To think if a boy hits my daughter then yes it is different to if a girl does

[ouchthathurtsabit]

Preparing to be flamed as this is a controversial issue.

I'm a mum of a girl and 2 boys. My daughter came home with a red mark on her face saying that a boy- known for hurting others- had punched her in the face because she had gone in front of him in the queue. The boy was spoken to and it was dealt with. The children are 8 and in year 3.

So I spoke to the teacher and said I was glad it was dealt with and that I was sure my daughter would be fine but it would probably be helpful for this boy to know that it's unacceptable to hurt or hit anyone but that hitting a girl in the face is really not acceptable.

The teacher then had a massive rant at me saying that there is absolutely no difference and that's a very dangerous thing to be teaching children and it would not be an appropriate thing to say in school.

Whist I do understand what she was tryouts g to say, I do try and explain to my boys that In our society, no matter what age you are, if you hit a female then it is completely unacceptable and that no matter what a girl does or says to you then if you respond with physical violence then it's not acceptable. Males are generally bigger and stronger. Am I completely wrong in thinking at 8 years old this could be mentioned? Because I don't know! I know if one of my boys hit a girl in the face I would be a tiny bit more mortified than if it was a girl

We do all have different parenting styles I agree. I just find it very offensive that my way means I'm more likely to be bringing up a man who beats women up! It's disgusting.

So what is your solution to the violent male issue then??

Has someone actually directly said that to you on here Wavy or is that your interpretation of what people are saying?

I don't know. But I'm not having my son believe it's ok for him to be hit just because he's a boy. Perhaps the male on male violence happens for that very reason?

There are tons of posters on here who differ in opinion regard the severity of male violence. None of whom, not a single one, has said they or their child have grown up with the belief it is acceptable to hit or be hit by another boy. I don't know why this line keeps getting trotted out.

From a moral perspective, any hitting is wrong. One type of hitting is not 'better' than another. Of course not. I really don't think anyone is saying that (happy to be corrected).

From what I can gather catching up on the thread and what I agree with is that, male on female violence has different implications. The consequences for the victim, the perpetrator, the way the law is applied and for society as a whole is different.

To pretend otherwise is doing a great disservice to our boys who will grow into men. Some parents believe bringing greater awareness to these implications is a step in the right direction to reducing femicide and domestic abuse.

Recognizing the different implications for our actions, I believe, helps create an equal society. Pretending all actions have the same consequences does not.

I return to the armed robbery example. I am pretty sure nobody on here thinks it is acceptable to shoplift simply because they have been told doing it with a gun creates more harm for the victim or a longer prison sentence for the perpetrator? Why would it be any different for our sons?

None of whom, not a single one, has said they or their child have grown up with the belief it is acceptable to hit or be hit by another boy. I don't know why this line keeps getting trotted out.

There are some who have said it isn't as bad if a boy hits a boy.

Well like I said it has different, more serious implications as an adult. When do we start making men aware of this? I think the moral argument is slightly different to the reality. Morally most of us agree all hitting is wrong. Isn't it a bit naive to think the outcome will be the same in adulthood and do we, as parents, not have a duty of care to ensure our children understand this?

My Oh got punched in the face about 10 years ago by another man. Broke his nose and nearly killed him. No I'm not over exaggerating by the way.

The implications are very serious I agree, but I'm sorry I don't agree it makes it worse if the victim is a woman.

I don't think you're exaggerating and I'm sorry that happened to him.

Ok let me ask you this. Do you think in general terms, a woman is far more likely to be killed or seriously injured from male on female violence than other forms of violence? If not why do the statistics tell us otherwise?

And if the particular stigma of men abusing women is removed do you think violence overall will go down or do you think more women will get hurt?

