To be dreading Christmas present from DP as I know it won’t be an engagement ring?

[CalifornianSummef]

...and that’s all my friends and family keep saying thats what they expect it will be?!

Been together 5.5 years, I’m 30, he’s 35. I want to get married, he knows this. Previously he’s not been keen etc, we last had a chat about a year ago and he said he ‘Had come round to the idea more and maybe marriage is something he’d like.’ I made it clear that I wouldn’t be hanging around long term if that wasn’t ever going to be on the cards.

However, since then on Valentine’s Day, our anniversary, my 30th birthday, all my friends and family have been ‘ohhh maybe he’ll propose, bet you’ll get a ring!’ He took me away for my 30th for a romantic city break and it’s all I heard on texts etc. But nothing.

I feel disappointed anyway when these occasions pass by and there isn’t a ring, but for my friends and family to constantly keep going on about it is making it worse.

I know he won’t be getting me a ring for Christmas and I’m just dreading the ‘Oh did you get a ring?’ messages. I’m also dreading the disappointment I know that I’ll feel on the day, the disappointment that I’m coming to know too well

Next time your friends / family makes a comment, just ask them not to and be honest. Just say it's a sore spot for you and you find it upsetting. They will then stop.

Why would he not marry you because of your work situation? I don't get this. You either love someone or you don't. If that genuinely is his reason, I doubt you are compatible, as he won't see you as an equal until you earn the same as him.

He told you that he was "coming round to the idea" - what the hell?!

I wouldn't be with anyone who thought the idea of marrying me was an idea they'd have to come round to.

If he wanted to marry you then he would have done it by now. It isn't like he's a man in his mid-20s who wants time to live his life first, he's a 35 year old man who should be seriously considering who and what he wants in his future. If by now he hasn't made a commitment to wanting you in his future by proposing to you then I doubt he ever will.

My now DH proposed after 2 years because we were coming up to 30. We knew we wanted to be together and we knew we wanted children and so we cracked on with it. We were married 5 months later and I was pregnant 2 months after that. I was 30 when I had my first child and I had my second just before I turned 34.

If marriage and childten is what you want in your future then you need to have an honest discussion with your partner as time is not on your side when it comes to waiting around and hoping.

Please, please don't waste these important years of your life on a man who has no qualms about stringing you along

If however he does propose then follow the good advice you've been given and set a date quickly otherwise two years down the line you still won't be married. Me and DH had booked our venue 5 days after he'd proposed.

I'm sorry OP but I'm not sure this is going to end the way you want it to. If he'd wanted to marry you then you would have already been married by now.

stickytoffeevodka I didn't't give my boyfriend an ultimatum out loud but I did in my head.

When the time ran out we broke up and I told him why.

He wanted marriage and kids (like me) but was nervous!

We are the same age. I was 35 and feeling my egg count dropping, he was 35 and still feeling like a single man.

Hopefully, OP this man won't marry just because 'of an ultimatum', but because he realises if he doesn't marry this woman he loves he will lose her.

OP only give an ultimatum if you want, as I say, I didn't but you decide the parameters of your own relationship. That's what I really meant.

Do you know the answer to all these questions, and if not could you try to find out just from having discussions (as opposed to a grilling):

• does he want children (if you do)
• and when - how old does he think you should be ideally, from the point of view of health and from the point of view that it may or may not take a few years of trying
• would he like to be married at that point, to give stability to the family (whether you have got another job or not)
• would he prefer you to be a sahm or p/t or f/t (and what do you want?)
• can you picture your ideal future and do you know his?

If you don't know already, finding out may be clarifying fro you, and you may decide you want to run for the hills! Or it may put a rocket under his backside.

OP get a grip or you'll be 35 and still whinging. Do yourself a favour and dump his arse. Find yourself a man who is desperate to marry you, thinks you're his dream come true and wants to commit to you 100%. They do exist and you do deserve one if that's what you want.

If you don't want that and you'd rather be strung along while your fertility goes down the pan, go for it!

I'm going to go against the grain a little. I've been happily married to DH for ten years ago but twelve years ago I could have written your post right down to the annoying text messages from friends and families.

I didn't give him any ultimatums and I didn't give him a cut off date. I told him how much it meant to me and that although I knew he was a ditherer and hated big gestures and "events", I just wanted the security of being married to him and I didn't care how when or where we got engaged/married and that I would give him space to figure it out, which he did, in his own time and his own way.

