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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

AIBU - to feel unsupported in my feminist beliefs in the playground

459 replies

Goldiloz · 28/08/2017 21:46

I feel like this is the straw that broke the camels back.
I don't understand why mothers aren't supporting women's rights at primary school. Surely most sane people think that girls should be given the same opportunities as boys. We shouldn't pigeon hole 50% of the population just because they will grow up to have boobs and maybe pop out a kid or two. I feel like I am fighting a losing battle listening to some of the other mums in the playground.
It ranges from presents at birthday parties. The 'norm' seems to be buying girls creative/pink stuff unless they are a 'Tom boy' when they can get 'boy' stuff instead. And boys are only given sports and superhero stuff.
And party bags! Separate ones for boys and girls????
I just don't understand why women fail to see the issue with this and continue to justify it with generalised comments about 'most boys' and 'most girls'.
AIBU to expect more from modern women?

OP posts:
StillDrivingMeBonkers · 28/08/2017 22:22

@shiver - you really shouldn't play to urban myths- I cant find that the DM has ever used the word. But you keep on believing and projecting your own thoughts.

Shamoo · 28/08/2017 22:23

Why on earth would anybody possibly consider it necessary (or appropriate) to produce gender specific party bags?! Is that actually a thing!?

WorraLiberty · 28/08/2017 22:24

maybe pop out a kid or two

And you have the front to criticise others, OP?

Not that you've bothered returning to your thread, but I thought I'd put that out there anyway.

Flyingflipflop · 28/08/2017 22:24

Isn't treating all people the same the key to what feminism is about?

From what I gather from the feminism board, it's nothing to do with treating people equally.

Fruitcorner123 · 28/08/2017 22:25

whenyouseeit My very articulate god daughter aged 6 told me she wished she could be a boy because girls couldnt be 'team leaders'.4

I wonder iff maybe its the OPs examples which are trivial. If she had given your example I would have agreed but she used party bags and presents as examples of why girls and boys still don't have the same opportunities.

I am a teacher, my mum and my closest friend are teachers. My daughter (who is 4) said once that ladies work in schools and men go to work. I was horrified and made it clear to her that she could work wherever she wanted! It was a misunderstanding based on her small experience of the world but I can see how easy it is to reinforce these kinds of stereotypes without meaning to. I don't think craft toys and my little ponies are the problem though. My daughter doesn't play with these things just because someone expects it of her she plays with what she likes( which is sometimes cars and football but can also be kitchens and dolls)

SmileEachDay · 28/08/2017 22:25

Jesus. What IS that FemMom?

Gender "norms" are becoming less and less flexible IMO. It's a regressive picture.

Pigface1 · 28/08/2017 22:25

I'm with you OP.

Amazing the vitriol that's been spouted at you for making these observations. Proves the point in a way. I particularly enjoyed the post which called you a feminazi and said you should just let people be who they are.

Which, I think, was the EXACT point you were making.

Oswin · 28/08/2017 22:26

Oh flying what's your interpretation of feminism?

UnicornQueen · 28/08/2017 22:26

I have never in my life read the Daily Mail @Shiver.. It is just a word used by several of us in a mixed group im in elsewhere. A group where lots of us as sick of bitch litre feminists shoving their opinions down everyone's throats as though they are the 2nd coming of Christ. (not saying that is the case here BTW, just explaining where the word originated for me)

StorminaBcup · 28/08/2017 22:26

Of course it's not an issue for fathers. Do you really think the majority of men spend a microsecond analysing childrens' party bags?

So why do women? Kids don't care what's in their party bags. Cake? Good. Sweets? Good. Balloon? Bonus.

I'd have to have a serious word with myself if I ever agonised over a party bag Grin

WhooooAmI24601 · 28/08/2017 22:27

I also blame the shops for dividing the toys so you feel you're buying a boys or a girls toy as well as the toy makers for their God awful packaging.

I don't buy this. We have two boys, 11 and 6. From the moment they were old enough to prance about shops and look at stuff they've always just loved the stuff they've loved. They've had tea sets, kitchens, ironing board, hoovers, dolls, pushchairs and my little ponies. They've had scooters, hot wheels and lego, too. As a parent you can absolutely teach your DCs it's fine to like whatever they like without it needing to come down to gender; you simply say "alright mate, we can put a dolly on your christmas list this year" and that's that.

I genuinely think parents shout about 'gendered packaging' as though it prevents them buying a boy a doll. Mine didn't give a shit about packaging when they were small, they either liked the toy or they didn't. The same applies to clothing; they either like it or they don't. As they get older their peers will influence their choices but from 0-about 6/7/8 parents can absolutely teach their DCs to embrace whatever it is they like.

