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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

To feel uncomfortable about this

454 replies

user1471558723 · 20/09/2017 14:51

My mother is in her late eighties, she lives alone and looks after herself. I live some distance away but speak to her most days. I do her shopping and visit her once or twice a week.
She attends a craft club once a week, it's attended by people of all ages.
A much younger lady began dropping my mother at home each week, this then developed into her offering to collect my mother. This lady let's call her Anne is very kind she has according to my mother an unsupportive partner, a large family, primary school age children, grown up children and grand children. She looks after them all and does not have a job. Anne also looks after her elderly father who has terminal cancer.
I was delighted when Anne offered my mother regular lifts to and from the craft club. But now the friendship has intensified. Anne is visiting my mum several times a week. She is "helping" my mother with all the administrative work that I used to do, sorting out insurance etc.
I've told my mum there is no need to involve Anne in all this as she obviously is a woman with commitments of her own. My mum insists Anne wants to do everything she does.
My mum is very well placed financially and reading between the lines life has not been so kind to Anne.
I would really like to think that Anne is a lovely lady who has found a friendship with my mother despite the 45 year age gap. I'm just a bit uncertain and would value other people's opinions.

OP posts:
Nanny0gg · 21/09/2017 13:31

Don't forget that there are two types of LPoA - one for finance and one for health.

OP needs to get both (emphasise that it means you can guarantee that your mum's wishes will be carried out, no matter what)

steppemum · 21/09/2017 13:45

I think I would go and see your mum, sit down and talk it through with her.
I would also ask mum if you can speak to Anne.

If Anne is genuine and you say to her that you are concerned that mum is handing over finances and maybe that is crossing a boundary, then Anne will back off and stop doing it.

StaplesCorner · 21/09/2017 17:47

this was done to both my Aunt and a neighbour. in the case of my Aunt, our "Annie" convinced her that she was the only one who could help, none of us could, we were useless. She particularly hated my Aunt attending any family events so made my Aunt believe she could not leave the house without "Annie".

In both instances "Annie" got the house and every penny. I'm not even sure that's what the Annies set out to do to be honest, but once they saw the chance ... Sad

Carouselfish · 21/09/2017 17:50

Knock this on the head NOW. Locally, there is a woman around the same age as 'Anne' who has made a career out of this and infiltrated the lives, bank accounts and wills of at least three old ladies.

StaplesCorner · 21/09/2017 17:54

Just remembered, I used to send the housebound old lady over the road a christmas card with a picture of my then toddlers each year. One day she had a serious stroke and I called the ambulance and police as we could not find her son and she needed urgent help. The son then warned me off helping her.

A few months later her home help came and knocked on my door in tears again wanting help for the lady she wanted me to call the police again as the door was blocked and there was no response, looked like she'd been burgled too. Anyway, all was ok on that day but soon after she died. Son still kept warning me off until she died, even though I'd only had that contact twice during her illness. It was the cards he objected to I think.

I have seen it from both sides, the son in that case was just a twat but you sound lovely OP.

IFinishedTheBiscuits · 21/09/2017 17:54

I haven't got time to RTFT, but I've recently reported neighbours of ours for taking advantage of an elderly gentleman- they've isolated him and took him to the solicitor and got him to sign his house over - I assume in a will. He's disabled and has fallen out with family.
Unfortunately he thinks they are wonderful so there's not a lot that can be done... but we know from past experience that they're dishonest.
I see it from both sides because my job is about getting communities looking after each other more. But I'd be concerned.

Cubtrouble · 21/09/2017 18:00

It would be lovely to think Anne is a genuine, kind, harassed mother who sees nothing but a friendly older lady to have a bit of peace and quiet with.

From personal experience there are people out there who see older vulnerable older, possibly wealthy people as a meal ticket.

Anne could well be cozying up to your mum for other reasons, you don't know anything about her. I would be having a conversation with her (your mum) about these dangers.
Finances are not for "friends" to deal with.

Ffs2 · 21/09/2017 18:01

Not everyone is a scam artist ! I'm at stay at home mum in my thirties and my neighbour is 84 years old. We are really good friends and I do lot for her and her daughters who are glad to have the help. I genuinely value my friendship with her and would NEVER take or expect anything from her other than the odd Christmas or birthday card.

YetAnotherNC2017 · 21/09/2017 18:02

Sadly I went through something like this.

A chap 35 years younger befriended my relative. All seemed nice, she trusted him etc.

