To call out my vegan friend?

[rubbishtalker]

I haven't known her very long, a few years. She is a work colleague. She is 'vegan' on social media, lots of photos and hash tagging and "cruelty free" style comments.

But a few months ago when we went out for a team lunch she ate pork. I've seen her eat cheese, chocolate etc before.

AIBU to comment something along the lines of ' I love how you see vegan meals as a healthy aspect to your current diet'?? I am starting to find it irritating.

Can you be vegan and not give a shiny shit about the environment?

I wouldn't agree trying to be vegan is better violets you make that statement like fact. Your plants don't grow everywhere, the environmental cost of increased food miles (bet very little of it is British), agrochemicals, farm machinery, cost to wildlife destruction etc.

Even taking that into account, it is still better for the environment to eat plant based. Meat requires that the animal eats a load of plants for a relatively long time but all you get out of it is a small amount of meat. Better to just eat the plants. But of course eating locally sourced produce is great and I personally avoid buying produce that has been imported from e.g. SA, Brazil, NZ etc. Most of what I eat is from the UK. I also recognise that there are huge issues with all types of farming- none is perfect. And yes, it's hypocritical to preach about veganism and the environment while munching blueberries from SA for example. Anyway, these are my personal reasons. I sometimes do the #vegan #plantbased stuff on instragram so that people can search for recipes etc. Not that often though. I do not preach about it to anyone or tell anyone how to eat but obviously if people ask, I will explain. For some people though, that comes across as 'preachy' because it doesn't match with their way of eating, but there isn't much I can do about it. I am not going to compromise my own beliefs for them. I have done enough of that in my life already.

Can you be vegan and not give a shiny shit about the environment?

Of course you can!

You can eat what the fuck you like for whatever reason you like

I prefer vegan food. it suits me better. So I say yes that must be possible.

I used to know a vegan who seemed supportive of my reduced meat diet. Never claimed to be vegan but he knew I wasn't going to be tucking in to a rack of lamb either. I do care about the environment and agree with the recycling analogy upthread. Trying is better than doing nothing. Why on earth anybody who eats less meat has to be made feel accountable for that choice is ridiculous but that seems to be the situation now!

Vegan four years and lifelong vegetarian. First of all I would like to say to all the posters who say it's hard, truly it's not. There are so many excellent blogs, recipes and meal substitutes now.

Anyway, I think you should, nicely, call her out. While it is good she is trying, people like her make it very difficult for the 100% strict vegans. Example: "you can just avoid the ham in this pea and ham soup can't you?"
We who avoid meat and dairy at all costs are seen as militant and inflexible, and dare I say annoying, Unfortunately we all get tarred with the same brush.

Violets phew! I was wondering when I ever "like to bang on about the environmental impact which I don't understand"

Next we'll be hearing that over-population is having some kind of impact but nobody on here likes to mention that one

I disagree again Violets, eating directly from plant source does not in fact equate to equal nutrition, the animals process the plants into a more bio available form for human nutrition, meat and dairy you need far less of, and considering environments, they do so in a way that is more sustainable than an entirely plant based diet.

The point being that I have my scientifically studied beliefs and you had yours. I'm not going to come on social and instruct you that you are wrong and my way is "better" so why should Vegans be able to make absolute statements that "trying to be vegan is better".

It isn't, they just believe it is. Mine is. You don't agree. So let's all do what we do and keep it off bloody FB!

"While it is good she is trying, people like her make it very difficult for the 100% strict vegans. Example: "you can just avoid the ham in this pea and ham soup can't you?""

Yes...call her out, for her infallibility is making life hard for proper vegans who are unable to say, "Sorry I won't have the pea and ham soup".

Next we'll be hearing that over-population is having some kind of impact

Well, yes... The elephant in the room....

"While it is good she is trying, people like her make it very difficult for the 100% strict vegans. Example: "you can just avoid the ham in this pea and ham soup can't you?""

that is such nonsense, we generate more demand for vegetarian options and vegan options in restaurants which makes it easier for vegans.

Meat is my last choice option in a restaurant but I don't give waiters my life story. All the restaurant knows is the vegan option is selling well. (or not)

Quinoa

But is she actually saying that she’s vegan or is she simply using the hashtag for the vegan and crueltyfree meals she’s eating?

As for ‘not difficult’: that really depends on the person. Could I eat plant based? Definitely. But it really wouldn’t be good for me (MH wise).

Anyhow, from a vegan perspective... seems like ‘less meat, dairy, eggs etc’ is still better than the standard diet in most Western countries.

I really don’t see why some vegans (I’m not saying that’s you, btw) have such a negative opinion of people that are reducing their consumption of animal products (yes, even if they don’t call themselves vegan...)

