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Original poster

To be angry at photos at Nativity?

758 replies

MrsAnamCara · 14/12/2017 15:45

Just seen DC infant nativity. We were sent out letters, went to the office yo get tickets, had texts to remind people-all fine and well. No mention of needing permission to take photos/videos. Nothing mentioned before the start of the actual nativity performance either. The performance starts and several people whip their phones out and begin taking photos and videos but not of individual children, of all of the children on stage. It goes on throughout the performance and I can see in their view finder they are filming/recording video of 5+ children... A parent the right if the school Hall is stood filming the entire performance.

No one said they weren't allowed to but...neither was the guardian or parent of every single child asked either.

In my D's nursery, they asked for written permission, and if only one parent didn't give permission then no one was allowed to take photos or videos. Even if we were allowed, then it was photos and videos of your child only (zoom in) and if there were other children then you couldn't post it on social media and send to anyone else.

It really ruined the performance for me, as I don't know these people who are taking videos/photos of my child, I don't know where they will post them or send them to, I don't know who will see that photo or video. I did not give anyone permission to take his photo or record him?

I'm I being unreasonable to think the school should have asked for legal written permission for all children's parents or guardian's? And if some parents don't agree or give permission then that's too bad.

OP posts:
StreyyTV · 15/12/2017 18:07

Does nobody else's school sell DVDs of performances?

I try to focus on my kids when filming, but it feels like my courtesy is for nothing when you can buy the whole thing on disc anyway.

Sparklyglitter · 15/12/2017 18:08

As far as I’m aware you should be asked for permission, as the School hall is not public. E.g. out in the street, park etc. There is also the issue of looked after and adopted children who because of personal issues which could be as bad as abusive parents (why they no longer live with them) who’s whereabouts should not be shared on social media for their safety. Or women/men who have been abused by their partners and have escaped from them. Sharing their images or that of their children on social media could put them at risk. I find it annoying, but seeking permission is essential these days!

JacquesHammer · 15/12/2017 18:10

Does nobody else's school sell DVDs of performances?

Not for nativity/harvest type things. For the two bigger shows I help with, yes.

We do one copy of the full show which goes to the parents of children who have issues surrounding safety. I then carefully edit the footage removing all trace of those children.

OJZJ · 15/12/2017 18:10

Quinnsno1lady I have a lac child due to the new starters pictures going in the paper last year without consent (or even being made aware until I saw his smile beaming up at me) his birth mother found out which school he was at and turned up off her face trying to abduct him so yes it matters.

StreyyTV · 15/12/2017 18:14

We do one copy of the full show which goes to the parents of children who have issues surrounding safety. I then carefully edit the footage removing all trace of those children.

Interesting. I had to a sign a consent form for both my kids when they started at school and it basically states they'll be left out of performance if I don't agree. I thought it was standard so thought nothing of it at the time.

AethelflaedsWhiteGoose · 15/12/2017 18:16

Our school has a blanket ban on filming and I think that it a very good thing. There is an opportunity to take a picture of your own child at the end.

brotherphil · 15/12/2017 18:17

You can take whatever pictures you like at school performances - it's a private occasion. It can be of any children you like. And you can do with them what you like. You do not need permission, and the school can not direct you in what you do with them.

On the other hand, the school is completely within their legal rights to exclude you from, and.or ask you to leave, such private occasions if you defy their policies. As you say, it is a private occasion, and the school is the host. You do not have the legal right to invade a private occasion, on somebody else's property, when you are not invited and have been told that you are not welcome. It's called trespass, and the school would be within their rights to call the police to deal with trespassers, especially in such a sensitive place as a school.

Chimera246 · 15/12/2017 18:18

We all remember the tragic consequenses when we USED to allow uncontrolled photography of children, don't we? Well, come, on, someone must remember ONE tragic consequence? Or even a mildly inconveinent one...?

We all remember when someone used to take their 36 exposure film, get it developed at the Chemist a few hundred (or thousand) times over; then drive round to the house of everyone they'd met for 5 mins or more and giving them a cop of the photo, and also giving those people enough copies to give one to everyone they've ever met.

Don't we?

EMSMUM16 · 15/12/2017 18:21

These laws annoy me. Sorry but this data protection probably has a good reason but honesty its just too much

StreyyTV · 15/12/2017 18:23

Our school has a blanket ban on filming and I think that it a very good thing

Giving into paranoia and losing your children's performances to time is a good thing?

Mumof56 · 15/12/2017 18:24

We all remember when someone used to take their 36 exposure film, get it developed at the Chemist a few hundred (or thousand) times over; then drive round to the house of everyone they'd met for 5 mins or more and giving them a cop of the photo, and also giving those people enough copies to give one to everyone they've ever met

Don't we?

Have people stopped doing this?Blush

*hides 100 copies of photograph

Maireadplastic · 15/12/2017 18:30

Our PTA film it and then circulate it through class blogs. We are told if there are any CP issues and film accordingly. Parents can come forward to take photos afterwards.

This way we can ask for no filming or photos during the performance.