When she died (at 83) he actually clubbed together with her estranged daughter to contest the will (which didn't leave either of them anything) and threatened he was going to take away my inheritance. He also used to drive past my house to see if I was in. Really creepy.

Be careful, there are some real scumbags around Sad

ThumbWitchesAbroad · 21/09/2017 18:04

This happened to my great aunt but it was her own daughter who fleeced her. There was a son as well, but he wasn't paying enough attention to what was happening, and before anyone realised what was going on, she'd had most of her mother's savings out of her bank account, because her mother had given her bank card over to her DD to get money for shopping etc. DD took the maximum out each time, bought about £20 of shopping for her mother then kept the rest.
Things got a lot worse before it was stopped, but my great aunt never really knew the worst of it, as she was bed bound, needed carers 4 times a day, was half blind and somewhat deaf; she never even realised when her DD moved her entire family into her home, as she couldn't leave her room and they only saw her once every couple of days, leaving the carers to do all the work.

AcrossthePond55 · 21/09/2017 18:07

If at all possible, set up online banking for your mum's accounts and monitor them daily. Chances are she'll never use online, but you'll be able to see her banking activity. Change the password frequently. When my DB took over our mum's finances that was the first thing he did. Taking over was at her request, she could have continued to do it for herself but she didn't want the 'bother' anymore. He set up online for his convenience for bill paying but then we realized that it was a good way to keep an eye out for scammers.

Mum (and many of her generation) are very trusting. One day I walked in to see a perfect stranger sitting in her living room and she was telling him every little thing! He said he was from a particular charity, but I had no way to verify that and he left shortly thereafter. A scammer calls or visits saying they're with a charity or giving a sob story or a 'listening ear' and the next thing you know that person is stealing from them. It has nothing to do with the beginnings of dementia or mental competency. Plenty of perfectly rational and competent people have been taken advantage of!!! Nigerian princes, anybody?

Remember, too, that as wonderful as we try to be with our parents, just about every parent as some type of 'complaint' about their children. We don't visit enough (even if we do), we don't do X or Y the way we should. An unscrupulous person can take advantage of that to worm their way in and alienate your parent.

AnnieOH1 · 21/09/2017 18:08

I'm sorry I've only read the first page but I need to get some real world things done. I recall as a family feeling very similar feelings towards about a lady who became friends with my gran. As it turned out my gran had been friends with this lady's mom going back decades. After my gran's friend died she became almost like a surrogate mom to her. Once a week they would go for a meal or get a take out, in my gran's final years she finally tried (and enjoyed) stuff like KFC because of this new friendship.

Yes we were dubious to begin with but everything was okay in the end.

kateryan · 21/09/2017 18:08

Yes I would approach it with my mum in such a way that I felt left out as these were things that allowed you to spend time together albeit sorting out shopping, finances, family matters etc. I would say that whilst I felt pleased she had found someone to spend some leisure time with the change in her relationship with me was making me feel sad and unwanted. Actually I would ask for our old relationship back on the same old footing. Explain you love her and miss those moments with her. I wish you much luck with this, and, yes I too would be very suspicious.

AcrossthePond55 · 21/09/2017 18:12

Ffs, there are good people like you and those of us who can't be around all the time thank you for your caring ways. Mum had a lovely neighbour who kept an eye on her until my brother moved in with her when he moved home from Mexico. But I'll bet that you are well known to the daughters and you make sure that they are aware of the things you do for their mum. AND that you would never involve yourself in your neighbour's finances without their express consent and knowledge.

impossible · 21/09/2017 18:13

I think you need to be as visible as possible and make sure Anne knows you are involved in your mum's life and keeping an eye on things. She may well be lovely but doing your mum's admin is rather worrying.

I think it's really important you meet Anne and find out who she is. Tell your mum you'd love to meet her friend and don't betray your suspicions or your mum may become defensive. You don't want to drive any sort of wedge between your mum and yourself.

Perhaps you could suggest you all have tea together or if you think that won't work turn up maybe on craft club day with cake (or something like). Ideally try to 'befriend' Anne yourself so she is forced to be transparent.

I wonder if you could also find a way to tell your mum you'd rather keep doing the admin and shopping - it makes you happy to help her and you appreciate the opportunity to look after her a little.

Good luck.

impossible · 21/09/2017 18:14

.. you could also perhaps arrange a small a celebration (your mum's birthday?) and invite Anne too.

