Contact your MP about the Gender Recongnition Act

[Babieseverywhere]

If you are concerned with the proposed changes to the law, which allow boys/men into every area, space and club currently allocated as girl/women only read on.

Otherwise close the thread.

"What can we do ?"

Write to your MP

Follow up with a visit to the same MP

Tell them that woman's rights are being elimitated in order to virtual signal to the trans population. That these new rules will make things difficult for the original transsexuals and woman. Whilst literally opening the door to female only spaces to sexual offenders.

Take copies of leaflets that they need to read.

Including the Sage leaflet mentioned below, full of all the basic facts.

The Transgendertrend web address with its alternative school based reports on supporting gender non confirming children without throwing girls under the bus.

Tell your MP that many of the original transsexuals are concerned too. Miranda Yardley being a highly recognized example in this category, who is supportive of women's rights and a Mumsnetter.

Search the Mumsnet Feminist section for other links. The damage to girls's safety in schools, woman's rape centres, woman's prisions, women's sports, women's grants, etc.

It is a never ending list of problems but they all start with the potential amendments to the Gender Recognition Act (GRA) that are being debated by government over the next few months.

Tell your MP to OPPOSE the changes to the Gender Recognition Act

Yes I don’t know where those figures have come from. And the actual figures of a 41% attempted suicide was taken from a total of 27 people.

Hardly representative.

Haas rodgers herman 2014

Ucla school of law

Already have

Got the standard, “you fucking bigot” response

araiwa - where are you getting your statistics from? Could you quote your sources? I have just referred to 2 academic (i.e. peer-reviewed, and from within the last 3 years) papers, and both quote a rate of 41% and 31-50% and Stonewall quotes approximately 50%.

References:

williamsinstitute.law.ucla.edu/wp-content/uploads/AFSP-Williams-Suicide-Report-Final.pdf

www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC5178031/

www.theguardian.com/education/2017/jun/27/half-of-trans-pupils-in-the-uk-tried-to-take-their-own-lives-survey-finds

The reasoning for the attempted or successful suicide needs to be carefully looked at, and I'd need to read the above in detail, plus other unbias reports and studies to come to an informed conclusion regarding that.

You dont know where the figures come from but know it was based on 27 people?

What a riculous statement to make!!

6456 people- largest survey ever at the time

Cuppatea- i think your first link is the report i looked at. to save people searching

How is removing dysphoria as a mental health condition and the support that this entails going to be helpful for suicidal trans people?

Yes, which quotes the following:

"The prevalence of suicide attempts among respondents to the National Transgender Discrimination Survey (NTDS), conducted by the National Gay and Lesbian Task Force and National Center for Transgender Equality, is 41 percent,"

Not 60-80%.

It also goes on to say, "Much remains to be learned about underlying factors and which groups within the diverse population of transgender and gender non-conforming people are most at risk"

Saying, "oh let them self-identify, that'll solve their problems" is naive for both the safety and health of transpeople and women!

Just 27 transgender people in the sucide survey, which claims 50% sucide rate

araiwa

I know exactly where it comes from. I’ve read it. It was a self-selected survey. None of the answers were verified. And even the authors of the survey thought that attempted suicide would also include incidents of self harm.

The figures have been manipulated. Mermaids presented them as being from a sample of 2000 people. The actual sample was 27 people identifying as trans.

I haven’t read the other survey that you have posted, I’ll look now.

I wrote 41%

And when combined with voilence, sexual violence, rejection by family, refusal of treatment , the figure increases

It is emotional blackmail and a well written about abuse tactic to use potential suicide as an argument why someone should do something. It is horrible to use the death of an abused child to try to silence women.

There is also nothing in the proposed legislation which would have aided the minor against parents just as nothing in equality legislation currently aides those with parents who disapprove of their child's sexuality, disability (shall we look at stats of how many disabled kids are abused and murdered by their carers even with equality legislation and how often those parents are not punished? how many of disabled kids commit suicide and the very common belief among disabled kids that they will not survive to adulthood even without life limiting conditions?), sex and how they conform to sex roles...

Sadly, my MP - who previously was great about communication - hasn't responded to anything Iv'e written or had anything local I know of for the last 6 or so months.

More sadly for me is how the fight for sex neutral bathrooms and changing facilities separate from men and women's has disappeared in the last few years to just wanting everyone in the women's. We fought for that for decades, I remember it in my teens, to protect trans people, other dysphoric people, sex role nonconforming people who had horrible experiences in sexed bathrooms of our own sex. These pushes to take over women's spaces is only for and will help a tiny part of the community, it won't do anything for the rest of us. For all the talk of the fight for our rights, most dysphoric people are being ignored.

It's odd - on another thread today someone said people over claiming PTSD meant it would weaken the case for the rest of us which I' don't think I agree with, but in this desire to make it far easier to legally change one's gender (which will really screw up research unless it is legally protected to collect sex data as well), few are pointing out how dismissing and eliminating the need for gender dysphoria will hurt dysphoric people, particularly those who choose not to transition, and put further abuse and pressure on sex role nonconforming people to alter themselves. It's hard enough to help kids being bullied by their peers and adults for this without all the additional pressure going on today.

