To not understand why people don't understand men cannot be raped by a woman?

[TurquoiseChevrotain]

I've read a lot whenever this comes up on here or elsewhere, that it's 'terrible' and such an outdated view. Why is it? Why can't people understand what rape is? Men can be sexually assaulted by women, but not raped.

Being ‘persuaded’ isn’t freely agreeing is it though, Wine ?

If someone says no then the man carries on, it is rape. Even if they ‘change their mind’ a few minutes later. They still raped in their time in between

@TurquoiseChevrotain so if you have ever said no to sex, any future sex is rape? What if it is a week later?

wine If a woman doesn’t consent to sexual then it is rape. It doesn’t matter when that non-consent occurs. Stop trying to twist it into ridiculous scenarios. You seem desperate for something not to be rape, why is that?

so if you have ever said no to sex, any future sex is rape? What if it is a week later?

you’re being deliberately obtuse now.

If you initially say no to buying something and were persuaded by the seller to do so, that is consent under the law and the contract is valid. You cannot claim you did not consent. You did.

If the seller coerced you in some way that is different.

Fucking hell. Comparing rape to changing your mind at the shops. What a dick

If you are kissing for example and then say no to anything else, if he pursues it physically and you then change your mind, he has still committed sexual assault in the time you said ‘no’ then ‘yes’.

I doubt this has ever happened. No one enjoys being sexually assaulted so much that they decide they like it and suddenly consent.

These unlikely scenarios are right out of the apologists handbook aren’t they

Hang on-you called posters miserable bitter man hating harridans because you didn't care for a perceived tone???
Examples please.

You can’t compare being coerced (persuaded) into sex with buying something from a shop ffs. The two are completely different situations.

Jesus wept.

Winebottle

What's persuasion to you? Getting upset? Annoyed? Irritated? Sitting in another room? Ignoring them? Given them the cold shoulder? Nagging? Bargaining?

I didn’t call anybody anything. I said that the tone made people sound like miserable, bitter harridans. And it often does.

I didn’t call anybody anything. I said that the tone made people sound like miserable, bitter harridans. And it often does.

Lol.

Can I have an example of a post that demonstrates the tone, please?

He has committed sexual assault in the time in between because he did a sexual act that was not consented to.

Timing is everything. What matters is at the point of penetration and throughout the act, there is consent. If that is the case, it is not rape. What went before that is irrelevant.

It is the same in contract law. Was there consent at the point the contract was formed. It doesn't matter how either party felt 5 mins before.

It is perfectly possible to say I'm not in the mood and then in half an hour change your mind.

Contract law is not really analogous except maybe if there was duress?

Or undue influence perhaps.

It is perfectly possible to say I'm not in the mood and then in half an hour change your mind.

You didn't say change your mind. You said persuaded. What constitutes persuasion to have sex, in your opinion?

Jellycatspyjamas

In Scottish law rape is defined as penetration of the mouth, vagina or anus. Men can therefore clearly be raped by women under Scots law

That is not correct. The Scots equivalent Act also requires a penis for it to be rape. For a rape by a woman it would have to be a rape by a trans woman who had retained a penis or a rape by a female to male trans man who had a surgically constructed penis.

If a person (“A”), with A's penis—

(a)without another person (“B”) consenting, and

(b)without any reasonable belief that B consents,

penetrates to any extent, either intending to do so or reckless as to whether there is penetration, the vagina, anus or mouth of B then A commits an offence, to be known as the offence of rape.

Timing is everything

No. Consent is everything. HTH

Why are you trying to excuse certain types of rape? And comparing rape with buying stuff in shops and signing a contract makes me think there’s something wrong with your brain

Wine

Timing is everything. What matters is at the point of penetration and throughout the act, there is consent. If that is the case, it is not rape. What went before that is irrelevant.

Pop over to the Harvey Weinstein thread. Listen to him ‘persuading’ a model to come to his hotel room. Then tell us he’s not a rapist because she may have ‘changed her mind’ during this persuasion.

Fucks sake.

You didn't say change your mind. You said persuaded. What constitutes persuasion to have sex, in your opinion?

Anything other than force or threats of force.

If you don't want to have sex and he storms off angry and then you decide to give in and have sex, it is not good behaviour on his part but he has done nothing illegal.

So those stories in the press horny that I linked to where a woman has actually been convicted of rape (and others have too) have the courts for it wrong then? Are you saying the courts don't understand the law or that the papers have printed bullshit stories and some poor innocent women are languishing in prison cells for wrongly being convicted of rape?

The case linked was to a case of a woman being art and part guilty of the rape, by men ,of another woman. She held the victim down and encouraged the male rapists.

you missed the part about reasonable belief and consent

this is why we need to start from an affirmative consent/desire point

@Winebottle what if he says you clearly don't love me, if you love me you would, etc. etc.