To myself? Such guilt about giving up breast feeding.

[QueenAmongstMen]

I have a 16 week old baby boy who means the world to me.

On day 7 of life breast feeding was unbearable, I had cracked bleeding nipples and I was crying in pain during every feed. I had him assessed for tongue tie and he had a very severe one so I had it snipped at 9 days of age.

We continued to have feeding difficulties so I kept getting him reassessed and started going to cranial Osteopath sessions due to problems with his neck and positioning and it helped massively.

By this point he was also on ranitidine for silent reflux.

At a GP appointment to have him reviewed the doctor suggested my baby may have an allergy to dairy as he also suffered from eczema on his face and his weight gain was quite slow. He advised I remove all dairy from my diet and to see how things go.

I have been dairy free for 3 weeks now and things did improve but over the last week or so breast feeding him has become nothing but a source of worry, stress and tears. He screams all the time, he doesn't want to breast feed, he has diarrhoea every day, he doesn't enjoy it and he's still reacting to something in my milk but I don't know what. It kills me seeing him in so much pain. Last night he was screaming for over an hour and I just sat there in tears.

I know breast milk is best but this can't be best for him. It's not for me either, I worry every day, I cry every day, I practically starve myself because I'm too scared to eat anything in case he reacts to it and I'm just exhausted.

Last night, amongst the screaming and my tears I said to my husband that I just couldn't cope anymore and this situation isn't fair to anyone and I think we should put him on a specialised formula which a doctor had previously suggested.

I'm absolutely beside myself with it all. I cry when I see him in pain because I know it's my fault and I cry at the thought of putting him on formula because I feel like I'm letting him down.

I belong to an online support group for allergies and these women are dairy free, soy free, egg free, gluten free, wheat free, fish free, banana free, nut free and a whole host of other foods and I just couldn't cope with that but then I feel selfish because I'm putting my needs and feelings above giving my baby breast milk.

I'm just so worn down by it and I feel like such a failure.

I know I need to ring the GP today to sort out getting the formula but I know I'm just going to cry down the phone.

I'm part of another Facebook group who have been so, so supportive and are reassuring me I'm doing the right thing and I know they're right because I just can't take it anymore. The last 4 months of feeding him just haven't been enjoyable at all but I feel like I'm a bad mom because I'm stopping trying.

Has anyone else been in this situation? It's killing me

I am glad that you are on the way to getting this sorted out QueenAmongstMen

Thank you

I've actually written a list of all the reasons I'm going this and why breast feeding isn't the best thing for my son. I know that sounds really pathetic but it helps to see it written down in black and white and I know I can go back and re-read it then I'm having low or doubtful moments.

I have ended it by writing "It is not my fault my baby has an allergy"and I think that's what I've got to focus on.

Now I've just got to try and get my head around bottle feeding. The GP was talking to me about teat sizes and I have absolutely no idea what he was talking about.

I think this is going to be a learning curve for both of us.

You will get through this, OP. Honestly. You've breastfed your baby for 4 months. That's amazing! You've done so well. He'll be starting solids in a couple of months, he'll change and grow so much in the next few months you wont believe it - and breastfeeding wont feel like the huge thing it is now. Really.

I was devastated when I stopped breastfeeding my first child at 6 weeks. I vividly remember sobbing to my DH and feeling like a complete failure. When I look back at it now, I cant believe I was so harsh on myself! I tried my very best, through awful issues (different to yours - I still don't know what went wrong, really, but I had a massive oversupply, constant severe mastitis and eventually an abcess that put me in hospital and has badly disfigured one of my breasts ).

I got so hung up on breastfeeding that I couldn't see that it was really damaging me and my relationship with my baby. It made everything feel hard and painful and stressful at a time when we should have been enjoying those first few wonderful months. It really wasn't worth the misery in the end. Its taken time for me to see that, but I really do see it now and you will, too.

Worth experimenting with a few different teats, OP.