NameChangeFamousFolk · 21/09/2017 18:19

A genuine, helping and honest person, in this situation, would not get involved in finances especially when there is family support available. They'd be too aware of that involvement backfiring on them I think, and possible accusations of defrauding due to misunderstandings

I've no direct experience of this OP, but I've read the comments and this comment ^^ resonated the most.

Good luck speaking with your mum.

diddl · 21/09/2017 18:20

"The worrying part for me is that you have asked Anne to leave the shopping and finances for you to handle, and she is refusing to step away from those jobs"

Yes, I agree with that.

And if Ops mum is concerned that Op hasn't the time to do what she did-why would she think that Anne has the time?

Jojofjo44 · 21/09/2017 18:26

I've not read the whole post. Has the OP spoken to her mother yet?

everythingsucks · 21/09/2017 18:35

I would be very wary of this. If she was that good and kind she would be aware that maybe she was overstepping boundaries and everything would be transparent.
My concerns would be she is going to set herself up as your mums power of attorney. Secondly I’d be concerned about a revision if her will.

The comment about your mums lovely house is odd. And whilst everyone is saying Your Mum is entitled to make these decisions for herself, if they based on a fraudulent and fake friendship, they aren’t then I would agree that you need to dig around.

FWIW cctv is unlikely to show anything unless it is such high quality you can read the documents. Does she do work on your mums computer? Could you have a look at the history and also check paperwork at the same time.

Your bug problem is going to be Your Mum feeling offended and protective towards her friend. And possibly embarrassed at the possibility that she may be being scammed. I think her behaviour is odd and scam artists rely on people not wanting to offend or backing off for fear of being impolite or seeming paranoid.

Can you call the organisers? Does she work for the club? Is it usual for them to start taking control of the elderly clients financial affairs?

She could be being a close and helpful friend without getting involved in her money. I would be exceptionally worried and suspicious.

Mustang27 · 21/09/2017 18:36

I worked in banking for many years and I grew quite fond of a customer who became very ill and she lived on my way home I noticed that her garden which was her pride and joy had become very overgrown so I mowed the lawn and weeded one weekend and dropped her in some wee bits I thought she would like. I had a quick brew and left. Her dd (who was a horror) complained and I was given a stern talking too I was so sad that my kindness was mistaken for something sinister. This lady was no where near wealthy but comfortable and I had no designs on her funds whatsoever I just wanted to be kind to a nice lady who’s family only seemed interested when the they were getting something. No kind deed goes unpunished.

LuluJakey1 · 21/09/2017 18:37

My mum's aunt had no children but had neices and nephews on her and her late husband's side of the family. She was quite wealthy (750,000+) A local woman who had a small financial business befriended her and began involving herself in all of her life, got a key to the house, began taking her to the bank, hospital etc. Her neices were close to her and quite alarmed by it. One of them happened to call in one afternoon and the aunt had her coat on and was waiting for the woman and a friend of the woman's to come to take her to the solicitor about her will and LPA . The aunt said she had felt a bit unsure but she thought the woman was a financial expert who knew what she was doing. Neice sent them away and told them if they came back she would ring the police.

Ffs2 · 21/09/2017 18:37

Acrossthepond55 thank you 😊 yes I make sure they are aware of the things I help out with it's sometimes hard to do without seeming like I'm expecting praise which I'm not but I do worry now as she has sadly been diagnosed with dementia I'm very wary about my role going forward x

LookingforMaryPoppins · 21/09/2017 18:38

I have no idea how to PM on here but would you share in a PM which area this is happening in? I am happy to explain more privately.

There are so many alarm bells with this. These people don't pounce immediately, they choose their victims carefully, people who own property and are seemingly wealthy who they think have no relatives/ relatives living away. They bide their time too. Even if Anne has done nothing wrong so far, that doesn't mean she won't in the future.

Find out from your mum whether Anne has "borrowed" any money from her. If you can check her bank statements that would be useful - if she isn't genuine you may find she has a new cash card sent out and visits at the time the postman arrives. Check there has been no equity release undertaken on the house, no new wills written etc.

I really hope this woman is genuine.... if she is she would understand the concern and woukdntbkeave herself so open.

It's a really tricky situation and I don't envy you.

everythingsucks · 21/09/2017 18:42

Penggown
*
I am power of attorney for an elderly relative.
He is totally competent and well however he wanted it set up early whilst he was competent.*

Don’t know why you think sorting out PofA would be laughed out if courtConfused

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