Violets why the elephant in the room? You can be non-vegan and agree that overpopulation is a serious issue for the planet?

And I have three kids so I am REALLY hypocritical on that front!

I applaud people who limit their animal consumption. Lifting demand for plant-based products is fantastic. But they shouldn't call themselves vegan. They're not.

@pictish. Yes that on repeat for 40+ years.

I used to work with someone who claimed (loudly at every opportunity) she was vegan but regularly ate things that contained dairy or other animal produce, wore leather shoes etc. Every time I called her out on it she would say 'oh really? But look at the packet, it doesn't say anywhere that it's not suitable for vegans so it must be fine' or 'lots of vegans eat this'. She was a silly attention seeking cow (see what I did there!) in lots of ways though.

I am full of admiration for real, genuine vegans who stick to their principles and live their life in that way for a reason. What annoys the fuck out of me is people who jump on the bandwagon and pretend to be one because they think it makes them look cool / caring / ethical / whatever. Not what its all about at all.

That said, I've just found out my mum's been telling everyone I'm a vegan because I've given up meat, just meat. I'm a fully fledged fish eating cheese snaffling milk drinker but she thought that giving up meat made you a vegan!!

I would love to go to a restaurant and be able to ask for vegan food and know, confidently, that was what I was getting.

Last cafe I went to advertised vegan options, and when I asked, the waitress offered salmon.

The OP's friend blurs the lines and makes things difficult. I guess it may not seem like much of an issue if you're not vegan but it's irritating and like some posters have pointed out, somewhat hypocritical. It's good she cares about animals. But she needs to commit fully before lecturing others. Alternatively (like someone said up thread) she could chart her journey and challenges. Much more authentic and relatable.

The OP's friend blurs the lines and makes things difficult. I guess it may not seem like much of an issue if you're not vegan but it's irritating and like some posters have pointed out, somewhat hypocritical. It's good she cares about animals. But she needs to commit fully before lecturing others. Alternatively (like someone said up thread) she could chart her journey and challenges. Much more authentic and relatable.

This is not the case though. I order a meal from the menu that is sold as a vegan meal. I expect the restaurant to get it right. If they don't they should. It's not the fault of people who want to order a vegan meal and get a meal if the restaurant don't get it right.

Why on earth some vegans think that people who also want to eat vegan food are making things harder for them is a groundless mystery. But I did go on ONE date with a man who berated me for wanting to order the same food he wanted to order. Maybe he wanted to be the only one eating it?!

I meant to put the first para in inverted commas.

Violets why the elephant in the room? You can be non-vegan and agree that overpopulation is a serious issue for the planet?

I guess so. I just meant that it's a bit hard to voice that on a site full of threads such as 'AIBU to want a fourth child?'. But yes, over-population is a big problem, much bigger than meat consumption.

"I would love to go to a restaurant and be able to ask for vegan food and know, confidently, that was what I was getting.
Last cafe I went to advertised vegan options, and when I asked, the waitress offered salmon."

Hehehe, I think that's quite funny. Presumably you just gave her the face and ordered something else though. It's not something you required counselling over now is it?
People have a variety of different diets...low fat, dairy free, gluten free, vegetarian, low carb, protein rich, sugar free and on and on...you can't expect yours to be at the forefront of waiting staff thoughts in every establishment. Stop making issues where there are none. Just say "no thank you" and order something you do want to eat. Fgs.

Last cafe I went to advertised vegan options, and when I asked, the waitress offered salmon

Then I think that you just had the misfortune to be served by an idiot. Most reasonably intelligent people know that vegan is no egg, dairy, meat or other animal products. Where there is some confusion is around things like honey- many people do not realise that vegans do not eat honey. I don't think even a 'fake vegan' like me would happily accept that salmon was a vegan meal.

wherethevioletsgrow Cows are repeatedly inseminated to keep them producing milk

Is this actually true? Are they not like humans, where milk will continue to be produced as long as a baby/calf/milking machine keeps drinking it?
Don't get me wrong, I'm sympathetic to the cause and think reduction in animal products for all is the way forward... I'm just curious about this aspect!

A calf a year usually. They obviously have pregnancy period then the calves are removed and they are milked.

Female calves are impregnated as soon as they are able and the males are sold or killed.

Sorry babs- meant to say that the pregnancies aren’t just about breast milk but also about replacing cows at the end of their milking career so more females need to be born as well as current milk supply met

Babs yes they are made to have a calf on average once a year so the milk yield is at it best. The male calves go to beef farming or get killed and the female calves get sold for milking.
The separation of the two day old calf from its mother is pitiful to see.

I recommend watching a documentary called Cowspiracy it's an eye opener on animal farming and the impact on the environment and starvation etc.