.. To be furious at DH's ex Wife?

[SSDGM]

DH split up with the mother of his kids years before he met me. In fact he had another 10 year long relationship in between us. Now their youngest DD is 19 and in employment the time has come to sell the house (or her to buy him out) as agreed. However she's changed her mind and is pleading poverty. She's ignored solicitors letters and mediation requests or left any correspondence to the last minute and has said she's about to be out of a job due to illness. DH has had enough and has instructed solicitors that Mediation will not work and to go straight to court. She now wants him to just sign it all over to her and walk away.
I'm fuming because I have 2 now adult DS's from my first marriage and after their father and I split I made a point to ramp up my career to look after us all where she has just ignored the passing of time and can't now cope without the maintenance and tax credits she got before her DS/ my DSD was of age. I have a little nest egg put away for a house deposit and earn a decent salary. She has now said she will come after MY money and she will be given the house they shared by the courts because she's poorer than I am.
DH is self employed and earns less than I do.

AIBU to want to get involved? How dare she sit on her arse working part time for years after the kids were old enough to take care of themselves and then piss and moan it's unfair that we have a nice life and should give her everything. I've always been nice to her to keep the peace, but I'm losing patience. Why can't she just bugger off?

If your DH can be persuaded to pay for everything then the house is paid off and all in her name, regardless of what happens with her boyfriend. Remember, boyfriend didn't move in until it wouldn't affect tax credits. If he re-mortgages or helps her out then he's going to want to have his name on the deeds as well, and if they were that close then they would have lived together regardless.

I don't blame her. We see it on Mumsnet all the time when a second boyfriend erodes financial gains from the first marriage. In some ways she could be protecting her kids inheritance and making sure that no-one else has a claim to the house after she (and your DH) have gone.

Sending you good vibes.

Regarding the loan, again, until we get the SAR from the lenders due to her reluctance to give any info we don't know anything.

I've read him the riot act once more tonight about it and don't intend to have to boot him up the arse again. We have a written plan of our next steps which he can follow when he is home (his business takes him overseas a lot).

she gets a lump sum that she could never dream to save up without the sale,

Like we all would if we sold our houses, you mean?

It's her HOUSE. Bought jointly with her HUSBAND. As a FAMILY HOME. You do understand all of this, don't you? She's an actual PERSON who OWNS half the house (at least).

I only ask because you seem to view her as a random squatter and charity case.

Why are you being so shitty towards me? I already said that situation isn't going to happen. She also had an AGREEMENT with the man who she BOUGHT the house with that it would be SOLD when their daughter reached EIGHTEEN. It's not my FAULT she's RESCINDED on her AGREEMENT but clearly I'm an ARSEHOLE for expecting an ADULT to behave like one.

And I don't think she's a charity case. She holds all the cards here. She has another home she has been spending 50% of her time in until now. I have a rented house.

I don't think you can see how weird you're being. There's just so much wrong with saying;

As a reasonable person I believe the easiest outcome in all of this would be for the house to go up for sale, even if she kept every single penny of the proceeds. His name off the mortgage, she gets a lump sum that she could never dream to save up without the sale, she has a long term partner who's property she can move into and DH and I get to start afresh.

But clearly you can't see it.

We've all tried to help and made lots of constructive suggestions but the way you're discussing this woman continues to be quite unpleasant.

Should I just think she's lovely then and ignore what she is doing? I don't understand how you think my dislike of her is unjustified. I've been around her for 4 years ish, as long as I've had contact with my now step daughters. I've been nice. Done her favours, smiled sweetly and celebrated with her at the oldest ones wedding. Took the girls out for shopping. Took her daughter to the passport office as a favour so she wouldn't miss her holiday when her passport had expired. Sent her a Christmas card and never commented when we didn't get one back etc etc. I would like to think I've been as nice as possible and she disregards all that and tells my husband she's going to not only ignore the agreement that they made but is also going to rinse me just because she can.

I didn't steal her husband. I have no dog in this fight. I could understand if I'd been some terrible other woman but I wasn't.

