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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

AIBU - to feel unsupported in my feminist beliefs in the playground

459 replies

Goldiloz · 28/08/2017 21:46

I feel like this is the straw that broke the camels back.
I don't understand why mothers aren't supporting women's rights at primary school. Surely most sane people think that girls should be given the same opportunities as boys. We shouldn't pigeon hole 50% of the population just because they will grow up to have boobs and maybe pop out a kid or two. I feel like I am fighting a losing battle listening to some of the other mums in the playground.
It ranges from presents at birthday parties. The 'norm' seems to be buying girls creative/pink stuff unless they are a 'Tom boy' when they can get 'boy' stuff instead. And boys are only given sports and superhero stuff.
And party bags! Separate ones for boys and girls????
I just don't understand why women fail to see the issue with this and continue to justify it with generalised comments about 'most boys' and 'most girls'.
AIBU to expect more from modern women?

OP posts:
Oswin · 28/08/2017 23:19

Why do people get so defensive about this. It's not a personal attack on your parenting you know.
Dd has a bright pink bedroom. I have worked hard to not enforce any roles on her. I don't push a preference for pink or blue. I don't say pinks bad.

She loved fireman sam and thomas the tank and blue and green clothes till age 4 when she started nursery.
Then it's all pink and princesses. Now she's found her own personality.
She likes football and Disney films. She is constantly in trainers. But is always painting our nails. She is very interested in artistic make up and is hoping to be a make up artist.
I can not deny that she will have had red forced onto her by me and society.
I can admit that and it doesn't make me a bad person just human.

When feminists try Talk about the conditioning of girls we are not attacking you as parents. We are trying to help your children.
Why so much hate?

Dustbunny1900 · 28/08/2017 23:20

Salt, that's Shock. I had no idea. Wtaf.

As for the op, the gift bags may sound petty and inoffensive but it's the bigger picture of rigid gender norms that's the issue. I get that. I also think people automatically think anything aimed at females is lower and lesser and that's another problem.

Headofthehive55 · 28/08/2017 23:25

When you have more than one girl (I have three) you see things more in terms of individual likes rather than "girls things" because they are so very different as people.

Girls things has no meaning in my house as its nonsensical.

Fruitcorner123 · 28/08/2017 23:28

This thread makes me feel talked down to because I disagree with the original OP. I am a feminist but feel that some of the 'feminisim' coming out of this thread including the wording of the OP is actually more about criticising and patronising women who hold a different view.

So should all women be equal or only the ones who hate girly presents at parties? What about the ones who are not intelligent or who don't have a successful career? Calling into question the intelligence of a woman who holds a different view to you isn't actually feminism in my book

LassWiTheDelicateAir · 28/08/2017 23:29

Why are you in the playground doing the pick up?

That was my thought. I'm not sure I ever did a school pick up- sports day possibly.

They would chuck in a balloon, a bag of sweets and a bit of cake and call it done

Well as any sane person would- might add a pen or crayons or novelty eraser.

minipie · 28/08/2017 23:29

YANBU OP, but you're fighting against the tide as this thread shows.

I don't think you will get very far trying to convert the playground mums. I settle for challenging sexist statements - my DDs are quite stereotypically boyish in many ways (loud, physical, love things with wheels etc) so I can usually use them to illustrate the point

powershowerforanhour · 28/08/2017 23:30

Societal change has to happen at an individual level.
YANBU to expect more from modern women.
Whilst other people might be recoiling away from the despicable feminazi, I'll be holding out my hand saying, hi, nice to meet someone else who wants to live in a multicoloured world not a twotone blue and pink world.

For all the parents saying "My boys had dolls and pushchairs"...why the past tense, do you think? Just because you didn't snatch it out of his hands roaring "NO SON OF MINE WILL BE A GAY" doesn't mean that he eventually learned to despise "girl" things solely from other children and therefore indirectly from other Neanderthal parents. Gender stereotyping is more subtle than that. Just a lot of little drips that make an ocean.

TatianaLarina · 28/08/2017 23:34

Fuck all to do with having a different view fruitcorner, an informed view is the point.

Can't think of anything more dull (or unlikely) than everyone agreeing.

my2bundles · 28/08/2017 23:35

Past tense because my son outgrew playing with toys, not just dolls but all toys

Headofthehive55 · 28/08/2017 23:35

I do get quite annoyed by the people attempting to be superior because they don't like "girly" presents so are therefore "better".
There is an awful lot of boring "boys toys".

