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AIBU?

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Original poster

Christmas cards and women changing their name upon marriage!

950 replies

mulledoverwine · 15/12/2017 22:17

I am recently married and did not change my name.

I have been writing out my Christmas cards tonight and have realised that only 1 other woman I am posting to hasn't changed their name and another double barrelled theirs (he didn't).

Everyone else is Mr & Mrs {His Initial} Patriarchy.

I am quite enraged by it all! I have become more feminist as I have got older as I have started to question the norm more. Especially since reading the feminist boards on here.

I just want to shake every woman who changes their name!!

I am going to get slaughtered here aren't I??

OP posts:

TheGoldenBowl · 18/12/2017 15:23

granny

Oh ok... you think that the fact that women are still pushing against a whole host of inequalities is somehow a judgement on you and your fellow women who fought inequality back in the day, implying somehow that you didn't do enough?! Talk about looking for the negative!!

Why not look at it the opposite way... Today's feminism has been inspired by the earlier waves to keep fighting tirelessly? Isn't it good that we are even at a place where we can tackle, if you like, some of the 'minor' injustices?

grannytomine · 18/12/2017 15:25

No I think we did plenty, just a shame people can't recognise what we achieved because they are so busy worrying about what name other people want to use. We were awesome and no one thought we could od what we did.

snowy1982 · 18/12/2017 15:26

Thegoldenbowl I am making this distinction as some PP seem to be implying that women making the choice to change their names on marriage is negatively impacting on all women even if the actions and achievements of that woman in reality do a lot to advance equality for women

TheGoldenBowl · 18/12/2017 15:27

Now that, I think, I understand your position more fully granny I find it even more maddening! You think you fought for the real stuff and if today's women are still dissatisfied with any sexist issues, they are ungrateful and petty.

Way to piss on the sisterhood!

TheGoldenBowl · 18/12/2017 15:28

WE DO RECOGNISE WHAT YOU ACHIEVED!!!

MirriVan · 18/12/2017 15:29

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

MirriVan · 18/12/2017 15:30

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

jcyclops · 18/12/2017 15:34

So, if two women marry each other, do they each swap their surname to the partner's maiden name? If two men marry, is there a maiden name at all? If a man introduces himself "I'm John Smith, and this is my wife Jane" is he being a prat for not telling you her surname (and vice versa) or are you being a prat if you assume it is also Smith? Does keeping your maiden name make it easier after a divorce?

TheGoldenBowl · 18/12/2017 15:35

Sorry, didn't mean to shout. Ahem.

I am very grateful to ALL feminists for their efforts. Where would we be without them?!

But that doesn't mean we just stop.

The length of this thread suggests, rather misleadingly, that this is a hugely important issue. It's just that it's symbolic. And symbols matter. Most people took the traditional 'obey' out of their marriage vows... not because uttering one word could alter the course of their marriage, but because it symbolises an imbalance. Same with names.

We're arguing about it because some of us are saying "Come on, we know it's not FGM but it still matters a bit" whilst others keep refusing to acknowledge that it means ANYTHING. Which is foolish.

IsaSchmisa · 18/12/2017 15:36

Then you are making an utterly nonsensical argument snowy.

Surname changing on marriage doesn't necessarily negatively affect all women, since some women do like doing it, but it certainly negatively affects those of us who want a neutral choice like men get. That isn't lessened by any positive things the individual woman concerned might have done, any more than a woman who protests outside abortion clinics but keeps her own name instead of taking her FILs on marriage isn't fucking women over with her forced birthism. The one thing doesn't eradicate the existence of the other. That's not how it works. It's not like buy 3, get 1 free.

grannytomine · 18/12/2017 15:39

TheGoldenBowl, I am going now as I think you are just looking for an argument not a discussion.

onlyconnect · 18/12/2017 15:41

If there's such choice why don't men change their names?
Why is the world full of women who can't stand their surnames or can't wait to get away from their name for some reason but virtually no men who feel this way?
Those who think it's a straight forward choice are kidding themselves. I know of only two men in total who have ever changed their name on marriage: one changed his completely, one double barrelled.
Changing surname part way through life writes women out of history. That's why men don't do it.