In all the time your DH has spent telling you all the details of his ex's life- her thoughts health plans etc - he could be pursuing a Consent Order. You can go on and on and on about things if you like - still doesn't change the fact that a Court Order would resolve this, your man hasn't sorted it, and you need to confront him as to why. Even if every woman on this thread agreed with you that yes she is horrid, whatever.....it still doesn't change that fact does it? Yes if all agreed you'd have the satisfaction of reading a thread full or derogatory comments about her...and? What use it that? You've had some good advice on here regarding what could be done - advice that your DH could have got esewhere for himself actually if he'd bothered to ,- yet you still kept banging on and thats likely why tone of thread changed. Tell your DH to stop talking about his ex, and start doing what he is supposed to be doing..

There is no point in our going back over who made the mistake. The problem is like loads and loads of people your husband probably thought the verbal or written agreement he had with her was like a court consent order/financial order and why should he not assume that? Also like a lot of men (and some women) he probably wanted his children to grow up in a nice owned family home so did not push things to court.

So if we all try to see the best in people, well done him. Now we are where we are and not surprisingly the ex wife is dragging her feet. If the sum to pay off the existing loan is only £3k that could be cleared early and the loan paid off to free the husband to buy again and he will want some capital from the house so we need to find out what capital if any the ex wife is proposing to give the husband on a final divorce. if she thinks she might get 100% of it or just to be difficult she might well do nothing so your partner will have to push it to court ideally without lawyers otherwise too much money will go on that.

I would not wait until the end of the mortgage term. I would get on with things now - he should try to do it in writing. Presumably she cannot afford any kind of mortgage and has no capital so is going to have to sell the house unless she does some kind of equity release scheme for the over 50s. So he shoudl write to her givnig her 7 days to respond repeating his earlier offer and saying after that he will apply to court for a financial order on the divorec (he needs to check very carefully at home that he does not already have one). Then it proceeds - both sides disclose all their finances on a form E, initial court hearing on it attempt to settle and then final court hearing.

If she has paid the mortgage for most of the time and given she earns a lot less it is very likely she will get more than 50%. My ex who earned less wanted half assets plus maintenance for life (he worked full time but earned a lot less than I do). We compromised by him getting more than 50% and by agreeing I would solely pay for the children.

*But the main thing is:
The ExW has agreed to remove My H from everything but we will have to pay all costs and walk away with nothing. She will not budge from this stance. *

Well, that's progress. Now the bank just has to agree.

I I was just upset with the fact people seem to think she's the injured party here and it's the primary fault of my husband. He's not perfect, but he's not selfish.

I don't think this is an "injured party" situation, tbh. The XW has looked after her own interests and those of their children, possibly to the best of her ability, and your DH has been content to let the situation rumble along, not realising the implications of his inactivity.

Just an all-round cock-up, imo.

You can't just agree to remove from everything though can you unless the lender agrees? So I suppose if the only sum remaining on the mortgage is £3k then that can be paid off and then solicitors remove the husband from the house deeds BUT although that allows the couple to buy a new home together - the main aim - it leaves the divorce finances unsettled. It would be much better for both sides to get finality at the same time eg concede the ex wife gets all the equity in the house in return for no maintenance claims and no claims on his pension for example otherwise she may be tapping on the door in 5 years time asking for more money. Or that she agrees to sell the house and pay out some of the cash or she pays a bit of cash to be the 100% owner raising it from her family.

If instead they just do the repayment of mortgage and removal of ghusband from deeds there is no divorce finances finality. Indeed later she might come after the husband for his equity in the new house even .

Nor do I Lakey. There are three people who are responsible for OP and DH finding themselves in this scenario. And there's a certain amount of minimising going on by OP, dismissing this as understandable from someone who doesn't have legal training, when we're talking about a man who can't even identify the endowment provider ffs.

Look, fuck all the taking DSD to the passport office yada yada OP. It's a waste of headspace. XW has said she's happy to get DH off the mortgage provided you waive all claim and pay the costs, which is what you said you wanted anyway and you were going to end up with fuck all and a bigger bill if he challenged it. That's great. Saves you and him from the consequences of a series of poor decisions. Happy days. Now you start thinking about how that becomes a reality.