Some babies prefer different shaped teats, and teats also come with different sized holes in them (don't know what the technical word for that is!), so the flow is different.

My DS was used to my oversupply and violent let down (!), so we went straight for a teat with a big hole that delivers the milk quickly. But some babies will prefer a slower flow or prefer having to suck harder to get the milk out, iyswim.

I'm going to have to go to ASDA later to buy supplies and I think I will find that hard too but it will also be another step forward. Yesterday I didn't even think I could face phoning the GP but now I'm on track to addressing the issue so I'm just going to take it step by step and then it won't feel so overwhelming I hope.

I do have a fast let down so I will get a big holed teat - thanks for the tip!

We had the exact same issues with our youngest (sans eczema) after my wife had successfully breast fed four others. We made the decision to switch to formula (which like you led to all kinds of feelings of inadequacy) and she's just celebrated her third birthday. She's as happy and healthy as any of the others. You've done everything you could and way more than most. Don't beat yourself up at all, sometimes it just doesn't work out.

Taking care of yourself first is the best thing you can do for your little bundle. He'll be absolutely fine with the switch to formula and things will get better for you too.

Honestly - and I say this with the best of intentions - the only person who worries about you stopping breastfeeding is you.

You're doing an amazing job, you love your baby to bits, he's fed, warm, well cared for. Don't put pressure on yourself to do something that's not working.

I have friends who felt similarly - trust me, after a couple of weeks of bottle feeding, they were so much calmer and happier. And I'd bet you anything I own that you couldn't look at their kids now and identify which ones were bottle and which were breast

I know that sounds really pathetic
No, it really doesn't.

You need to do whatever it is to get through this and make things better for the pair of you.

In a year's time, you will look back at this and think "why did I beat myself up so much?"

Thank you to everyone for being so kind and understanding. One thing I'm really going to struggle with is the ease of breast feeding, I don't have to worry about bottles and sterilising etc and if baby is hungry I can just put him to the breast, there's no worries.

I'm supposed to be going out with my sister for the day next week and I can't imagine how I'm going to do it anymore because how I am supposed to feed him if I've got to make up bottles?

Top tip for feeding on demand with formula (which I wish I'd known when I was in your position).

Easiest route is to use ready-made UHT cartons if you can afford it.

But if you can't, or your DS ends up on prescription formula (which only comes in powdered form) if he has some sort of intolerance, it needs to be made up with water of the correct temperature (remember, it is the powder that poses the risk of infection, not the water). Now NHS guidlines are unworkable, because they say "boil a litre of water, then leave to cool for 30 minutes so it's at 70 degrees when you make up the bottle", which is clearly hopeless advice with a screaming baby desperate for a feed.

So here's what you do instead. Suppose they're on 100ml feeds (4 oz - scale quantities depending on the exact amount you need). Fill 6 bottles with 30 ml each of boiled water and store in the fridge. Then when you need to prepare a feed, boil the kettle and grab one of the bottles, top up to the 100ml mark - hey presto, water at exactly 70 degrees (or so close it make next to no difference), add the powder (you can get containers you pre-measure the right quantity into), shake and cool under a running tap. Quick enough to feed your baby before catastrophic levels of crying ensue.

(And yes, washing and sterilising is an enormously annoying faff, but it's not for ever thank god...)

The water just has to be greater than 70 degrees, not at exactly 70 degrees. So you don't need to wait 30 minutes for the water to cool, you can use it as soon as you want.

Although, some of the prescription formulas need to be made up with colder water due to the ingredients not standing up to water greater than 70 degrees. I guess you would follow the instructions as they are on the tins.

Ok, given that he was settled last night and you’ve been doing the elimination diet, I would think that would suggest it was working and you wouldn’t have to give up if you don’t want to. My older DS has CMPA and we used the elimination diet and it did work but it does take a few weeks to see a difference (you can get dairy free chocolate btw . Of course, if you’ve decided that switching would be better all round then go for it and don’t feel bad.

My CMPA wasn’t picked up and I was given normal formula which obviously didn’t help!