I think it is a mistake to take on board that idea that we live in a non-violent society, or that the violence that takes place in our society is anomalous or abberation. Violence runs right through our society. "just don't hit" is like abstinence-only sex education for teenagers. You might feel a lot better if you think your teenagers just won't have sex, but this isn't how it works. You need to look at what sex / violence really are in our society in order to educate around them, manage ethics and risks

The idea that "we just don't hit" is one of those simplistic fictions of nursery, like the fact that all pre-school programmes are based on friendship and cooperation. We'd like our toddlers to curb their propensity for violence and develop their propensities for cooperation and friendship, and we use simplistic tools to put those messages across. but this is not the way society works and people who think it can be are just nursery school teachers getting high on their own supply

I don't dispute the statistics. Something has gone terribly wrong somewhere which meant the men turned out that way. But I think if someone is going to be violent towards anyone then they learn this growing up, whether that's from family or outside sources such as friends/films they've seen, etc... . It's up to us as parents to influence our children positively but I do honestly believe that we can achieve this with your way and my way. The lad who punched my oh was rough as anything and you knew he was taught to solve things with his fists. There is no hope for people like him.

As a side point, I am so sick of seeing memes on Facebook supposedly wrote by mums/dads of daughters threatening any boy that goes near their daughter. It makes me so mad.

but the point isn't getting through is it??

It is - violent crime rates have dropped sharply in the last 20 years, so somebody somewhere is doing something right.

Wavy I do agree with your last post. Especially about those Facebook memes aargh! That is encouraging male pattern violence and yes, they do have to learn non violent behaviour from family without a doubt. I agree with AntiGrinch though (glad you've braved it back here) that in simple terms it would be great if we could just give the message 'don't hit' but unfortunately society has specific problems which require targeted answers I believe.

There was one where the mum said she will destroy any boy who upsets her daughter. And another where the dad has a shot gun because his daughter is going on a first date.
Things like that just make me super protective over my ds! I know I'm probably over reacting, but when I see threads like this talking about how bad violence against women is (which it is!), and then you see things like that on social media promoting violence towards males and the many many comments from people laughing and agreeing with it, it does make me thing hang on a minute violence is not ok against our sons! I'm not having a go at you by the way I'm just having a rant..

*think

Agree with street

A few years ago my stepbrother (ish...late marriage and then divorce and not close) did jail time

He was outnumbered but did the attackers more damage than they managed to do to him

I had no problem with his actions as he was defending himself (judge obviously felt differently) but would certainly have judged him for starting something

I have a son too Wavy and that would disgust me too. That's blatantly promoting violence.

Well like I said it has different, more serious implications as an adult. When do we start making men aware of this? So do you think the woman I know who killed her husband was charged with a less serious offence than a man would have been? Try telling her children who were left with no parent, one in prison and one deal.

Yes, violence is violence but one day they will be adult and have to understand that just because one group survived ok from a punch (punching another guy) doesn't mean all of them will (women especially if they are pregnant) . They have to acknowledge their strengths

blueberry women need to understand that as well.

No granny but that's really not what's being said?? I don't want to repeat myself but if you read my posts again I hope they answer your question.

The teacher failed massively in her dealing of this event where a boy did punch a girl.....by not addressing the wider implications of male on female violence. That's all she had to do, consider the wider implications and an education that one day that boy will be a man and there will be a power imbalance, because that is the reality.

streetface if that isn't what is being said what does this mean Well like I said it has different, more serious implications as an adult. When do we start making men aware of this? So only men need to be aware? Like saying all hitting is bad but hitting a girl is worse. It all sounds a bit like Animal Farm to me, 4 legs good 2 legs better, all hitting bad hitting girls worse.

Sadly reading your posts give me no idea why you think it is worse to hit a girl. If you said hitting someone weaker/smaller/more vulnerable it would make more sense but even then I still believe zero tolerance to violence is clear unequivocal and to the point.

I have a son too Wavy and that would disgust me too. That's blatantly promoting violence.

I feel like saying to them "Well you'll have to get through me first to get to my kind, gentle boy!" But then I'd almost sound as bad as them.