To think a 13 year old boy shouldn't use the ladies loo?

[NameChangeLulu]

NC for this. Recently I was in a situation where a group of people I was in went to a service station. A boy of 13 was told by his mother to come into the ladies with her rather than use the gents as it was safer.

AIBU to think that’s not OK?

@ArcheryAnnie I do actually agree with you believe it or not. But at the moment sometimes men’s toilets just aren’t safe. I think unisex toilets are the way forward, with secure cubicles of course. We have them in local schools here and our hospital and that’s been around for years so I’m guessing there’s been no problems

Sometimes I think some adults forget how it was to be 13

I think that most of the time it is actually because their experience of being 13 is different to yours. I was never "scared" of boys at that age. Perhaps it's because I had older brothers or just because my experience of the boys in my life was not negative. I wouldn't have wanted to, say, share a communal changing room with them but something with cubicals wouldn't have bothered me. Other people's experiences, of course, will have differed.

@Gileswithachainsaw my son does have bladder problems so I guess I’m out case it isn’t as simple. When he needs to go it’s sudden and urgent.

I was not scared of boys. But I was very easily embarrassed. These threads always focus on the boys, and the girls get ignored.

I think unisex toilets are the way forward

I was thinking male, female and a small set of unisex cubicals. Although having purely unisex single ones set up like you see disabled ones would probably work well.

everyone deserves to feel safe.

They do soup

Of course they do.

But letting boys into the girls just makes the girls feel unsafe

Guess I don't understand why people aren't complaining to staff/police (drugs)/councils etc and instead just switching the feelings of unease to the girls instead

Wow - well I suppose that would be a well done to your dh Giles - that's a huge amount of effort to go to to avoid the much easier option of taking her into the men's.

In that situation (if I was a man and was the one taking her that is) I would have just covered her eyes for the privacy of any men possibly using the urinals, and taken her into a cubicle in the men's. I don't think I'd have thought twice about it tbh.

@SoupDragon in our hospital they are all individual unisex cubicles set up like disabled ones. No one has to walk into an unknown space, you just walk into the cubicle, pee and leave. I prefer them as it means I can pee at the same time as ds whose in a locked cubicle that I’ve seen him enter

I was not scared of boys

That's why I put scared in "". I am perhaps the least confident person I know and have always been like that but sharing space where there are cubicals has never been a problem for me so that is what I base my comments on. I know others have had different experiences or feel diffferently.

Dd wouldn't want to go onto the men's white frankly. She's 11 and knows she's not supposed to. There's no way shed go in there. By the time shed finished arguing with dp about it the train would be here anyway.

The reason for all the forethought and making sure we know where loos are etc is precisely to avoid making men feel uncomfortable sharing with tween and teen girls the way one would hope people would consider the feelings of the women

And yes the whole town has complained constantly about these toilets to the council, the police, the station - no one cares. Grown men get told to use staff toilets, women and children use the ladies - disabled is always padlocked unless you have a buggy or can prove a disability

I've been thinking about this and as far as I can recall, I've only had two negative experiences with men - once aged 12 in Tunisia when two tried to kiss me and take me into a shop and once when a man had his penis out sitting next to me on a bus when I was probably 13. Apart from those three men, I've only encountered nice normal ones. I have probably been lucky!!

Interestingly, the only one of my 3 DC who has had a problem with unwanted touching is DS2 when he was in Y5 or 6 and a girl would not stop hugging him. He was the one who got into trouble for pushing her away though. I can only hope, in eternal optimism, that this remains the only problem any of my children have.

Ds is 14 and while most places I feel happy for him to use the gents just some places I feel uncomfortable. I suppose that feeling of them going somewhere you aren't meant to enter to check on them makes them seem more vulnerable. Service stations are one. They just seem like a crossroads of anywheres where anyone could be or go. I suppose any public toilets not in nice shops (eg John Lewis, M and S) make me worry. Irrational possibly! Is it because the mens is such an unfamiliar space to us!! Bus stations, parks, railway and tube stations, subway toilets. There again, I feel a bit vulnerable too.
Even my mum felt uncomfortable sending my dad off on his own in a public toilet. He's disabled, therefore vulnerable. Isn't that what children are considered to be too?

@SoupDragon ds1 was pushed into a wall and kissed by a girl in year 3. The school did FA.

DP is also constantly harassed at work by very sexually aggressive gay men.

I’ve never had any problems yet.

I think this attitude of girls deserve safe spaces but men don’t is causing many people to raise very horrid girls. I’ve been accused of raising a terrible man yet I dread to them how some of these pp dds will turn out!

Hopefully the new generation will sort out these problems better than we have tried to

Not men, boys**

Who's said boys don't deserve safe spaces?

Course they do.

But the ladies isn't it

I totally believe boys and men deserve safe spaces! But making girls' and women's spaces less safe isn't the answer.

And of course the more boys and men use the ladies because it is "safer", the less safe it becomes for everyone.

I hardly see what risk a 13 year old boy is when he's in the Ladies loo... with his mum. FFS.

Mums of girls: if all toilets were unisex, would you be happy sending your DD into the toilets alone, where grown up men are? No? Then why is it OK for boys? They are just as vulnerable.

Giles for a child accompanied by his mother, yes it is.

My son is 7, wears age 13 clothes and speaks and acts as though he is about 11/12. I've been verbally abused for ushering him in to the ladies, in to a cubicle and then telling him to stand at the sink and not move; I've been verbally abused by ushering him in and asking him to stand at the sinks whilst I pee; I've been verbally abused for using the disabled loo to avoid the above. Where do I win?
By sending my 7 year old in to the males toilet with men who are too dangerous to be arouns your daughters? By making my 7 year old stand alone outside a public toilet?

No one is putting a bloody sign on the door welcoming all men and boys! We are saying we appreciate that sometimes boys accompanied by their mother are welcome. It's a big bloody difference.

And 14? 15?

When are they less vulnerable?

Some 13 yr olds are the size of grown men. They don't belong in the Ladies.

Oh and my mum.struggled to pull my brother off me when he went for me. By 15 he was taller than her and she could do nothing when he punched me in the face I had to escape out a window.

So "mummy is here" means nothing tbh

My son is 7 and the age of an 11 year old. Does this mean that by the age of 9 or 10 he is emotionally developed because his height is that of a 13 or 14 year old?

Just because a child is larger than their peers it doesn't equate to emotional awareness in those surroundings. When I feel my son is aware enough to enter the mens room, do what needs done and then leave without interacting with anyone and/or knowing when to signal for help then I will be happy. Whether he is 10 or 13 that makes not a jot of difference.

You don't care whether my son is actually safe as long as your daughter feels safe.

I think this attitude of girls deserve safe spaces but men don’t is causing many people to raise very horrid girls. I’ve been accused of raising a terrible man yet I dread to them how some of these pp dds will turn out!

Of course men and boys deserve safe spaces however that isn't what happens if women and girls are pushed out of theirs. Really cannot see how teaching girls that they have the right to be safe is making them horrid unless of course you do believe women are second class citizens

Baroness how is a boy accompanying his mother to the toilet as the males are unsuitable pushing women out!?

It's your problem to solve sailor not everyone else's dds.

That's the point.

You don't get to decide who should be comfortable with your ds there and that they are unreasonable for being in the ladies where they are supposed to be.

What you do get to decide is how to solve the problem for your family without making others inconfirtavke.