To think ladies first has no place these days

[Idreamofalandrover]

They've used it twice on the apprentice tonight, why? We aren't in the 50s anymore!

‘Ladies first’ is a pointless anachronism. Good manners should not be gender-specific and are timeless. Opening doors, help with heavy stuff, please and thank you....why should it matter if the person you are being polite to is male, female or whatever?

Who is Alan Drover though? And why are you dreaming about him?

I hold the door open for elderly people and young children but I don’t see them as unequal to me.

My husband always holds the door open for me. He knows I’m perfectly capable of doing it myself but he likes to make my life easier because you know, he loves me.

I do things for him that makes his life easier too. Equality doesn’t have to involve dropping doors in each other’s faces because “you can do it yourself”

It’s lovely. I kind of expect a well mannered man to open the door for me. If they don’t it’s no big deal but I do think it’s rude. I feel for men, life must be very confusing at times

Equality doesn’t have to involve dropping doors in each other’s faces because “you can do it yourself”

Um, no one said it does...

Just that I wouldn't hang back to let a man open a door for me if I got there first; I wouldn't think less of a man who didn't jump in front of me to open it for me; I would think less of anyone who didn't hold a door open for anyone else they were with, or someone else approaching the door, or someone who was carrying something heavy or pushing a pushchair... etc... but none of that, or good manners, are/would be gender specific.

Women who expect men to do this and, therefore, would not do it themselves are bad mannered.

Men who 'jump' in front of a woman to open the door for her are equally bad mannered.

People who arrive at the door first and hold it open for whoever else is there to go through before they do are well mannered.

I don't like the "ladies first" remark. I never expect to have doors opened for me. Am more likely to hold a door open for whoever is there - man, woman or child. Will offer my seat in the bus/train to anyone who looks as though they might need it more than I - whoever it is.

I use buses just about every day and at the bus stop it is rare that I am not waved forward by younger people of either gender or older men to get on first but I certainly don't expect it. It is rare that there is any comment about "ladies" and if there is I just say, 'Thank you,' and move on (in both senses!). I am neither young nor good looking - there's nothing in it for anyone other than being polite and showing good manners. Good manners and politeness are positive whoever is involved. If it's done with condescension or a leer then just no - profoundly irritating. Thankfully, no one leers in my direction these days!

I don't see it as manners as such I see it as a sign of respect. A gentleman knows his women's worth and wants to do these things for her. My DP opens all doors for me (I don't ask him too and it's not something we've spoke about!) because his dad and other male relatives did it. I don't see why anyone has to make an issue over this sort of thing, when there's so many other things going on in the world, to focus on something so silly just baffles me!

A gentleman knows his women's worth

His woman's worth? FFS.

I taught my son to always be courteous and respectful, but then I taught my daughter the same. I also think "ladies first" is outdated. I would rather everyone had manners.

all the posters who are correcting the OP's typo 'manors', and then saying 'is that all you have to worry about'. Hahaha! Are minor spelling mistakes all you have to worry about?

@SnowGlitter as soon as a I sent that I realised I worded it wrong it's just a saying my old (female) boss used to use when she saw him do it for me. I remember having a conversation with his dad and him saying to me that he hopes his son continues the door holding tradition. He said his grandad would say "it's the way I tell my wife I love her and appreciate all she does for us all" and it's just gone from there (bare in mind that's DPs great grandad so a long time ago) and they've just passed it down along the way. My DP tells me at least 3x a day he loves me (not gloating or anything) but still does the door thing. I don't actually think he's spoken to his dad and realises what the family tradition is for passing the door holding thing down he just does it because he watched the males in his family do it 🙈 I always open a door if I'm there before him, I don't wait for him to get there and I always teach my children to do the same, especially if there's buggies and other people struggling on the other side and the youngest DD who's 5 is always doing it now. She's always so proud when someone says thankyou 😊

** oh and FYI if my partner actually said Ladies first I'd be banging his head against the door 😂 I know I'm a lady thanks! I love the fact he opens the doors/pulls out chairs etc but he doesn't make a big deal as I'm doing this.... it's just done x

I like politeness from both sexes and will say thank you if someone holds a door open for me etc. but equally I will hold a door open for someone too.
Ladies first is sexist even though it may be unconsciously so. It makes it look like women need special consideration to give them a chance because they are weaker. It’s minor in the scheme of things but it is very much the thin end of the wedge.

The problem with attitudes like the ops is that if a man walked past a women to get to the door first - & then didn’t even hold it open for her ( had this many times ) then he’s an arrogant pig who probably hates women. If he does the right thing ( imo ) and lets the woman go first, then he’s not treating women like his equal.
I don’t want men to treat me like they’d treat other men, I want to be treated like a woman. But then I like gentlemen

Don't put words in my mouth, you can have manners without being sexist about it. Just because someone is rude doesn't mean they are a pig, it means they are rude.

Treat everyone the same regardless of their genitals.

Yes with the apprentice being pretty sexist, it is most years. Karen doesn't help at all.

you can have manners without being sexist about it.

So you don't mind someone holding the door open for you when they get there first, it's just if they say "ladies first" while doing it?

I'd say "After You" - would that annoy you too or is that acceptable?

No i dont mind it

And obviously ive opened many doors for other people in my time

Its a weird one though...you would think that it originated many years ago and that the man would go first in case of any 'danger'

Piffel read the op it's very clear. This obviously isn't a dislike of people holding the door open for other people.

I hold open door sometimes and say “age before beauty”

I know, terribly ageist. But it is done as a quip while having manners and opening the door for someone, the same with ladies first, totally harmless and no need for anyone to get their knickers in a twist over (bet no ladies here would mind if they were on a sinking ship 🚢!)

I feel for men, life must be very confusing at times

Oh yes poor men - FFS - treating all people with respect is not really a difficult concept is it?

And anyone who expresses his love by holding doors open is seriously lacking in imagination

I hate it too op - putting women on a pedestal is as patriarchal and sexist as treating them badly. It's all part of the same system.

If you go through a door, hold it for the next person, whatever their sex. My absolute worst is men who turn the whole thing into a complete rigmarole, determined to both hold the door and make me go through it first, no matter how inconvenient for both of us.

I think other than in emergency situations such as CheapSausagesAndSpam's example or the proverbial sinking ships where it makes sense that men , who are more likely to be bigger and stronger , put ladies first, it is sexist.

This morning the man at the first bus stop (in his 60s) said ladies first...there was only me and him at the bus stop...I said no you were before me...he said no my mother brought me up properly I smiled at him and got on and said thank you...at the second bus stop a guy in his 30s said ladies first and smiled at me...I quite liked it to be honest...my big boss this morning pretty much sprinted past me whilst I was shuffling along with my 'wake me up muffin and tea' and even with his hands full of his 'wake me up bacon sarnie and tea' he said ladies first to me and another woman and opened the door...with the way people are to each other sometimes nowadays it's nice to have a bit of old school chivalry and manners. Don't really care who gets on the bus first especially when it's cold or who holds the door open as long at it doesn't slam in my face

Karen kicked the arse of one of the candidates this year when she tried to say that only attractive girls should try and sell things to men.

I think lots of men have been trained in the "ladies first" thing, and it now seems churlish and confusing to chuck that back in their faces if it's just simple manners like pulling out a chair or opening a door, and so long as it doesn't extend to shit like "women can't drive" .

But I think if I had a son, I would teach him to do that for everyone and not to say "ladies first", ever!