Ttbb · 28/08/2017 23:36

How are sporty vs creative presents unequal? Equality =/= equity.

liminality · 28/08/2017 23:39

We are who we are. Instead of getting your feminazi knickers in a twist why don't you just let people be who they actually are, why not let them enjoy the things they enjoy, what ever colour those things may be..
Not everyone wants to follow your gender fluid toy rule.. Or force our children to go against their own choices and only be allowed to receive gender fluid gifts.. Contrary to belief (your beliefs!) children are perfectly capable of deciding for themselves what they like and enjoy. They don't need us telling them what to like simply because it fits in with our (your!) feminazi beliefs.

I am sure this little boy made all his own decisions about his masculinity. No influence from his family there.

Headofthehive55 · 28/08/2017 23:39

I can't see a stereotype of a girl though. It's impossible to define.

Oswin · 28/08/2017 23:40

My aim is not to make pink toys something to be looked down upon.
My aim is to make sure that it is not pushed upon young girls. We cannot deny it is.
It shapes our society how girls are treated as children.

Mittens1969 · 28/08/2017 23:43

So many girls are into pink, frilly dresses these days. My 2 DDs are real 'girly girls' and it isn't because of me at all, I'm into jeans and tops and don't particularly wear make-up. They love wearing princess dresses!!

If that's what they like, that's the way it is. They'll grow out of it, no doubt. And if not, it doesn't matter. They're fascinated by DH's job, he's a civil engineer.

What annoys me is comments like 'doesn't your DH wish he had a boy to play trains with?' Why can't he play trains with his girls??

Fruitcorner123 · 28/08/2017 23:44

The pushchair is not meant for his age and he is too tall for it now He does still sometimes play with the dolls. He is very attached to his first doll.

I do agree that gender stereotyping exists but believe we have huge power as parents to ensure our children are given opportunities based on their skills and interests not on their gender. Schools and pre schools must do more, the media are to blame too. I don't agree that school mums are to blame and think some of the comments on this thread about school mums are sexist and stereotyping.

Slimthistime · 28/08/2017 23:45

Yanbu

Headofthehive55 · 28/08/2017 23:46

I think it's a bit like reading your horoscope. You on,y see what you want to see.
dD3 will largely only wear dresses. Flouncy. Sparkly.ooooh girly. Must have conditioned her to like those. Because you see the clothing. Look deeper though and you see a person who spends most of her time programming and Lego. Not so girly now then?

Oswin · 28/08/2017 23:47

Of course parents are to blame as well. The whole of society is.

Lots of parents will only give children toys that enforces the gender roles.
So boys are not allowed dolls girls not allowed cars.
This is not a tiny minority.

NoToast · 28/08/2017 23:49

YANBU OP, gender stereotyping and training is insidious. Primary school is a point where children become more aware of society's norms at the same time where it's reinforced by many parents and other children. DD often talks about toys that are boys toys, things boys can do that girls can't, etc. All these messages come from the culture she's immersed in not her home life.

LassWiTheDelicateAir · 28/08/2017 23:49

Oswin
My aim is not to make pink toys something to be looked down upon.
My aim is to make sure that it is not pushed upon young girls. We cannot deny it is
It shapes our society how girls are treated as children

That is true- what gets people's backs up ( ok mine) is the bit about aiming not to make pink toys something to be looked down upon is often missed out.

Fruitcorner123 · 28/08/2017 23:52

Its specifically the 'mums at the school gate' that are getting blamed though. As though they are a certain breed of parent. As though working parents who use a nanny or after school club wouldn't do this kind of thing. That is not my experience at all either as a teacher or a parent ( who is at the school gate on the days I don't work)

Fruitcorner123 · 28/08/2017 23:54

notoast if my DD comes home from school referring to things boys can do that girls can't I will be having a word with the school! That's very sad.

Headofthehive55 · 28/08/2017 23:54

oswin
I think you have to listen carefully to children and not dictate too much.
I suffered with the early days of "women into science and engineering" and ended up being heavily persuaded to do a STEM subject at uni that I didn't like.

Tomorrowillbeachicken · 28/08/2017 23:59

Tbh my son never did the whole this is a boy toy and this is a girls toy etc until he started school nursery. While he was at home they were just toys.

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