SadieContrary · 18/12/2017 15:43

I think this comes down to basic freedom of choice. You didn't want to change your name. I did.

Rather than trying to pick fault with one side over the other, why don't we just be pleased that we have such freedom of choice?

Sheeesh. It's Christmas. Go and pour a

snowy1982 · 18/12/2017 15:51

Actually IsaSchmisa, that’s exactly how some PP made it out to be, that women choosing to change their names have a negative effect on others. If that’s not what you are saying grand, but others were posting some comments almost berating the choices other women make if it didn’t agree with the choices they did.

Personally I do not care what people call me, use my single name or married name, I will answer to both. Give me whatever title you want, I do not care and although I tend not to address things to people with titles unless it is necessary, when doing so I will use whatever title they choose to be associated with.

What has got me riled up with this thread is the pp that imply women who make a well thought out choice about how they should be known are being criticised by women who decided to make a different choice. Women who changed their names are being judged by those who didn’t, never mind the condescending comments of how we didn’t actually make the choice, that society forced it on us but we’re unable to see it

TheGoldenBowl · 18/12/2017 15:59

I am going now as I think you are looking for an argument not a discussion

I thought I was being quite reasonable in the circumstances.

TheGoldenBowl · 18/12/2017 16:06

how we didn't actually make the choice, that society forced it on us but we're unable to see it

This is the bit that is bugging me (well, one of the bits). It is perfectly possible to do something because of societal pressure and be aware of the pressures (and totally ok with them). No one is saying you're blind to anything. The infuriating thing is when you say "There are no pressures" as if hundreds of years of everyone doing something one way doesn't create even the tiniest whisper of expectation

PaperBagPrincesa · 18/12/2017 16:12

Goldenbowl is correct. Just because it isn't FGM doesn't mean it doesn't matter at all. It does matter. Some people are so willfully obtuse that it would make you facepalm.

IsaSchmisa · 18/12/2017 16:22

Yes I know they did snowy, and I'm one of them. Other women choosing to change their names and titles on marriage does have a negative impact on me. That isn't judging. It's a fact, one that you don't have the right not to hear. You can do whatever you like, you can't censor me from describing the effects on me.

And it is ludicrous to pretend that because some of these women do other things that have a positive impact for women, that means their decision to make it harder for me to have a neutral choice like men have is somehow mitigated. The one doesn't outweigh the other. This is also a fact.

LoniceraJaponica · 18/12/2017 16:36

It matters to some posters and not to others. Why is that so difficult to understand?

ringle · 18/12/2017 16:47

slice my mum did that too for years.

now only my elderly auntie does it

snowy1982 · 18/12/2017 16:47

IsaSchmisa, I am not trying to be argumentative, but I do want honestly want to know how the choice I made is making your choice more difficult?

ringle · 18/12/2017 16:47

I’ve never actually thought about the ‘why’ before 😳. On a slight detour...I’ve still got my married name even though I’ve been divorced for 15 years...never occurred to me to change it to be honest...but reading this thread has made me question my lack of action in this regard! I’d quite like to change it actually...but to what? Hmmmm😮

How about "Freedemme"?

TheGoldenBowl · 18/12/2017 16:49

Lonicera

That isn't difficult to understand. What you're failing to see is that, whether or not it bothers individual women, it definitely affects women as a group.

Some posters cannot see past the individual.

Neiflette · 18/12/2017 16:52

TheGoldenBowl

So because the individual decision negatively affects women as a whole group, the individual woman should do something they don't actually want to do, regardless of any set of circumstances that is personal to them?

I agree things need to be more 50/50 btw, I'm not denying that.

Neiflette · 18/12/2017 16:55

I can admit that my decision wasn't a feminist one, and perhaps that's selfish of me, but in my context making the feminist decision would also have been selfish on a personal level.

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