Angry angry angry

[Sounbelievablydull]

Dd and her boyfriend live with us- they are both mid twenties- supposidly saving for their own place.
We charge minimal rent £100 pm each ( London) that includes everything food toiletries etc
They help out a bit not much cook dinner once a week
Other than that that not much else
This evening dd has flounced into the room where I'm watching to brandishing her boyfriends shirt complaining that I have somehow washed it inadequately so it has strange stains on it
She later came back in to show me that I'd washed it with a pen in a jacket of hers which had leaked
She's furious his shirt is ruined by me! And she will now have to buy him another to replace it- message is I should - I think??
yes I did go and get washing from their room because if I don't it piles up into a stinking pile
I also do their ironing - I feel really angry and am awaiting the onslaught of advice telling me what an idiot I am bring it on

My son lives at home after graduating...at the moment he only earns about 16k( this will rise to 21 after first 6 months and has just bought his first car...no public transport to get to his job and a 24 mile round trip all on rural lanes so essential to have reliable car.I don't charge him anything but have asked to see evidence of saving a rental amount. At the moment he saves £300 pm for "rent" and £200 towards his car loan. He does quite a bit of gardening, hoovering and washing up etc and keeps his own bathroom, and bedroom clean. I do do his washing but he irons his own work shirts and usually does some of his dad's too. Car should be paid off in 12 months after which he will be saving £600 into his rent fund( mortgage deposit fund!) He shows me his savings statements every few months so I know HE is taking responsibility and not taking the piss!
Your young lodgers ARE taking the piss...get a handle on it now before you get so resentful that you have that stroke

My answer to the pen in the pocket. Well why didn't you check the pockets before you put it in the wash?
My dh did it once with his work trousers (he's in construction so I just chuck all his work clothes in together) he ended up with ink marks all over his high vis shirts and his work trousers. Then I got the "you've ruined my work stuff" replied with "no YOU left a pen in the pocket. I haven't got time to go round emptying pockets before putting a load on. Your trousers your responsibility not mine"

He's not left one in there since.

Definetly stop doing there washing. From being a teen I stuck my own stuff in the washer

In future they would be doing their own washing, ungrateful sods

I wouldn't do their washing, but sounds like you are taking it upon yourself to do that and they haven't asked you to. With regards to everyone saying "can I come live with you, what a bargain etc."-this is her CHILD not a stranger so she's helping her out, you're not supposed to make money out of your kids unless I'm missing something. Can you just say you're struggling for money now and would appreciate if they started paying more and helping out more?

Tell them to shape up or ship out.Cheeky articles!

As others have said you should take this as an opportunity to establish boundaries. Offer them the following options:

1 - They continue to pay £200.00 per month but they have to 'earn' that discount by doing all the cleaning in the house (excluding areas you dont them to go e.g. your bedroom) and they do the bulk of the cooking. They have to buy their own food and toiletries etc and doing their own washing and ironing.

2 - They pay full market rate (for your area) for the room plus bills plus whatever their share of the shopping costs and for that you continue to do everything you have been doing.

3 - You split the difference between options 1 and 2 and increase the rent but not to full market rate, they buy their own shopping (you allocate them a cupboard in the kitchen, shelves in the fridge etc) and you divide the household chores between you.

Whatever option they go for you should decide when you want them to be moved out by - 3 months? 6 months? A year? Whatever it is make it clear it's not negotiable and they should plan accordingly.

The point about having a child is that we as parents should be assisting them into independence. We are not helping them if we say 'oh we won't ask for reasonable keep money', neither are we helping them if we don't insist that they do work around the house. When I went to uni many years ago I was capable of caring for myself . I met so many who had no idea; people who just carried on wearing dirty clothes as they didn't know how to wash them, one young man who used a whole packet of washing powder in one wash as he had no idea how much to use, people who couldn't cook , filthy ,stinking rooms with cups that had grown their own life forms in them. Now you might say that is par for the course but eventually we all need to get real . Does anyone really want an incompetent 40 year old in their life? When I lived at home I paid 'keep', I saved some of what was left over and had very little left, but that is life . I've met so many young people who feel that at age 25 they should have exactly the same as their parents have and preferably without earning it. New phone, car, house with every sort of technology that is the newest sort , sorry but we have to work for everything and be reasonable in our plans.

I have a friend who is starting a masters in London next year. He would happily pay you £100 a month and expect no washing, ironing, bed making.

Basically he wants a bed for 2-3 nights a week. Oh and he makes a mean Yorkshire pudding.

You deffo need to set boundaries. Leave their washing alone- just shut the door in it, they need to deal with it. Maybe allocate them 2 days in the week that they can use the washing machine so it's not left full of damp clothes when you need it. Good luck!

Someone upthread was very perceptive. I missed it but why would your daughter feel she should buy the shirt?

If they are planning to stay in/near London, then I think at some point they will move into private rented. Just guessing but from what you have said, it does not sound likely they will be able to buy in the foreseeable future. So unless there is something I don't know, don't feel you have to let them stay for that reason.

If you really want them to leave, which would be fair enough, just tell them you think they would be happier in their own place. If you are prepared to give them another chance, sit them down and tell them that shirtgate highlighted some ongoing problems. Point out what a good deal they get and make an agreement about changes needed, then see how they go with it.