Assigned, it's a case of balancing out the conflicting demands of killing bacteria without simultaneously denaturing the proteins in the milk by over-heating it, which is why 70 degrees is a compromise figure. It's certainly not a good idea to make it with boiling water. But the main thing is not to make it with cold water (which is the main reason behind the higher rates of gastro-enteritis in formula fed babies - it's not the formula itself, it's corner-cutting on making it properly.).

Anyway, the main thing to remember Queen is that you have given your DS a fantastic start, 4 months is much longer than many women manage (and most of the benefits of breast feeding will already have accrued) and in the long run, it only makes a tiny difference anyway - there are many many much more important bits of being a mum.

He may be refusing the EBM from the bottle becasue he can smell it and its meant to come from the breast. He may well be fine with formula from a bottle.
There are a couple of different formulas available for babies with allergies. I dont know the UK names, so I will just describe them generically. If you google, you will find the names.

Cows milk free formula
Soya free formula
Sometimes you can find one that is cow and soya free
Hydrolysed protein formula - Made from natural products but all the proteins are chopped up so that the babies immune system doesnt recognise them and so doesnt have an allergic reaction.

I strongly suggest you start with a hydrolysed protein formula as it is the gentlest. When he is all calmed down and happy, you can then test if he can tolerate cows milk or soya versions.

Many babies are allergic to both cows milk and soya and some to many more foods. My DS was sensitive to 17 foods when he was 4 months old, but only has a lasting allergy to 1 food now he is 11yrs old. We used the hydrolysed formula for him, and although it smells weird and tastes awful to grownups, he guzzled it down and was very happy and contented on it.

He's been prescribed Nutramigen and I've been warned that it smells disgusting.

I'm not ready to give up breast feeding at all. Not one part of me wants me to put him on formula but I don't see what choice I have.

I'm tempted to put it off for a week whilst I look at other factors including getting his tongue tie reassessed on Friday. I'm still not convinced his attachment is sufficient and so milk transfer isn't ideal which may be causing all his wind and slow weight gain.

And maybe I do need to give the dairy free diet longer to take effect, it's only been 3 weeks and I have been told it can take up to 6 weeks.

I've got an appointment with my HV next Wednesday to have his weight checked and I'm thinking I may delay things until then because if his weight gain has improved then I'm going to feel like at least I'm seeing some results.

If I'm told on Friday that there are no issues with his tongue and then come Wednesday his weight gain is still poor then I will know that formula is the way to go. I feel like I just need to eliminate all other causes and have a complete picture of how DS is before I make the decision that formula is the way to go. Even if I can just make it to 6 months of him being EBF I think I will feel better about it all.

I just know that I will be devastated if I give up breast feeding when it's not necessarily needed.

It also gives me time to get my son used to bottles because we're failing miserably in that sense.

The fact we had such a good night last night has made me doubt things again. This is so hard.

I think that sounds like a good plan of action. Try to have a nice relaxing day together. You’re obviously going through a lot of emotions right now and that can be very draining! Tea and a Christmas movie? :)

Well done on going to the gp, I'm so pleased you are moving forwards. I cried for a few days once I made the change but it was definitely the right decision. If your baby has reflux and allergies, then I would recommend adding carobel to the prescription formula to thicken it. My daughter has one scoop for every 4-7 ounces. I have found that any more than that made it too thick. My daughter was happiest with mam bottles and size 2 teats. But play around with different sizes to get the one that's just right for your baby. As others have said, the trick with filling your bottle with 2/3 boiled water and allow to cool; Then just topping it up the final third with boiling water when you're ready to use it, is a good trick. When I'm out I do this, or even fill it up to the full amount with boiled water if I know it's going to be a few hours before the next feed, so will be the right temperature when I use it. Otherwise I have the tommee tippee perfect prep which is a life saver! But I know not everyone would agree with me about this. I have mam formula dispensers which I take with me when I am out as it will have the formula and carobel ready mixed at the right quantities. I think you also mentioned demand feeding... one thing that will change with formula is that you will know exactly how much they are having at each feed. If they have most of the bottle, then you'll find they will go longer between feeds naturally and so you can start to structure your feeding routine more easily. I went from feeding every hour to every three hours in the space of a few days!

