To think that women should be able to request a female doctor or nurse?

[Betti935]

www.thetimes.co.uk/edition/news/the-female-nhs-nurse-i-asked-for-came-with-stubble-83rq9p0gg

Summary: A woman requested a female nurse to carry out her cervical smear test. When she arrived the nurse was clearly male (stubble, deep voice etc). When she questioned this, the nurse insisted that they were a woman because they were trans. The patient says she was made to feel like a bigot and in the end decided not to go ahead with the smear test.

Now in this case, the NHS Trust has apologised and said that the nurse did not handle the situation appropriately. However the government are planning to introduce into law the recommendations of the Women and Equalities Committee which include, not only allowing men to 'self-identify' as women without any medical diagnosis of gender dysphoria, but also to get rid of the exemptions currently in place.

Currently, while biological males can legally 'become' women (following a diagnosis of gender dysphoria - there is already no requirement to have any hormone treatment or surgery), there are some limited exemptions in law:

“If a service provider provides single or separate sex services for women and men, or provides services differently to women and men, they should treat transsexual people according to the gender role in which they present. However, the Act does permit the service provider to provide a different service or exclude a person from the service, who is proposing to undergo, is undergoing or who has undergone, gender reassignment. This will only be lawful where the exclusion is a proportionate means of achieving a legitimate aim.” For example, it is currently legal for a group counselling session for female rape victims to exclude biological males if female clients would be not feel able to attend and participate in the group if they were present.

If this new legislation is passed and there are no exemptions allowing for transwomen (biological males) to be treated differently from biological women, there will be no way to protect vulnerable women who don't feel able to access rape services or medical services if they can't be sure of a female-only service.

This won't be like other rights conflicts (e.g. on sexual orientation versus religion) where test cases go to court and judgements are made because women won't exist as a separate protected group from transwomen.

For those saying that in other countries people take any medical care they can get, maybe you missed the recent news story detailing how women in the Middle East are losing their own children to starvation rather than break the cultural stigma of asking for financial help from their own families?

Do you think that we shouldn't aim higher than that in a society where it is perfectly possible to do better?

Why is a handshake and sexual assault not the same thing? Are you saying that a handshake and sticking your fingers INSIDE another person's body ARE the same thing and therefore we shouldn't be able to make a choice about our own bodies? When was the last time someone was raped in the kidney or prosecuted for an unwanted handshake?

I have no idea how you think choosing who puts their hands inside your sex organs is remotely the same as refusing to employ someone for a job that has no relation to anything sexual because of their race. It's utterly bonkers.

If men are actually concerned about being nursed by women, then they will of course start applying to train to be nurses. However, I assume very few will, because of the long hours, crap pay, arse wiping etc. Well by that logic every woman on here who objects to being nursed by a male would be a nurse wouldn't they?

My son is a nurse, I thought the idea of all male wards being staffed by male nurses was great, should speed up promotion for him and his male nurse friends. None of those pushy female nurses expecting to get promotion onto a male ward.

My grandfather had Parkinson's and severe dementia as a result and had to have intimate care 3 times per day in his home. Having fought with the Gurkhas in the war, he would attack any male nurse trying to touch him with the curved knife he'd used in combat - we stipulated women only because he did not have mental capacity to say so himself.

Would you send a male nurse knowing that both parties could be at physical risk of harm just to enforce 'equality'? Because that sounds remarkably like the argument that 'feminists don't want equality' that MRAs trot out, ignoring the fact that equality can only be achieved by doing things to redress the balance. Equality doesn't mean treating everyone the same.

Actually alot of men do want male carers and there aren't many of them. On the other hand I have an elderly female relative with dementia who would like all intimate care to be done by males as her dementia has made her incredibly sexually inappropriate. I have had to request no males to protect the young men I have seen being mauled by her.

"Well I do think that selecting a doctor or nurse on sex is discriminatory. I've never personally felt there is any difference. I'd marginally prefer a male bra fitter if I ever lost the ability to use a tape measure all by myself...."

This is goady fuckery at its finest.

You want debate your arse. Everyone sees what you are

For anyone who wants to read up on Stefonknee Walscht. Apologies for the Fail link, but it had more images than most ...

www.dailymail.co.uk/femail/article-3356084/I-ve-gone-child-Husband-father-seven-52-leaves-wife-kids-live-transgender-SIX-YEAR-OLD-girl-named-Stefonknee.html

I'm finding some of the responses on this thread rather worrying

www.mumsnet.com/Talk/am_i_being_unreasonable/a3126849-My-GP-rejected-my-request-for-a-female-doctor-Should-I-complain?msgid=74457946#74457946

Aha. Another sensible thread infested once again by the goady fucker MRA's. Oh get to fuck the lot of you. No one has time for your shit. If any of you have daughters then I feel desperately sorry for them, and any other women in your lives.