This is aibu, not the feminist section

Legislation wont do anywhere near enough to help those suffering in this manner.

But many people here arent complaining about that. They are complaining about changing rooms.

I've already contacted them in support.

I'm not being goady. I think it's an important discussion but don't let confirmation bias rule your opinions.

I do find it fascinating that words like 'fetish' and 'virtue signalling' are only acceptable on MN when people are all man hating anti-trans.

Is anyone in or near central Scotland? Would you like to team up to visit some MPs / SMPs and to send out some letters? If so please PM me.

I'll contact them and say I hope they support it. Thank you for reminding me.

The second of those links relies on the survey in the first link.

Using suicide an argument goes directly against the Samaritans advice. But that doesn’t stop activists constantly doing just that.

87% of trans people have comorbid mental health issues.

The new law, which effectively demands affirmation at all costs, precludes those issues from being addressed.

araiwa

You’re probably coming from a good place, but just think for a minute. Most of the women on here are very concerned about the effects on children. You have parents, parents of trans-children, transwomen here, all saying the same thing.

Women who have been informing themselves about this for several years.

Reading the surveys, looking at the statistics. Drilling down into all the data available.

There is a lot of manipulation of figures and an enormous push to silence debate and research.

This is not a knee-jerk reaction. It’s not bigotry.

The propaganda that is being sent into schools is horribly one-sided.

It is effectively creating social contagion. How else can you have 10 children at one time coming out as trans in the same class?

Young girls who are desperate to hide the fact they are female. Who can’t cope with being objectified due to the prevalence of online porn.

There is so much more going on here, then just wanting to be inclusive.

Legislation wont do anywhere near enough to help those suffering in this manner.

Legislation won't help at all. It is just pushing one group of people's opinion of how they acquire their gender onto the rest of the population who do not share it. It will probably make things worse.

Trans peoples rights were equalled in the 2010 Equalities Act. This has worked pretty well and transgender people are protected from losing their jobs when they transition and have to be taken into account when policies are put in place.

This new act is in excess of this act and messes up the definition of sex based discrimination. It takes away the mental health aspect which will mean that some who are probably the most vulnerable do not get the help they need. And whilst signing a piece of paper will be a big step for someone to whom being trans is a big deal, it will be nothing to the opportunist who sees an advantage in it for themself.

I have trans friends. They have a terribly hard life, and aren't going through what they're experiencing just for kicks. They are lovely people, and deserve more compassion and understanding than they get.

So do I. This thread is NOT anti-trans.

The laws that are being proposed may even be detrimental to transfolk like your friends.

The problem is that to stand against it is intepreted as standing against trans people and it's not at all. It's about standing against the ideology being pushed by transactivists, who do not represent all trans people.

The transactivists agenda is pushing gay children into a lifetime of sterilisation and never reaching sexual adulthood (as puberty blockers do as they say - they stop you going through puberty).
80% of DC identifying as the opposite sex grow up to be gay adults, idindifying with their own sex after all. Letting them have easier access to sterilisation and life-changing chemicals is NOT in the best interests of those children. We're creating a generation of ennuchs. But if we speak out about it, we're told we're bigots.

Meanwhile lesbian teenagers are being told they're bigots if they don't accept women with penises as lovers (google cotton ceiling).

I object to the proposed laws not because I am anti-trans but because I am pro-gay people, pro-women's rights, pro-science, pro-trans teenagers being able to explore their identities not being shoved down a signle route for politival rather than scientific reasons.

Not all trans people support the trans rights activists. See www.mirandayardley.com for example.

Araiwa it's very clear that you don't really know what you're talking about. You just swallow manipulative trans propaganda. Perhaps do some more reading from a variety of sources?

You can't just make up that 60 to 80% of trans people will attempt suicide. And as I said, there are other reasons for the higher suicide rate that we are not meant to acknowledge.

So how is a trans woman using the same space as me going to affect me, exactly?

Asking as a woman, and a feminist, with all the biological qualifiers that some people on this thread think mean gender.

It does annoy me when people purport to me protecting my interests, when people have apparently decided that those are what they’ve decided they are. Our sex and gender doesn’t mean we all share the same views!

And apparently there is a ‘female species’. This thread is so full of ill informed nonsense.

Does nobody think that the whole 'we should have transgender toilets, etc' argument just hark back to the deplorable racial segregation? No? Segregation is never okay. That's never the answer. If a trans individual is uncomfortable using either toilet, then they could use a separate disabled facility for their comfort, but if they are comfortable, they should be allowed to use the correct bathroom and never questioned. You have no right to know what might be in someone's pants. Provided they are abiding by law and not harming others, what have you got to complain about. You could have used a cubicle next to a woman with a penis and never even known about it! waits for the MN transphobic rants about women being unable to have penises...despite it being completely 100% possible

You should have some empathy for women who aren't comfortable with it. Why are their feelings less relevant than those of MTF trans people?

Does nobody think that the whole 'we should have transgender toilets, etc' argument just hark back to the deplorable racial segregation? No? Segregation is never okay

No. That's a completely specious argument.