Gemini69 · 28/08/2017 22:27

I couldn't care less tbh .... I give my kids what they want.... green blue yellow pink whatever...

shivermytimbers · 28/08/2017 22:27

www.dailymail.co.uk/debate/article-3249777/PLATELL-S-PEOPLE-Feminazis-never-stop-men-men.html
Here you go Stilldriving. An article by the lovely Amanda Platell entitled "Feminazis will never stop men being men"
You're welcome Grin

stolemyusername · 28/08/2017 22:27

Christ you're pathetic. You are exactly the type of parent I actively avoid, and unfortunately for your child I would probably not be inviting them to my child's birthday party to avoid giving you chance to try and force your bike down my throat.

Your comment about 'maybe pop out a kid or 2', you so realise that that's what we're supposed to do, you know, so the human race doesn't die out.

And finally, for such a militant feminist, why are you only blaming the school mums? Why are the dads not subjected to you spouting off?

UnicornQueen · 28/08/2017 22:27

Oh ffs autocorrect is on a roll today *bitchy little not bitch litre 🙄

Zhx3 · 28/08/2017 22:28

I think you're getting a bit of a hard time, OP. I don't like the whole gendered party bags thing either - never did it at my own dc parties, everyone got the same bag, nothing overtly "boy" or "girl" in them. I think most parents don't like being lectured to on how they raise their children, so I'd probably not say anything in the playground, and smile and accept graciously when my dc are given gendered party bags.

I remember one mum making a really judgemental comment very early on, about us having a nanny when I returned to work. Judgement all on me, not my dh. Despite the fact it was years ago, I remember how she made me feel, so school runs tend to be quick and diplomatic for me now!

Threenme · 28/08/2017 22:28

No honey I don't think so. I don't identify as a femanist because to be honest I've never experienced been hard done to because I'm a woman. When the BBC pay was announced I found it ridiculous so maybe in that sense you could say I am. But to me it is ppl like the OP that give PPL who say stuff like feminazi ammunition. Making problems when their is none. Pay gap- problem. Someone giving boys and girls separate party bags- not a huge issue. Let's be honest most kids prefer that with no guidance or prompting.

SocksRock · 28/08/2017 22:28

I happily would call myself a feminist. Probably even towards the radical end. However, in the playground I'm usually either trying to get to work or trying to remember what I forgot to do at work while simultaneously trying to make sure I have the correct number of children. I sure as shit don't have time to stand around discussing this in the playground and I wouldn't take too kindly to anyone trying to talk to me about it.

Railworker · 28/08/2017 22:28

Wow some of these comments are nasty. This is a massively over-gendered world we're bringing our kids into and there is no need for it. Happy that your daughters will be paid less than a man for the same job the way things stand? Then carry on ignoring the evidence of what is happening in your daughters early life to encourage her to think that she isn't as good as a boy and needs to stick to her perfectly prescribed pink world. Geez.

JigglyTuff · 28/08/2017 22:29

And as you can see OP, the idiocy extends out of the playground and into MN. Most people don't think there's anything wrong with gendered toys, happily trot out gendered stereotypes about children and think it's all innate and natural.

I have sadly come to the conclusion that a lot of people don't want to think about stuff like this because it's hard work

VestalVirgin · 28/08/2017 22:29

I wonder iff maybe its the OPs examples which are trivial. If she had given your example I would have agreed but she used party bags and presents as examples of why girls and boys still don't have the same opportunities.

Uh ... what?

Do you honestly not see how the party bags reinforce the same stereeotypes that make girls believe they can't be leaders?

Seriously. Sexist party bags. Who needs that kind of thing, anyway? If you have to give the same gifts to all guests of a birthday party, make it something with broader appeal.

Fruitcorner123 · 28/08/2017 22:29

Of course it's not an issue for fathers. Do you really think the majority of men spend a microsecond analysing childrens' party bags? They would chuck in a balloon, a bag of sweets and a bit of cake and call it done.

bit of gender stereotyping there.

busyboysmum · 28/08/2017 22:29

Equating a movement that is about trying to free women and girls from oppression with a party who were responsible for genocide is a) ridiculous and b) offensive.

Agree. Feminazi is a ridiculous term.

And I agree that the pink v blue thing has never been so prevelant. You can really notice it if you go to a kids car boot sale. The girls stalls are a sea of pink. The boys stalls lots of colours. I don't remember having much pink stuff when I was growing up. And being a feminist was the sensible choice for a girl back then.

Tomorrowillbeachicken · 28/08/2017 22:30

Yikes, I'd move away from you so fast you'd see smoke.

Oswin · 28/08/2017 22:30

Fruitcorner the thing is it all starts with toys and clothes. From birth girls are put in clothes to look pretty. Given baby's and pushed into this role.
Before they can even choose.
People find out what the sex of the child is at 20 weeks and go and paint the room pink.

Parents force gender roles onto children before they are even born and toys are a massive part of that.

Girls toys are all about mothering and being pretty. Boys fighting and being leaders. It will obviously have a massive effect on children.