To think you dont put a rapist in a woman's prison?

[bambambini]

Do women really not count here, has all common sense been ababdoned? How is this even possible?

www.cetusnews.com/news/Transgender-rapist-lag-‘put-in-segregation’-over-‘sexual-advances-to-female-prisoners-.BkeCnqnht-.html

The point was that this is a problem limited to prisons

The point is that this is just one example of female only spaces that are being 'claimed' by the Trans activists. It's symptomatic of a wider erosion of women's right to safety, whether that's in prison or in the wider community. You can't look at this in isolation imo.

What is scary is the attitude of the people that allowed it. How little regard would you have to have for the human rights of women to think that THIS is OK? And what does that mean for the rest of society when politicians or people in power whose responsibilities extend beyond prisons have okayed it?

"Personally I think that a transwoman should be sent to a male prison. Sure they might feel intimidated or scared and may even suffer abuse at the hands of their male inmates but imo the whole point of prison is that it should be a horrible experience. Perhaps if transwomen are harassed in prison then it might remind them to behave when they get out and put them off from reoffending. "

This sums up a lot of the attitudes on here to me. "Rape is a terrible thing that all women must be protected from by any means necessary. Unless its the rape of a trans person, in which case they deserved it by going to prison and by daring to be trans". Theres no mention of "maybe women should 'behave' so they avoid the risk of feeling intimidated or scared and may even suffer abuse at the hands of their inmates" I notice.

This sums up a lot of the attitudes on here to me.

Well I think your summing up is wonky.

Only one person has expressed that transpeople 'deserve to be raped' cos that'll learn 'em not to commit a crime. The rest of us seem to be of the opinion that nobody deserves to be raped, inside or outside prison. I guess that's why it's a bad idea to put a male sex offender with their fully functioning lady penis in a female prison.

And one person has said the same about women, so clearly there are horrible people on both sides.

bambambini

Oh I know aha totally agree it's bloody scary the way women's rights are being eroded and ignored in favour of men who can seemingly identify as a woman. It's fucking crazy.

No one should be raped or raping anyone else.

That exactly why a convicted male rapist should not be in s female jail and equally he should be protected from rape in a male jail.

His rights to call himself a woman are his rights. However his rights should not take precedent over anyone else's rights.

You have a cock you are a man she should be in a male jail.

And should be

The only possible solution is that a specialist prison is created for trans prisoners and all are catered for there.

That will immediately drop the number of male prisoners identifying because they perceive it as a route to special privileges in a male prison or a means to gain access to women. However it would likely be fiercely contested by biologically male transactivitists because often this is not about safety or freedom to live their identity, it's about wanting sex segregation so they get to be in biological women's spaces with biological women.

"Only one person has expressed that transpeople 'deserve to be raped' cos that'll learn 'em not to commit a crime. "

But none of you called them out on that comment, did you? They almost literally said "let 'em get raped, thatll teach them for not confirming" and no-one challenged them on it.

YANBU. And that prisoner isn't the first violent male to be sent to a women's prison, by a long shot. I started counting violent criminals who were being referred to a "female offenders", despite being fully intact males, at the beginning of this year, and I lost count sometime in spring.

Strom you are aware that the comment you quoted was made in reply to ALL THE FUCKING POSTS saying that prison was "supposed to be horrible" so who care about the WOMEN who are raped there by the MALES they are imprisoned with.

In short, I am pretty sure it was sarcasm.

And you have NO right whatsoever to complain, because YOU apparently are one of those who condone this whole idiocy that puts WOMEN at risk.

The difference between male on male rape (yes, male on transwoman is also male on male, because transwomen are male) and male on female rape is that we have an 100% safe way of preventing the latter. By, you know, just not giving males access to women.

Oh, and having caught up with the last few posts: nobody should be raped in jail. Male prisons can be incredibly brutal places where any kind of male, including gay and gendernonconforming me, can be assaulted, but the answer is changing the culture of male prisons and improving safety in them, not housing potentially vulnerable males in women's prisons. (Though I do wonder if a multiple rapist can be described as "vulnerable".)

Vestal you're correct re: Ferret's comment - the winking icon is there to indicate that it was meant ironically. I did have to scroll back to check though as I remembered the comment and thought Storm had a point.

I think it was in response to this comment:

"Anyway, prison should be a horrendous experience that nobody should be prepared to suffer from again once they are released, so frankly it doesn't bother me if a rapist is sent to a female prison, no more than it would bother me if a homosexual male rapist was sent to a male prison. If people are scared, intimidated, it might make them be more determined to stay out of jail in future."

Um, @StormTreader my post was a sarcastic response to ChelleDawg2020's post at 17:38:00.

Chelle said that she didn't think it was a big deal if transwomen went to womens prison and that perhaps if women there were intimidated, threatened or scared by them then it might put these women off re offending when they got out.

