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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

Strip clubs & Stag dos

784 replies

NotInMyBackYard1 · 08/10/2017 10:44

DH went on a stag do in the summer, one night away at a weekend, obvs he came back tired and hungover but said he'd had a good time and didn't go to bed until 630am. I asked which bars stayed open until then but was told they do in Liverpool (?) obviously I am very naive!
Have since found out they were all at a lap dancing club without the stag - he'd gone to bed at midnight. AIBU to think he's bloody disgusting and to have lost all respect for him - for lying by omission and for visiting a lap dancing club in the first place.

OP posts:
GirlDownUnder · 09/10/2017 10:50

For every comment about not having respect for a man that views women as commodities, there's a dancer making the most of her status as a 'commodity'.

Because some women have successfully found a way exploit the system that exploits them, does not mean the system is not broken.

user1474550185 · 09/10/2017 11:01

I wouldn't necessarily have a problem with DH going to a strip club (although I really don't think he would). I would have a problem with him not telling me about it in advance or as soon as I asked him about the evening if it was a spontaneous thing.

bakewelltarty · 09/10/2017 11:09

I think my DH probably saw much more on the beach in Majorca this year.

I think it's hard to claim women are being 'objectified' when the only difference seems to be the exchange of money.

Nancy91 · 09/10/2017 11:13

So you are renting the bodies of performers on stage in the theatre too? That's odd wording, but if you'd call it that then fine!

NoLove, I said I would respond when I was on my break, chill! I get that you think that these clubs negatively impact others, but I don't think they influence men's views on women all that much. By the time they are old enough to visit a strip club they will have already seen women being treated as objects on tv, magazine covers, music videos etc. If they are going to treat women badly then that is already hardwired into them, and they will do it regardless of the existence of strip clubs. They are adults, their views have already been formed. Strippers may as well make money from them. The men aren't going to change now!

I think of stripping as more like acting - it's pretending to be interested in a man for the duration of a dance. I think most of the men go there out of loneliness. They want to feel attractive. I think deep down everyone wants attention and to feel attractive. I don't always think their intentions are more sinister than that.

Could someone address my previous post about this being like the child labour and exploitation in the clothing industry? Why not boycott all clothes shops because a few exploit children?

NoLoveofMine · 09/10/2017 11:13

The beach is women and men dressing in appropriate beachwear. Strip clubs are providing women naked for men's enjoyment, in every city, for men to go whenever they please, fostering a culture in which women and girls exist for the sexual gratification of men and boys. As I keep outlining, this impacts many women and girls in many ways.

Wanderlust1984 · 09/10/2017 11:15

I've already admitted to paying for a dance, why am I not being slated for this with all the other men, just because I'm a lady? 🤔

My bar is not set low, I have an amazing relationship where we can actually share and tell each other everything without the risk of one another kicking off. (Plus he's fit as fuck... oops am I "objectifying"??)

Ahhh was wondering when open would be brought into this, I'm sure none of your partners wank off to it... 😂

GirlDownUnder · 09/10/2017 11:16

The exchange of money is changes the exchange because it becomes about buying consent / a woman's body.

Like the exchange of money is the difference between a ONS and prostitution.

Witsender · 09/10/2017 11:17

Surely the entire point is the exchange of money? That isn't a side issue!

Wanderlust1984 · 09/10/2017 11:18
  • porn
BertrandRussell · 09/10/2017 11:18

"Why not boycott all clothes shops because a few exploit children?"

Because it is possible to shop ethically. Many people do.

NoLoveofMine · 09/10/2017 11:19

NoLove, I said I would respond when I was on my break, chill! I get that you think that these clubs negatively impact others, but I don't think they influence men's views on women all that much. By the time they are old enough to visit a strip club they will have already seen women being treated as objects on tv, magazine covers, music videos etc. If they are going to treat women badly then that is already hardwired into them, and they will do it regardless of the existence of strip clubs. They are adults, their views have already been formed. Strippers may as well make money from them. The men aren't going to change now!

Thanks for replying. Did you read the examples of harassment girls from my school have received from men going to strip clubs? The examples of harassment being specific to the strip club and using the strip club (strip clubs generally) not only to demean girls but also remind us of our true worth? Even aside from that, their existence is a reminder to me that no matter what I do, my primary worth to many men will be my body, that men see me primarily as a sex object there for their entertainment.

Also, another poster said every man she knows has been to a strip club and this is part of "professional culture". Can you see how this is hugely detrimental to women? Their male colleagues go off to a strip club to socialise after work, bond, discuss work, this probably leads to them fostering closer relationships which have a huge impact when promotions etc come into play. Also, it makes it more difficult for women in these fields to further their careers, as well as many feeling demeaned by colleagues who can just slip off to a club to watch naked women dancing. There are so many ways these clubs negatively impact women and girls.

As I said, from a young age I've hated them for how they make so many girls feel. Women and girls are demeaned and objectified in many ways, it's inherent in culture I feel, but I think the normalisation of strip clubs is a big part of that. If they didn't exist this would be one step towards women and girls actually being seen as equals, not sex objects for men and boys to enjoy. Also on age - boys my age and younger are well aware of the existence of strip clubs. Just because they're not old enough to go yet, it doesn't mean they don't impact upon how some of them see women and girls, which many make very clear.

