If a new referendum on Brexit was announced..

[bbcessex]

Would you be up in arms about that?
Discussing last night.. I think given the margins in the last vote and the (being charitable) confusion and uncertainty over the Brexit plans, a new referendum would generally be accepted.

DH (remainer) thinks a re-vote is not constitutional & would cause uproar (amongst all).

Who is unreasonable ?

We should have another referendum once a deal is on the table and the full details are know. Voters should be able to say whether they accept the deal, or wish to leave with no deal, or keep the status quo.

The problem with the first one is that for many people it wasn't clear what they were voting for. My Mum for example voted leave because she wanted a Norway style arrangement and believed that is what we would get. Having a final referendum on the final deal would settle the argument once for all and the country can start healing its divisions and move on.

gin if only we could change things in the EU - so much about it is good. But we tried and failed, although admittedly we did send Cameron as negotiator.

if only we could change things in the EU - so much about it is good

Tell that to the people of Southern Europe.

And we talk about the young vote as if every young person wanted to remain when we know that isn't true.

Even the children in our primary school voted to leave in the mock referendum that took place.

We might find the very young sees life very differently from the noisy students of today. The very young have ideas of their own and might build something entirely different into the future.

So if the vote came back 52:48 in favour of remain, how do you decide which result to use?

We elect Parliament to make these decisions.

There are good things about the EU of course there is.

It began with the best of intentions.

If the EU had remained a friendly trading relationship with some joint legal agreements we wouldn't be in this mess now.

But it didn't. It had ideas far and beyond simply trading and being friends. Slowly but surely the laws came in, slowly but surely the currency was introduced, slowly but surely the passport controls were removed, slowly but surely whole cultures were changed beyond recognition, and jobs were sold to those that charged less for their time. Whole industries disappeared from communities.

No one would have voted for joining the huge super state that the EU has become openly controlled by Germany back then...and no one is voting for it now.

I would have more respect for any politician that turned round now and said "Look, this isn't progressing as we want and is proving to be much more complicated. Let's cancel the whole thing and work at getting what we wanted adopted generally in the EU."
But that will never happen.

But Cameron half-heartedly (being very pro-EU) did this and they told him to bugger off and even those were very small concessions. The UK has had years to try and reform the UK and nothing has been done, in fact it has got even more dictatorial and arrogant, bossing around the smaller states, acting with impunity whilst the largesse to the EU elite has increased.. Besides, there are very few UK politicians who are genuinely interested in seeing a reformed EU or seeing Brexit take place. Most politicians are career politicians who benefit hugely from the UK being inside the EU and do not want to rock the boat.

The referendum was not constitutional - we don't have a referendum based system. It was advisory, and there seems to be no consistent view on what version of Brexit people thought they were voting for - because it was an apparently simple question with multiple possible outcomes, pretty much all of them outwith the UK's control.

My dad would be grumpy about it. He's 80 and is managing to make a complete disconnect between the fact my job is at risk (and most of the tasks that make up my job are going to continental Europe) and Brexit. I'd give his opinion as much consideration as he gave mine.

I think it would send a very dangerous message and confirm to Brexit voters that there is an elite who look down on them and dismiss their issues and concerns and walk over them roughshod

This.

Also - remember the many Brits who live and work in continental Europe - who are most directly affected by all of this and were not allowed to vote!

shifty

What the EU has done for the UK?

What exactly has the EU done for the UK? Name them please.

Precious little, which is why we are in this situation.

I would dearly love to know why you would want to remain with the EU? Even after their disgraceful conduct and really quite revolting bullying behaviour. Why do you still want to stay in the EU after this?

Its not undemocratic to have a another referendum, it would be undemocratic just completely ignoring the outcome or push through with brexit if the British public didnt want that, with such a small margin in the previous referendum its pretty undemocratic to carry on with such a big change that such a high percentage of the British public didn't want without confirming the decision. Another referendum just confirms the decision of the public, it allows them the final say. If the British public want to leave then a second referendum would confirm that, if they have now changed their minds then it will say remain. Its not ignoring what the public want, its confirming what they want. If the second referendum said remain then that's what the British public want and carrying on with brexit would be carrying on with something the British public dont want.
Brexit is a huge change for Britain and multiple referendums would be the only democratic way really to determine that its truly what the British public wants.

sandy

They do not have rights to vote in the UK unless they live here. Why not cast a vote to everyone anywhere.