OP, you are absolutely not being unreasonable. Have you been referred to the infant feeding coordinator for some proper breastfeeding support? Is there a lactation consultant local to you? Could you afford a private consultation?

Be kind to yourself. And if you need to give your baby formula, it will be fine. You can combination feed if that works for you, or stop completely. Your baby is loved and cared for and will be absolutely fine. Breastfeeding is a tiny part of parenting.

Hi OP. Have you been made aware of all milk type ingredients to check for in foods? Lactose, whey, etc?

I'm seeing a breast feeding specialist this Friday who offers tongue tie assessment and support for mothers with tongue tie babies, pre and post procedures.

kala - I've only been told to look for milk and nothing else. The selfish thing though is that I can't cope with a diet where so much has to be cut out, that may be awful and lazy of me but I just can't. I just want to be able to go into a supermarket, see something I'd like and buy it and eat it whereas all I do now is pick something up, look at the ingredients and have to put it back down again. I'm finding it so disheartening. I already feel like I'm hardly eating let alone adding more ingredients that I have to avoid. I know some women who have it in them to tackle allergies forcefully and sacrifice their diet for the sake of the baby and I really, really wish I had the strength, time and money to do it, but I just don't

This is meant kindly, but you may have to do this soon anyway if your child has allergies. With all the products available now, avoiding milk and milk products is fairly straightforward. You can ask restaurants too, they're good at checking these days.

If you're not up for checking your food for milk-related ingredients, I don't see how you'll be able to achieve your objective to breastfeed if your child does have an allergy. It does get habitual and easier when you know what to check for, and there are lots of nice treat things which are dairy-free.

I'm seeing a breast feeding specialist this Friday who offers tongue tie assessment and support for mothers with tongue tie babies, pre and post procedures.

Fantastic

This is meant kindly, but you may have to do this soon anyway if your child has allergies.

I know and deep down I know this

The only things I look for are the allergens that are in bold when I look at the list of ingredients, I just assumed anything milk related would be highlighted.

Personally though I think he's reacting to something else in my diet and if his weight gain is still poor then I will admit defeat.

I need to know that I've done all I can to try and view the whole picture, the assessment on his feeding tomorrow and waiting for his weigh-in appointment before starting the formula. I just need to get closure on it all because then I can just accept that he needs the formula and make peace with it.

If I don't wait for those two appointments and instead put him straight on formula I will always by asking me if it was the right decision.

With the new packaging laws, 'milk' will be in bold, so you're probably doing fine. If it wasn't for the suspected allergy, formula would be an easier choice, but it well be that breastfeeding can be sorted out and it may be easier for you in the long run, as regular formula isn't an option. I hope your appointments go well and you get some ideas/strategies that work! Keep focusing on positive moments in your day. Parenting babies always has obstacles, but you'll get though it! You're doing great

Well the plot thickens.....

I have just been to have my DS's tongue function reassessed as part of seeing the "whole picture" and it appears his tongue function has deteriorated since she saw him two months ago.

She works off a score system and he has deteriorated by two points and as she was reading out all the symptoms that I had to agree or disagree with it all pointed to tongue tie problems which can be wrongly be put down to an allergy;

Reluctance to feed
Frustration at the breast
Hiccups
Sneezing
Bad wind
Poor weight gain
Colic/reflux symptoms

She said that she doesn't think he has an allergy from our discussions and he's being wrongly labelled as having one because it explains his symptoms/behaviour.

She said she obviously can't rule out an allergy as she isn't a doctor but it's more likely all tongue tie related. She told me to go home and eat something with dairy in and see if DS has any reaction.

Regarding his tongue it's either a case of I get it snipped again or I move to bottles.