My post in reply to that was a taking the piss post to show how ridiculous she was being, hence the winking emoticon at the end. I'd imagine that's why nobody pulled me up on it; they knew I wasn't being serious and saw the post I was replying to.

I do find it interesting however that you picked out my post whilst ignoring Chelle's post before mine who said that women in prison deserve to be intimidated and scared by transwomen...

But none of you called them out on that comment, did you? They almost literally said "let 'em get raped, thatll teach them for not confirming" and no-one challenged them on it.

You mean like how you didn't call Chelle out when she said practically said that women deserved to get raped in prison because it will teach them a lesson?

Anyway, prison should be a horrendous experience that nobody should be prepared to suffer from again once they are released, so frankly it doesn't bother me if a rapist is sent to a female prison, no more than it would bother me if a homosexual male rapist was sent to a male prison. If people are scared, intimidated, it might make them be more determined to stay out of jail in future.

Good fucking god. Whoever wrote that is clearly unaware that:

• half of women in prison have experienced DV.
• just over half of women in prison were abused as children.
• a third of women in prison have spent time in local authority care as a child.

But yeah, let them be raped. That'll learn them! Just like their extensive experience of violence helped them keep out of jail so well!

BTW for whoever wrote that: women at present make up only 5% of the total prison population, and more than 80% of them are there for nonviolent offences. (In contrast, from what I can understand about the stats, about half of men in prison are there for violent and/or sexual offences.)

You mean like how you didn't call Chelle out when she said practically said that women deserved to get raped in prison because it will teach them a lesson?

Eh, that was only about lowly "cis" women, no one cares about those. I mean, they menstruate and all that, totally icky! Why would anyone care about their safety, let alone dignity or privacy?

Making them shower naked in front of males is totes okay, nevermind that we are living in a society where women are forbidden from showing even their breasts at a public beach because of "decency". All those rules only apply when men or saintly transwomen want them to.

It is not like those lowly "cis" women are entitled to have their own opinions on in front of who they want to be naked, or something.

(This was sarcasm. I add this so that the less intellectually gifted on here don't mistakenly think I am serious and thus on their side.)

Yanbu. Nothing else to add that hasn't already been said.

I didnt think I needed to speak up in favour of all the cis women not being raped please, mostly because a) its bloody obvious that everything possible should be done that they (and everyone else) should not be being raped by anyone ever, and b) everyone else on this thread was already doing a very fine job of loudly making that point.

My aim was to try and speak up for the people who seem to be being offered up for sacrifice through no fault of their own - genuine trans male-to-female people who are in prison for non-violent crimes and who have no interest or intent in raping anyone, they just want to be left to do their time and leave, like everyone else.

Im also slightly bemused by the message that seems to be coming across of "if they have or have ever had a penis, they will rape, if they have never had a penis they are utterly safe and friendly to be around". My limited understanding of womens prisons is that they are certainly not a place where assault and violence never happens, and that sexual assault is very possible without the perpetrator owning a penis.
It should be possible to put in safeguards that minimise the chance of ANYONE being raped by ANYONE, putting trans people in prison didnt cause this risk for the first time, removing them from prison wont solve it for ever.

I didnt think I needed to speak up in favour of all the cis women not being raped

So you knew I wasn't being serious when I said transwomen should be intimidated in prison and it was a parody of another post yet you still decided to call me out anyway?

Right-o then.

That's 'cis' surely?

My aim was to try and speak up for the people who seem to be being offered up for sacrifice through no fault of their own - genuine trans male-to-female people who are in prison for non-violent crimes and who have no interest or intent in raping anyone, they just want to be left to do their time and leave, like everyone else.

Two points, Storm.

1. males of all types are vulnerable to rape in men's prisons, including gay men. Should all of those be transferred to women's prisons?

2. this thread is about a multiple rapist who is being referred to as a "woman" in the press, and treated as a woman by the authorities. Do you have any idea just how many trans-identified fully-intact males who have committed very violent crimes, including rape and murder, are currently claiming to be women, and so should be housed in women's prisons? It's a surprising amount. If we say yes to even a tiny proportion of them, not only will women be at risk of rape from these males, so will the nonviolent transwomen you are so keen to champion.

The best option is both to clean up male prisons so nobody is at risk from rape, and in the meantime keep gender nonconforming male prisoners in their own wing, if those gender nonconforming male prisoners wish it.

Thankfully we have a women only waiting room at our underground station which also contains the female loos (and a gender neutral one). I have often turfed men out of the women's only one. They usually go quietly.

And anyway, even in this case:

a genuine trans male-to-female people who are in prison for non-violent crimes and who have no interest or intent in raping anyone, they just want to be left to do their time and leave, like everyone else

..these males should not be housed in a women's prison. Prison is necessarily a very intimate place. Women prisoners, who as I pointed out above, already have a very high likelihood of having suffered previous male violence and abuse, should not be forced to be locked in a cell with someone who has a penis, however "nice" they are.