If you love him and want to spend the rest of your life with him, maybe being clear about your feelings, but giving him the space the do it his way is better than an emotional showdown?

If it really is the whole 9 yards or nothing Like others have said, bringing it up feels like pressure and that doesn't satisfy the soul in the long run. Can you be playful with him? Derren Brown his ass. Leave bridal magazines lying about, play that kind of music and pull him up for a dance. Make him a pie with forever yours spelt in pastry and wink when you give it to him etc.. You get to give it one last shot with a smile on your face as aposed to an ultimatum like a sour puss ( even though you have every right to be expectant) and your not asking, yr nudging nicely. I would wait until after Dec. Just concentrate on having a lovely Christmas knowing you have a plan for Jan. Forget it for now if you can. Good luck whatever you decide, I'm imagining the best for you x

I think it's very easy to sit there and tell the OP to leave - she loves this guy enough to want to commit forever. It's hard to bin it all off!

I set a mental deadline after being with my now DH for about 5 years. He knew I wanted marriage before kids etc.
When it arrived I had 4 really shit days building up the strength/courage/whatever to leave. It came to a head in a huge tearful row and me saying if he was wasting my chance to have children (true) and he had to let me go if he wasnt bothered. He said there were two things he wanted to achieve before he proposed, I agreed to trust him that it was true.

The day project 2 was complete he went ring shopping, 10m later married (he wanted to get married ASAP), 1 month later DS1 was on the way.

Maybe I was a fool in some peoples eyes for trusting him, but if I didn't trust him, why would I marry him?

Sorry to be so blunt OP, but he doesn’t want to marry you.

My dh is shit at big life things. I convinced him to move in with me (flatshare), buy a flat with me, buy a house with me, eventually marry me -I'll come back to this one and to have a child with me. He would still be living with his parents if I hadn't forced these things. He is happy they all happened. The marriage thing was a massive issue between us. He didn't really have a reason for not wanting to get married whereas it was really important to me. The only reason we are married now is that my mum was diagnosed with a terminal illness and I gave him an ultimatum. He had to marry me or leave me. He still didn't decide until I started getting out the suitcases for him and he reluctantly agreed. The lead up to the wedding was pretty shit, but we had a great day (my mum was there) and we're both really happy to be married now. It took a lot of convincing to start trying for a baby too. He's a fantastic father. His crapness at commitment/big things is his absolute worst feature and it drives me mad, but he has many redeeming qualities. I am aware that I sounds like a controlling crazy person, but actually I'm quite normal! I'm just trying to show that it's not always so cut and dry. You need to talk to him about how you're feeling.

OP what do you think lesbians have to do, seeing as though there's no man involved? Do you really think we're so very different to you?

Not read the full thread so apologies if I'm repeating things others have said.

My tip? Take the pressure off him. One of my best mates waited ages for her bloke to pop the question, and it was when she stopped mentioning it that he asked.

But what I would also say is, if the relationship is great and you're generally happy together, does it really matter? I'm married and it was a lovely wedding, it is nice to look at him and think yep that's my husband, but overall, it's not really changed that much. If he hadn't seen the point in getting married but had been equally committed, then it wouldn't really have bothered me either way. The personal dynamic is so much more important than the legal status of the relationship.

Your post resonated with me OP because I was in a similar position with my ex partner. I thought I would share my story with you.

We had been together for eight years and marriage and children had been talked about, he kept saying "one day". One day when we were talking he made a comment "maybe in December". So Christmas day came and went and there was no proposal. So I thought maybe it will be New Years Eve. This came and went and there was still no proposal. I was devastated and talked to him about it, when he denied ever saying anything about anything happening in December. He definitely did by the way, it was not me misunderstanding anything.

This was when I realised that it was always going to be "one day" in the future and that marriage and children was never going to actually happen. This was not the only thing wrong with our relationship (that is a whole other thread however). I looked at the whole of our relationship and realised that it was no longer something I wanted.

When I told him I was leaving him, he proposed to me but it was to little and way to late. I told him where to go and kept walking out the door!

Leaving was one of the hardest and most painful things I have ever done but was also the best thing for me, I have never regretted it. A year later I met my current partner, who is much better for me in so many ways. We are engaged and have bought a house together.

There is nothing wrong with knowing what you want from a relationship and leaving if you are not getting what you need. Its important to value yourself always. With the friends and family, I would politely ask them to back off, so you have time to think. Big hugs to you and I wish you all the best.