Yes, whatever is agreed in the end needs to be properly agreed, signed, sealed, and approved by the court with the magic words "full & final settlement" etc. You don't want her coming after his pension or anything in a few years time.

I have a friend who is finally getting round to applying for a pension sharing order about 20 years after she split from her ex.

Yes, Senator. There's no way I'd leave an ex with a mortgage in my name and not even ask the bank to send me statements so I knew they were making the repayments.

If it looks like there's going to be a big shortfall on that mortgage, I suppose the only way to sort it will be to sell the house. If I was the H I'd be making damn sure there were no assets in my name in case the bank came after me for the money before the sale went through.

I've no idea what a bank does if the mortgage isn't redeemed at the end of the term. Being a smartarse, I've always felt endowments were dodgy, even back in 1982 when I bought my first house and they were considered a fantastic idea.

Don't forget if he transfers the house to her there may be stamp duty land tax to pay.
Not sure of the exact rules in this situation but it usually applies except between husband and wife, so it will probably be payable. By her, technically.

The house is worth 90k which is well below the stamp duty threshold.

Assuming they are divorced then I agree on SDLT but there is none if there is no mortgage so the best sequence of events here is consent order sealed by court after agreement between couple, husband (or ex wife) pays off the £3k still owing on the mortgage and only then transfer of property (or may be the property will be sold to split the proceeds).

Surely you can see that from XW's point of view, getting her boyfriend involved - financially - would be an unwise move?

Say she just needed the £4K deposit to buy your husband out and her boyfriend offered her that, genuinely no strings attached and she was certain it wouldn't affect the balance of their relationship or ever be thrown back her. Happy days!

Except... it isn't just about £4K, she also needs to be approved to remortgage in her sole name. So actually, that's not a magic solution. If it was just about finding £4K then your husband could give that up and all is done.

Her remortgaging jointly with her boyfriend to be approved?

Imagine the MN advice, in this situation. I'll summarise the responses for you: HELL NO.

He's her boyfriend. She has no security of that relationship no longer how long they've been together. She'd be swapping potentially owning* all the house, for boyfriend having a legally defined share.

*she sounds like she has a great case for the majority or all of it vs your husband based on what she herself has actually paid, her earnings, and potential, her position back then as primary carer, the balance with his other assets such as his pension, and yes - the fact that he is married to you and therefore your presence, if not your actual £savings - would be considered when looking at his financial needs.

Her boyfriend would get hit for 3% SDLT potentially depending how they did it - just a joint remortgage, I believe he'd get hit.

There's every possibility that he wouldn't be able to jointly remortgage with her - because he has his own mortgage. Ditto guarantor.

What if he gifted a larger amount of money to allow her a smaller mortgage that she could be approved for? Well, firstly they're not married so he'd be a fool to do that! And if it was loaned, he'd want a charge on the house. But he'd have the third charge (mortgage, secured loan, him) and the mortgage company can refuse that.
Plus, even if he had a loan with a charge - if it went tits up then that's him into paying solicitors and forcing a sale!

There are just a few of the reasons where instead of complaining that her boyfriend should get involved, you should understand that from both their points of view, it really is better if he doesn't.

Btw: with regards to the value of boyfriend buying into the XW's mortgage - SDLT has no lower limit for second homes

INFP - indeed, you're right. Where on earth can you buy a house for £90k!!

(no need to answer, I don't really want to know, it just never occurred to me that this was possible)

Loads of places outside the south east! Sometimes they're even cheaper than 90k.

OutToGetYou All the houses on our street are around that price.

Btw: with regards to the value of boyfriend buying into the XW's mortgage - SDLT has no lower limit for second homes

Not if the new home replaces the main residency. If the boyfriend is renting out his other home then that becomes the one liable for SDLT. But since he already owns it, it doesn't apply.

There are lots of ways the ex wife an with her new boyfriend buy out the ex husband and that may well be the solution and if that leaves the new boyfriend in a mess so what - not our issue on this side of the fence.

(The house my mother's mother rented in the NE sells for £50k today by the way!)