Minifootballteam · 15/12/2017 18:33

I think people need to realise the basic point of some children being in danger of certain people find out where they go to school. My daughter is under strict safeguarding so no parents are allowed to film or photograph performances. Only to take photos of their own child at the end of the show. School takes photos and recordings but they are edited before being made available.
Yes, parents complain. They are not made aware of the exact issue so no-one is aware it's because of my child but the school takes the responsibility very seriously and does a brilliant job.

libbyb · 15/12/2017 18:33

I've been to granddaughter's nativity today and the Head Mistress made it quite clear that it was absolutely fine to take pictures of your child and any other children in the vicinity - HOWEVER this was for personal and family use ONLY. No Posting on social media whatsoever. There are vulnerable children in every school, you need to be aware that there are implications beyond your own family/friends status. Please respect the privacy of other children. You rightly want to record these special moments but other children may have safeguarding issues. The Headmistress was completely polite and candid - respect the rules please!!

Truzza · 15/12/2017 18:35

I would be furious, it really can be a huge problem to tag and put children on social media especially without permission!

It’s not as simple as being overly fussy, it’s a parents choice no one else’s, the school should absolutely sort this out and stop it immediately.

Youare definitely not being unreasonable

brotherphil · 15/12/2017 18:39

that people are able to find a child somewhere online through sheer coincidence is absurd.

The point is that, when it is relevant, it's not through sheer coincidence. It's through obsessed people cooperating with each other with the aim of helping each other fulfil their obsessions. As has been said, they have bulletin boards and websites to work together on. Just like the ones for anoraks to talk about ufo's, except these ones are a mixture of desperate and psychotic people (sometimes the same person) trying to locate children who they believe have been stolen from them, and possibly plotting "revenge".

That sort of arseholes have always been around, but the internet makes it a lot easier for any sort of group to cooperate, and loose security settings on social media are where they look.

OlennasWimple · 15/12/2017 18:42

Sorry but this data protection probably has a good reason but honesty its just too much

RTFT people!

Pilgit · 15/12/2017 18:47

Always makes me uncomfortable.

Yes this is important. When I was 17 one of the brownies at the unit I helped at was murdered alongside her mother by her father. They had been found partly through a photo published in a local paper without permission. This was before social media so it would be a lot simpler now. Not all consequences are as bad as this but we just never know the consequences.

And no I'm not a troll. This did really happen.

JacquesHammer · 15/12/2017 18:48

These laws annoy me. Sorry but this data protection probably has a good reason but honesty its just too much

Yep. You're absolutely right. It's done JUST to annoy you. Keeping a child alive is just TOO much.

Hmm
cantkeepawayforever · 15/12/2017 18:48

The other thing is that if you look at it from the risk management point of view, 'Ask people who are in possession of photographs / videos and have social media accounts not to put these photographs or video on social media', is not a particularly strong control.

It is fine if the risk is tiny, so it would be OK if, for example, there are no vulnerable children at all in the school, and the school is merely maintaining a sensible level of overall risk management.

However, if the risk is known to be greater - for example if there is a vulnerable child or children in the school and known tio the staff - it is NOT robust enough, because the school cannot reasonably police all accounts, and the whole network of 'friends of friends'.

So if the risk is greater, a higher level of control is needed. One option is to ban photos and films altogether during the performance, and allow them at the end once known children have been silently spirited away.

Another is to only allow photographs and filming by an 'insider', who can edit to remove all vulnerable children before the footage is released.

Both of those are reasonably robuist risk controls, and so are preferable if a vulnerable child is present. As I said above, IME it is rare for a school to have no vulnerable children, so the latter two approaches are reasonable 'routine approaches to risk management'.

cantkeepawayforever · 15/12/2017 18:52

And as I have said before, the issue is not with the photographs / films themselves.

The difference, and it is a recent difference, is the uncontrolled dissemination of images and metadata via social media. This is so recent that a 'well, it was OK when i was a school' is as irrelevant as 'it's OK, children come to no harm up chimneys, it toughens them up. Name one instance of a child you know suffering from being a chimneysweep...'

CharlotteLV · 15/12/2017 18:52

It doesn't matter how clear the school rules are on this, or how often they are communicated to parents: there will always be parents who ignore the rules and film events or take photos. Deeply annoying.

MiaowTheCat · 15/12/2017 18:53

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

brotherphil · 15/12/2017 18:55

These laws annoy me. Sorry but this data protection probably has a good reason but honesty its just too much

Would a literally psycho ex turning up at your child's school and killing or injuring them for the pain it would cause you "just too much"?

For some people that is not hyperbole, but the actual, real, danger if said psycho ex, or somebody that they are in contact with, manages to find out where their child it.

Mintylizzy9 · 15/12/2017 18:55

Well it's like the twelve twats of Christmas over here.

You were right ladies I shouldn't have come here, for a moment or two you forget just how selfish some people are and that grown ass adults can think fuck that, I'm not missing having a picture of my kid just coz that ones adopted/in care/vulnerable....it's my RIGHT to post pictures of my kids anywhere I want.

It my sons RIGHT to not have to be uprooted yet again for his own safety, it's my sons RIGHT not to be faced with his abusers, it's my sons RIGHT to have a safe and happy childhood something he's already missed far too much of.

My preschooler has more empathy in his little finger than some of you posters despite the fucking horrific start in life he's had.

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