If you don't feel able to have a frank, cards on the table discussion about where you see your life with him going then your marriage probably wouldn't last anyway. You need to be able to communicate to have a lasting meaningful relationship.

In your shoes when mention of my job/work next came up in conversation I would be saying casually to him, 'I shall be leaving in the spring. It's fairly clear that this relationship isn't going any further so I'll be looking to move on'.

And I would. My New Year Resolution would be to be searching for work elsewhere and moving out.

I think the most important thing the OP has said is that she thinks he would say no if she asked him to get married. Now it might be that he has issues with the concept of marriage, but if not then it's that he doesn't want to commit to her. That measn's his 'coming around to the idea' is not a 'maybe marriage has some benefits' and more of a 'maybe you are not the one'.

dh and I didn't do the proposal thing either way. We just had a serious conversation one night about getting married, and decided yes it was for us and that we should start planning. Then other things happened in life, one of his parents died and I realised on visiting her that if dh and I were not married and he was very ill I wouldn't even have the right to sit at his bedside because I wouldn't be next of kin. So I said that we should really get married sooner rather than later, and we did.

I don't understand why the tradition of getting down on one knee has persisted when everything around it has changed. People have sex, move in together, buy houses together, have children together etc all before committing to marriage or marrying. Proposals seem a relic of a past age but cause all this angst and inequality in relationships. Talk to each other about how you are feeling, work out what you both want and either commit to each other or move on.

Agree with MotherCupboard

Being able to communicate honestly is vital, as is wanting the same things

He doesn't want to marry you. Don't degrade yourself. Bin him and move on.

If you have only talked about marriage 3 times in your relationship, and originally you were not really keen on marriage, does he really have a clue how important it is for you now. If my partner mentioned they wanted to do something and it was not mentioned again for a year, I would think it was not that important to them.
tbh I really don't understand woman who hang around waiting for a proposal, why not just have a grown up discussion about what you both want & take it from there

Yep.have the big conversation, calmly and openly,allow free moving dialogue. As an established couple you have a lot to discuss
Marriage - does he want to?if so when,set timescale
Marriage is it a true dealbreaker for you op or are you happy to cohabit remain unmarried
Kids - does he want kids?how many?age gap?
School - state or private. Faith or non denomination
Childcare - nursery, grandparents,CM. Or a sahp. Does he expect you to sahp
Finances independent sole accounts or joint finances
Legal have you asked GP to record each other as NOK. Have you made wills?
Accommodation - is it joint mortgage?do you rent and plan to buy

I often wonder what happens to the OPs in these threads. And I often wonder if some of them who come on and post that they're 35 or so posted years before, hung around and are still waiting. Because the thing is, no decision is still a decision. And someone who hangs around for 5, 10+ years with some person when they want to get married and have kids may not be admitting to him/herself that he/she really doesn't want both those things in the first place, and staying with some stringer along serves admitting that; then you can blame that other person, 'I wanted kids and marriage, but X kept telling me later and I ran out of time.' Well, we're all responsible for ourselves.

Almost invariably, the stringer along finds someone else quickly after the relationship breaks down and marries him/her and has kids.

So you have to ask yourself, OP and anyone in this situation, a relationship where you're just not on the same page with the other one as to what you need and want in life, are you okay with being in your 40s and being on your own when that other person decides your relationship has run its course, and then hearing htat he/she met 'the one' and has married and had kids?

If you're answer is no, then cut your losses and be true to yourself and what you want.

There's no such thing as 'the one'.

I had a friend in this position. One night I got a bit drunk and gave her DF a bit of a lecture - totally out of order I know but lo and behold he proposed that Christmas. Your interfering friends and family need to do some proper interfering. Amateurs pfft!

That would be DP not DF. Duh!

As I said I’d be telling my kids (boys&girls) run for the fucking hills if friends/family want to know when you propose
He doesn’t need to propose and if he doesn’t want to ,and well so be it
Op should tell Busybody mates and family they need to zip it about proposal

I think he doesnt want to marry you comments are a bit harsh. I had similar feelings with my dp after being together for 5yeara. It does get to the point where each occasion is a let down. Even though we have a strong relationship doubts set in and people asking wheres your ring etc is painful. My Dh proposed on a normal day and I found out he had the ring for ages before was just waiting for the right time when it was unexpected. He was nervous id say no even though id made it clear thats what I wanted. You need to think about you relationship only you will know deep down if this is the dp to build a life with or do you just want to be married and have a wedding.