago

This is bollocks sorry.

I think anyone who refers to how someone behaves after a miscarriage as"snowflakey" is an utter dick. Regardless of your opinion on that person or that pregnancy, they have a right to their feelings. I ended up on high strength diazapan after my first miscarriage and had nightmares for months after my second. Who the fuck are you or anyone else, who has no private details about the circumstances around both events, to judge me as a snowflake? You are minimising the oftne devastating effects of micarriage and suggest you - and anyone else who feels that way - takes yourself off to read the MN Better Miscarriage Care campaign, the miscarriage message boards, and the Miscarriage Association website.

Fucking snowflakes. That is absolute bullshit.

I don't understand why you would announce it at 4 weeks

Various reasons.

The chance of miscarriage often doesn't occur to people, maybe because it's still not often talked about and is still treated as taboo and we're still expected to just get on with things. Many people aren't aware of the 1 in 4 statistic, especially if they've no previous experience of pregnancy, or how common miscarriage is.

Excitement. When you're happy you want to share that happiness with people.

Personal choice. I didn't wait until 12wks to tell people, I told the people I'd have told had it gone wrong which turned out to be quite a lot of people.

When I had an early miscarriage our GP told me that one in ten pregnancies miscarry and often women didn't know they were pregnant in the first place, I certainly didn't.

When I became pregnant again we told no one until I was past the 3 month mark. I didn't begin to feel pregnant until then. I had a further early miscarriage when trying for a second child. This time I knew I was pregnant and I was sad but it was so early that I didn't feel pregnant and hadn't begun to think of it as a baby.

I firmly believe that things happen for a reason and maybe there was something incompatible with life in the foetuses.

I went on to have a successful second pregnancy.

My DM had several miscarriages before I was born and a couple more before DSis was born. This was in the 50s. She very much viewed it as one of those things. It didn't put her off trying again.

People react differently and no one should be criticised for how they feel.

I was pregnant three times in the same year, the third time was DS.

I found the first MMC (9weeks) very difficult and upsetting. Was detected at a scan after a light bleed. Let it happen naturally with lots of blood and contractions were just like my labour.

After that, i made a conscious decision not to consider myself really pregnant until the 12 week scan. I sort of chose to treat it like a positive ovulation test, that things were looking 'correct' but not confirmed.

After the second MMC (7weeks) i opted for D&C so that I could emotionally move on from it. I had had a scan after a light bleed and had seen a heartbeat at 6weeks.

I was fully prepared to lose DS so seeing a healthy scan at 12w was the point at which I started to think of him as a baby, not as an egg.

Whether it was a healthy approach or not, I don't know but it certainly felt easier to cope at the time

My gran (4 children possibly 6 miscarriages hard to get specifics these days). Always knew she was pregnant and her non English mother taught her to acknowledge the loss which was at odds with the advice from gp's.
I don't think i am any worse off for the 2 miscarriages where i knew i was pregnant than the one i did not.

Do you think early miscarriages really were viewed differently a generation ago?

Yes. And often greeted with a sigh of relief.

I'm 52 if my mum wanted to go on the pill she had to be a) married and b) have her husband's permission.

There wasn't the option of abortion so it was a case of you were pregnant or not.

There also wasn't the means to detect pregnancy other than killing rabbits. No ultrasound.

When my mum was pregnant with me she went to the Dr, told him how many periods she had missed and he agreed she was pregnant.

Leebird

How nasty of you.

For all you know, your colleague could have been trying for years. She could have been told she'd never be able to have children. She could have other issues causing her stress and the mc could have been the last straw. Or perhaps she had other health issues brought to light by the mc.

You absolutely do not know, and it's none of your business. You sound nasty and bitter, and if you've been talking like this to other colleagues I hope someone reports you.

Leebird there may well be things going on that you don't know about. There may be complications from the pregnancy that mean having a baby may be difficult or she may have found out that a viable pregnancy is impossible. You don't know what is going on in other people's lives.

Infertility may be no different but timing is. I started trying for a family at 32 and had my last baby at 38. The biological clock was ticking away and I didn't feel able to easily dismiss my many losses. Some of which were made harder to bear due to the attitude of Hcps.

I do wonder if before early tests and ultrasounds people were a bit more reluctant to get excited about pregnancy (and the dream of a much wanted baby) as almost everyone would have known somebody who'd lost a baby, either by stillbirth or neo natal loss.

I know of people who've gone to scans to be told "Sorry" vital organs haven't developed. The pregnancy was then ended. So the loss was dealt with fairly early on sometimes before the pregnancy was public knowledge. However without scans those babies would have been carried to term and then died. Those types of losses just aren't really spoken about.
There's also more help available to prevent preterm labour (bed rest, stitch in cervix etc) and if baby is born early there is better neonatal care. Babies are surviving that just wouldn't have years also.
Better care during delivery probably also means fewer losses happen during the birth too.

I think over the last 60 or so years people will have got softer. More excited about the spark of life they carry not really thinking that it might not survive. Where older generations who witnessed lots of loss were hardened to thinking it might not make it.

But then again if you've tried for years and finally get that positive test. It's hard to then hold back your emotions and think "be cautious it might not make it".

There wasn't the option of abortion so it was a case of you were pregnant or not.

Woman have always sought ways to abort unwanted babies - it's now safe and legal (thank god) but abortion wasn't invented in 1967.