To ask for tangible benefits of Brexit?

[RiskIt4Biscuit]

Some politicians are saying that we're all brexiteers now.

But I can't actually think of any tangible benefits of Brexit, and I think as a brexiteer, I should be able to list at least 3.

So how is Brexit going to make our lives better?

But Leavers assure us that it's not about immigration.

Why does there have to be customs checks at a border?
Its currently 2 different countries, with different currencies, different taxes, different regulations etc everything can just be pre-checked, as it is now. No need for a physical border. The EU is just squeezing us for money.

We could but Govts. from Blair's onwards chose not to. As has already been pointed out.

And more fool them - that is why we are were we are. No one listened and the PM preferred to call ‘bigot’ instead. Big mistake.

No need for a physical border.

Good Friday Agreement - a hard won international treaty. But hey, let's rip that up because some moneyed right wing Tories and UKIPers have had a paddy and want more more more for themselves.

Not that the GFA specifies a hard border - the opposite. My point was about the international treaty. We can't say we want to leave the EU but keep the bits we want. Or we could perhaps if we went for the EEA option, and were willing to pay for it, but May and the three stooges ruled that out. And don't please say it was democracy, because leaving the Single Market, Customs Union, ECJ, Euratom and ripping up the GFA wasn't on anyone's ballot paper.

I still haven't seen any tangible benefits of Brexit, can anyone list them?

some moneyed right wing Tories and UKIPers have had a paddy and want more more more for themselves

Is that what you call the majority of UK voters?

Just spent a couple of hours reading this. Thank you to those posters who have given such well-informed and well-expressed views on the thread.

I love the Brexiteer logic. Gordon Brown once called a bigot a bigot - let's screw the Irish!

Cardinal - I don’t know what logic you are using to come up with that. I was referring to the dismissing of people’s views as bigotry as an example of why we have Brexit in the first place.

Tine4 - Do you think we should pander to bigotry then?

If immigrants sneak in via the ROI they wont be legally allowed to get a job, health care, housing and we can deport them immediately if they are caught. Its called control, not 'build a wall'.

If people can legally enter the UK via RoI, they are not sneaking in.

AFAIK, under the Common Travel Area system, a foreign citizen entering the UK through the Republic of Ireland has an automatic right to remain for three months.

This has nothing to do with the EU.

But is this not the same time frame we could have implemented for EU-nationals - but we chose not to, and that other EU member states have implemented for EU-nationals coming to their countries?

Brexit is the equivalent of chopping off your hand because you've got a chipped nail problem.

Why does there have to be customs checks at a border?
Because that is the standard practice the world over when goods move from one country / tariff area to another.
All of the goods coming into the UK from all over the world - USA, China, Australia, Japan, South Korea, Russian ...... everywhere not EU in fact - have customs clearance done at the border.
Always have done always will do.

Until 1988, every shipment coming in from anywhere in the EU also had to clear customs at the UK border.

In countries like India and the USA, goods can be stopped at State borders (ie within the country) and forced to go through customs and tax checks).

Good arriving in the EU from outside are customs checked when they cross that border.
After Brexit, the border between Ulster and Eire will be the EU border
so there will be customs checks.

Why do Brexiters think it will not happen ?

The Common Travel Area only applies to British and Irish citizens. Everyone else is, in theory, subject to border control.

When I flew to Guernsey they definitely checked my passport, and those of all of my British colleagues.

When I flew to Guernsey they definitely checked my passport, and those of all of my British colleagues

That's for security and was presumably done before you departed. There are no controls when you arrive (although Ireland does check ID on arrival, again for security).

There are no controls when you arrive
Yes there were.
Non EU citizens like me (even though we had flown in from England) had to have our eligibility checked.

Brits have no idea how much of a PITA it will be to leave a customs union

Well good old plummy Boris was in Dublin today for talks (to try and twist the arm of the Irish Foreign Minister in reality). It didn't work. ROI is battening down the hatches now and rightly so. Feck off Boris in other words.

He wants the border issue to be deferred until the next phase i.e. the Trade talks. He must think the Irish Foreign Department and the whole of the Irish Government are idiots. ROI has a veto if the Border issue is not resolved in this phase of talks. They will lose that power to veto in the Trade Phase of talks though, so it is down to the wire really now.

As if ROI would allow a leapfrogging of the Border issue to suit Britain and lose their veto as a result. The gloves are off now I think.

Anyway, in a very diplomatic way of course, he was sent packing. No deal unless the border issue is sorted first, and it looks like ROI will have to use its veto if there is no agreement. That is a difficult position for ROI to be in really, as Britain and ROI have had great diplomatic, political and trade relations since GFA.

What a fkn mess. But there may be interesting times ahead...

You can find a report on IrishTimes.com and Bloomberg.

Of the goods coming into the UK from the rest of the world 98% of it is not stopped at the border for checks. That is because it is pre-cleared. So there is no reason why there has to be a border, other than the EU is trying to force us to stay and pay.

And the movement of people Julie?

Irish people, tourists and legal immigrants can come in, the rest get deported asap.

But you’ve got no border control Julie!

I cannot be arsed with some who just do not understand the implications of a closed border with NI/ROI anymore. Really.

But many mainlanders did not know who or what the DUP are and represent, nor what their Social and Political policies are.

Some indeed did not even realise that NI was part of the UK, many thought it was JUST Ireland, and feck them. Not our problem.

But I'm afraid it is now.

But you’ve got no border control
But we do have landlord checks, doctor checks, school checks, employer checks etc etc to confirm if someone is here legally. Plenty of places to check them, it doesn't just have to be at a border.