This from mathanxiety is perfect:

"It's that they should not expect patients to indulge their roleplaying at a time when the patient may well be concerned about their own health and not really up for participation as interactive audience in the performance of femininity on the part of the HCP."

but this is the world you wanted. You wanted everything PC, no-ones feelings hurt, and all this diversity. Now you have it you don't seem to like it? Reap what you sow

Who? Who are you talking to?

@userussell who is this "you"

Titiana
I believe that's addressed to "all you fucking feminists" from a sad little prick who can't get over being rejected by a woman at some time in his life so we are all fucking bitches who deserve whatever bad fortune befalls us. All of us

Happy New Year saddo

April

I would ask for a female doctor over a male doctor for a gynaecological examination because I’d assume a degree of empathy with my female biology - both physically and mentally - that no’one of the contradictory gender, regardless of persuasion or experience, could possibly hope to have. I’m very practical like that.

I ithink you are right Assigned.

When I was a very small child I had some bladder and kidney issue that need treatment and I was really distressed by having a male doctor treat me, the nurses had to hold my hand and reassure me through the whole thing.

My point being that often on these threads we spend a lot of time defending female privacy due to past rapes or assault but actually it's a very natural thing to prefer to have a female for certain distressing procedures. Even very small children left alone and not brainwashed with non binary bullshit get this.

However the MRA's like arguing for the fun of it to show how 'illogical and irrational' feminists are compared to their superior penis brains, and the handmaidens, yes I will use that term, twist themselves up into all sorts of knots supporting that. Basically trying to talk any woman who disagrees out of her own feelings. Doing the old "being naked is natural and I'm fine with it and you and your small child should be fine with it too and if you aren't - well I'm fine with it and im the rational person here because the men say so".

It's going to be young girls and teenagers, young women who feel they can't speak up that are going to come out worse in all this.

I would ask for a female doctor over a male doctor for a gynaecological examination because I’d assume a degree of empathy with my female biology - both physically and mentally - that no’one of the contradictory gender, regardless of persuasion or experience, could possibly hope to have. I’m very practical like that. I've had lovely, kind supportive doctors of both sexes and I've had snotty ones of both sexes. I had one female doctor who I can only assume had very easy births as she was very dismissive of women "making a fuss" The worst male doctor I ever saw was for one of my kids, he was like a robot. My mother always said the best midwife she had was a nun, although my mother was mortified at the nun witnessing the results of her intimate moments with my father. I did point out she would be out of a job if everyone had given up sex.

but this is the world you wanted. You wanted everything PC, no-ones feelings hurt, and all this diversity. Now you have it you don't seem to like it? Reap what you sow

We said we wanted liberation and so men said we wanted equality and so now men say we got the equality we asked for. Asshats.
If women have the temerity to point out that somehow or other the wealthy white men are still more equal than anyone else we are accused of being racist or sexist or both.

Are we doing personal anecdotes as proofs now? I have one.
Having experienced csa when I was seven I was taken to a male police officer, a male doctor, and a male psychiatrist, to be further traumatized.

I'm so sorry bewilderness that's terrible.

I'm sorry bewilderness

Happy New Year Italian I'm always 90% with you on this threads...and you are always polite about the 10%!

I share your hopes.

Thanks, Ereshkigal and Tatiana.
It was long ago and I only mention it when I think that the "I don't care so no one else should" brigade has gone too far down the self righteous posturing road to hell.

Morphene thank you, that is a very sweet thing to say.

The fact is that this male nurse is most likely a man with an obsessional sexual fetish of female biology who is seeking out situations in which to indulge his fetish.

It is a fucking scandal that a woman who has booked an intimate, uncomfortable and potentially distressing medical procedure should find herself having that fetished by the person presented to her to carry out the procedure. A scandal. This is going further than women being expected to validate and participate in a delusion. This is imposing an intimate situation with a male with a sexual fetish and fantasy on a woman who not only has not consented to this but who is there for a MEDICAL PROCEDURE.

Is is creepy as fuck and potentially sexual harassment and sexual assault.

Of course there is a chance that at best this bloke is a gay man having an identity crisis who doesn't have a good grasp of reality and biology. I wouldn't want treatment from such a man either though.

Applauds beachcomber