NoLoveofMine · 09/10/2017 11:21

Also I don't "think" these clubs negatively impact others. I know they do. I know they've negatively impacted me and many girls at my school.

HostaFireAndIce · 09/10/2017 11:24

there is no difference- a commodity is a commodity

Therein lies the problem, I suppose. The existence of strip clubs makes paying to look at someone's tits seem like a legitimate commodity like 'lawyering' and cleaning. In my opinion it shouldn't be.
Noloveofmine is correct that the problem with 'as long as everyone's consenting, just don't go if you don't like it' etc is that it does impact on women's position in society. It's not as straightforward as saying, if you are happy to do your own cleaning, then don't hire a cleaner.

Wanderlust1984 · 09/10/2017 11:25

Your "true worth"?? Fuck listening to lowlife twats girl, you know your true worth and it isn't what's coming out of their twatty mouths

Wanderlust1984 · 09/10/2017 11:27

Again, I'll add that I've had a dance. But I would never speak to anyone in a sexually demeaning manner, that's just a twat's trick

HostaFireAndIce · 09/10/2017 11:28

Ahhh was wondering when porn would be brought into this, I'm sure none of your partners wank off to it...

Oh, and this is the flipside of the 'cool wives' argument. Anybody on these threads who believes their partner does not wank off to porn or secretly at least desire to go to strip clubs, if not actually go, is inevitably portrayed as naïve/controlling/prudish, if not all three.

Sallystyle · 09/10/2017 11:34

So you are renting the bodies of performers on stage in the theatre too?

Are they getting their breasts out and grinding around men so they can get their sexual kicks?

I thought we were paying to see their talent and enjoy a nice show. Not so we can get off on their naked body parts.

Ahhh was wondering when open would be brought into this, I'm sure none of your partners wank off to it...

I know, it blows your little mind that there are some men who genuinely don't agree with the sex industry doesn't it? Men can happily wank without 'the visual props' as well. Just so you know.

Many men understand the problems with porn, they realise they don't always know which woman has been coerced into it, which one has been abused and so on and just can't bring themselves to get turned on by it. Too many men don't care, but there are those out there who do.

I know it's a shocking concept for you that some men have an understanding of the issues around porn and they don't allow their dicks to rule them.

clumsyduck · 09/10/2017 11:37

Eughh hate the boys will be boys bullshit "there hard wired to do this "

So are women you know , I fancy men all the time that if I was single I would very much like to see naked

Maybe il see if dp wouldn't mind actually , I mean if I just get them to gyrate with their dicks in my face , while I have a good perv over the six packs , I wouldn't touch them or anything so it's not cheating .

Or not .

Gross

Wanderlust1984 · 09/10/2017 11:38

Yeah ok Wink

HostaFireAndIce · 09/10/2017 11:40

Yeah ok

QED. Wink

Sallystyle · 09/10/2017 11:47

Yeah ok

As I thought, you have nothing valid to add to the discussion. ;)

midnightmisssuki · 09/10/2017 11:48

i take offence to the poster who said to be prepared for the 'cool wives onsalught' - i am one of 'these' and i hate that there is some label. I am not a cool wife - i am just a wife who is not offended by them - must we label everyone/thing these days? Confused

OP - if you dont like lap dancing clubs, does your DH know this? If he knows how you feel and still went, then yes, YANBU. He shouldnt have gone. Have a conversation with him and explain why you are upset. Take it from there.

Wanderlust1984 · 09/10/2017 11:48

And I'm not a "cool wife", nor was I an ex "cool wife". I married early 20s, genuinely believed my husband didn't wank to porn etc. When I found out he did my world came crashing down (he cheated also). Now a decade later I do realise that life is so much more happy and chilled when you have a DP that you can actually share everything with.

NoLoveofMine · 09/10/2017 11:49

Your "true worth"?? Fuck listening to lowlife twats girl, you know your true worth and it isn't what's coming out of their twatty mouths

I have to exist in this culture, in which many men and boys see all girls and women as sex objects, in which we're bombarded with messages that our worth is male sexual gratification and strip clubs are a major part of that. I have no choice about having to go to school near one, live in a society where there are countless such establishments, where women are seen as such by men, the girls who've been harassed by men going to one had no choice but to be subject to such harassment and have strip clubs used to demean them - a reminder, as I said, that's their worth, no matter what they achieve. I have found them demeaning for years and continue to, and know I'm not alone amongst girls I know.

NoLoveofMine · 09/10/2017 11:59

Maybe il see if dp wouldn't mind actually , I mean if I just get them to gyrate with their dicks in my face , while I have a good perv over the six packs , I wouldn't touch them or anything so it's not cheating .

Quite. Or if there were clubs in every city for women to go and watch young men dancing naked, where women could head to on work nights out, where women went on nights out together, where a woman could head into after work for a quick drink or after the pub later on, where men were expected to go along with their girlfriends to and have other naked men dance for them both and be completely fine with it lest they be accused of being prudes, where teenage boys grew up constantly seeing these clubs knowing that's how women ultimately saw them all, with adult women taunting them when on their way to such clubs about how they could work there one day, where teenage girls grew up knowing there were clubs all over the place they'd be able to go to watch naked men dancing soon enough. The whole culture behind it is so insidious and damaging to so many women and of course girls growing up.