If they choose to go and live in another country and that is their choice. You can not have your cake and eat it. I don't expect to consider the opinions of every last person that ever lived in the UK. Where would it stop?

If you care about your country and you support it through paying taxes and investing your life/energy/time/money then you have the right to vote about its future. If you are sitting on the beach in a hot country somewhere and not investing in the UK you do not have the right to decide its future.

My position is that it was an advisory referendum and it is up to our elected representatives to decide whether the best interests of the country to go ahead or not. That's what they are for.

Which they did.

They had a vote in Parliament & they voted to follow the result of the Ref & Leave the EU.

So your position has been satisfied.

I know. But there is no reason why, if it looks as if the only deal we're going to get is either a bad deal or no deal that they should not reconsider. I am not saying they should, or I want them to. Just that it is an option. Which, if people are considering further referendums, should be thought about.

I really can't believe we are still having this conversation and people are still nursing desires to overthrow the democratic decision to leave.

I don't understand this utter devotion to the EU.

Where is the same devotion to this country?

One must wonder how badly the EU would need to behave before the staunch remainers would be accepting of the decision to leave.

Perhaps they are mixing up the EU with Europe and our relations with the whole of Europe as a whole.

It is awful to read some posts that still think we could simply cancel the result it and simply carry on as before. Or the pleb insults because they didn't get the answer they were looking for. It is unnecessary.

I’ve already given you the answer to that in my post at 9.37 - that there was nothing written into the EU Referendum Bill requiring an action on the outcome of the vote

What would have been the point of having a flipping referendum if that's the case?

There might have been a lot of things 'not written in to it' . Does that mean: "feel free to insert what you wish between the lines, especially if you disagree with the result?"

Nowhere in the EU Ref' Bill does it say that the result should only be taken as advisory.

I find that pov quite insulting tbh Littlebird. It's not about considering the opinions of every last person that ever lived in the UK; it's about considering the views of those of us who possess a British passport and British citizenship!

Lots of British citizens who live abroad pay taxes in both countries and many are not all sitting on the beach all day - believe it or not, some of them are actually representing British interests abroad. Just because you live in one country, doesn't mean that you don't love and care intensely about homeland, about its prosperity and economy, and about your children's potential future in that country.

rexit was not what I voted for (irrelevent) BUT I am sick to death of the anti-Brexiteers - we had a referendum, the result was shite BUT thats the price you pay for democracy. You cant keep having referendums Nicola Sturgeon are you listening until you get the result you think people want.

This!

What would have been the point of having a flipping referendum if that's the case?

It was held because David Cameron was worried about the Tories falling prey to UKIP.

Nothing more than that.

The referendum was a bit like signing a blank cheque. I think it would be entirely appropriate to have a second referendum when the terms and conditions of the UK leaving are known.

Shifty - 46.5 million people were eligible to vote. 33.6 million people voted. 17.4 voted to leave, 16.1 voted remain. In my point of view the remaining 12.9 million who didn't voted were happy with status quo.

Why assume 12.9 people were happy with the status quo? The fact that they didn't vote is more likely to mean that they didn't give a toss either way, still I am sure you know what's best.

Another referendum would be stupid as most people seem to still be ill informed on what the EU has done for the UK and especially for the plebs and rural areas outside the hubs, who voted leave. I fear people would be silly to fault and vote leave again despite the animosity this current and future situation is causing for the people in the UK and abroad.

What a load of patronising, ignorant and offensive rubbish. By plebs presumably you mean the working class who are too white, too ignorant and too racist to know what is best for them? They should know their place and doth cap to the likes you and other intellectual superiors I suppose. What a shame that you might have to pay council estateTracey £3 per hour more to clean you house than you currently pay Polish Magda.

I do think there is a strong case for a referendum on the terms of leaving the EU.
So basically do we go ahead with a particular plan or do we remain after all.

Still hoping it will happen personally. I do this TM is becoming increasingly alarmed at the prospect of a calamitous brexit happening on her watch. Cameron managed to wash his hands of it, fortunately for him

Nowhere in the EU Ref' Bill does it say that the result should only be taken as advisory.

It doesn’t have to say that it is advisory. The fact that there is no requirement within the Bill to enact the outcome of the referendum is enough to demonstrate that it is advisory.

Without a requirement to enact either a Leave or Remain vote in a specified way means that it was just an expensive opinion poll.

It was Cameron and the Government that said they would act on the outcome.