I will investigate the true damage of pengate this evening
I wouldn't bother - honestly. If she mentions it again then tell her that it was an accident, but seeing as the laundry service has been free they can afford to replace the shirt. In future you won't be doing any further laundry for them so it won't happen again.

I do have a very nice dh but he doesn't like scenarios of conflict but I will enlist him to back me up
Make sure you do. It's very lazy to expect you to be the bad cop.

They are not all bad they do work hard professionally
All the more reason they should be moving out then!

I am very anal about housework as someone said earlier but surely I have the right to be? It is my house and I like it to be clean and tidy
So put rules in place about chores and ensuring that they have shared responsibility for cleaning communal areas.

I can only ask dd about saving don't feel I have any rights over the bf he is in a very lowly paid training post at the moment*
OK, stop a moment. This man is living under YOUR roof and paying a pittance. You absolutely DO Have a right to know what he is saving - and if he's not willing to share that information, then he needs to pack his shit and find some other sucker to sponge from.

We have drifted into this whole situation without any boundaries or goals as you have pointed out. When he moved in it was only meant to be on a temporary basis and we haven't reviewed how things are going
Give them both a deadline - don't ask them, TELL them. 3 months is reasonable - 6 if you absolutely have to. If they complain they need more time, then ask them what they have been doing for all the time they have already been living with you? It's not a doss house and you need to make it clear that you cannot afford to keep subsidising them.

Also make it clear for the remainder of the time they are here they must pull their weight with chores, and that you won't be spoken to as if you are a member of staff. Point out that they are adults - so it's time they starting acting like it.

Do they do professional jobs that will enable them to afford to stay in London?

I think you have to divorce yourself from the point of it being your DD.
If it was a paying lodger that wasn't your DD, would you still go into their room and take their washing? I bet you £100 you wouldn't.

So don't do it to her and her BF either. They're adults!

Yes it's your house. But it's your DD too - you brought her up, surely she knows how anal you are about housekeeping and washing and so on - surely you made sure that she was able to do things to your standard as well?

What it boils down to is that you have to give them their privacy, but if you can't stand that they leave washing piling up then either tell them to get it done, or get them to move out. Whatever you do, STOP invading their space (yes it's in your house and yes they pay you peanuts but it's still their space) and stop doing their laundry forthwith.

The girlfriend isn't being anything to her boyfriend. SHE left the pen in her jacket which is probably why she feels she needs to replace the shirt. It isn't about being the little woman.

I think it is key to work out the finances here. If you are subsidising them, and you are more than doing that, then it is reasonable to want to know. If they don't like that and want privacy, they can leave.

Have they established how much they need to save, allowing for housing costs to potentially rise? Have they looked at the rental market and actually viewed a few places rather than just looked online, to get a sense of what they could afford? This could be a reality check for them. It is easy to think somewhere looks ok online when it really isn't. They need to work out what rent they would actually be paying to get somewhere livable, and whether they can afford that. Ditto with deposit and mortage payments if that is what they plan.

I suspect they will find that either a) they can't buy in the foreseeable but can rent in which case they should or b) they cannot either rent or buy in which case you can all reassess what is actually going on here.

My plan when my children get older is to charge them so
Etching towards their keep and to then work out an additional sim that they have to pay into a savings account which will be jointly in theirs and myself or husbands name and this will be to save for a deposit. As much as I love them they are not living with me forever and I won't be clearing up after them! Xxxx

I read that column in the Sat Guardian Family section where she has all four of her grown up children living with her and every week shout 'No! No! No!' at the paper- she is such a soft touch.
You cannot continue enable this behaviour.

PS: Maybe come back to me in 10 years, but I bloody hope I'm as strong on this is I think I'll be.

Can I move pin please for £100 and have my washing and ironing done?
I don't smoke or drink much and am clean living.

Should have said 'move in' !

Bless you, you sound like a lovely mum!

You have every right to be angry but I would just put this aside. Calmly apologise for ruining the shirt and explain that from now on they will need to do their own washing. Also say that as the cost of living is going up, shopping, washing powder, etc you need to put the rent up for them both as £150 each a month. Then put it up again in 6 months. They are having a laugh with the way they are treating you at the moment.

Honestly I would give them 3 months notice to find somewhere else. They can rent a room together elsewhere and pay the going rate.

And if she brings it up again, ask your DD why she needs to replace her partners shirt? Partner should be buying his own shirt.

Set a reasonable amount for the rent-
work out your monthly outgoings for - energy, mortgage, insurance, broadband, food (if you plan on sharing cooking), council tax, water, etc.
Divide by the number of adults in the house.
That is the amount they should BOTH be paying. It will be far less than paying a commercial rent. Show them the working out. Ask them what they think would be fair for them to pay, if not the sum arrived at, why not?
NEVER do their washing again and agree a housework rota.

Honestly I would give them 3 months notice to find somewhere else

That would be just before new years eve.

I think you do need to look at how you feel about it .

What would make it work better.. What can they do in the house then expect it to be done..I feel you have been a bit of a mytr but actually like having them around.

Increase they rent..If you don't need the money you can save it then when you truley have had enough they will have a deposit if they don't save it.

I hope you have sat them down and talked with them about how it's going. I would charge them more and discuss basic cleanliness standards and the amount you expect them to pitch in (cleaning, gardening, cooking)